***Official*** West Indies in New Zealand

[Blaze]

Chris Martin - had another poor season for Auckland. He's Paul Wiseman's twin for me.
Hamish Marshall - he's not an opener, don't care if he's batted three. He isn't an opener. What's happened to Papps and Cumming?
Peter Fulton - how can he be selected over Vincent? How?
Kyle Mills - he isn't a test bowler! Just look at his stats! Averages 91 with the ball!

I honestly can't quite believe this squad.

Chris Martin - I agree

Hamish Marshall - Neither was Justin Langer or many other successful openers before they made the switch. I say we reserve judgement until we see how he goes.

Peter Fulton - I don't think he is up against Vincent. Vincent clearly wants to bat in the middle order whereas Fulton will be batting 3. The only real competition for Fulton is Sinclair and H Marshall

Kyle Mills - I can't see many other alternatives.

 

[marc71178]

I respect him so much for saying no to opening

I always respect a player doing what is asked of him, not trying to dictate terms (as this appears to be)

 

[_Ed_]

I always respect a player doing what is asked of him, not trying to dictate terms (as this appears to be)

In a way yes, but he is just so uncomfortable opening that he can't really perform the job asked of him in that position. He probably thought that by refusing to open, either getting a middle order spot or being left out altogether were both preferable to being in a position at which he can't perform.

 

[Macka]

I respect him so much for saying no to opening

Definitely. Good on Vincent for telling the selectors he's not an opener. About time someone did. My immediate reaction about Vincent being left out was anger... I take this stuff way too seriously

 

[Tim]

Vincent is not a test opener. He is the one having to bat. If he thinks he is better off down the order then thats up to him.

Im not going to criticise him for making an honest opinion. Some players will bat anywhere to get into the side, but at the end of the day are they going to do a good job?

Peter Fulton had to be in the side. You cannot ignore his FC average. He will good for us in ODI's, but clearly he enjoys batting for longer periods in 4 day cricket.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

The saddest part for New Zealand is they could have had a 5-0 sweep if they showed more application today

If both teams had shown more application, New Zealand would not have had a 5-0 sweep, so your point is slightly irrelevant to mine. Never miss a genuine opportunity to gloat though.

 

[TT Boy]

Does Vincent like opening in the coloured clothing form of the game?

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Mind you Edwards isn't hopeless with the bat. Just can't score.

Indeed. Edwards has worked hard on his defensive batting. That forward defensive is superb.

 

[Tim]

Well, NZ didn't really have to play that well either to win the series 4-1. NZ rarely looked superb with bat or ball but you never got the feeling that they were going to lose.

 

[Ming]

How can Vincent be dumped? His Test record of late speaks for itself. Unbelieveable.

Hamish Marshall will probably do a good job as an opener. He has a tidy techique.

 

[Ming]

If we maintain this lineup we're going to get absolutely killed on the tour of South Africa.

Chris Martin? WHAT?
Peter Fulton? WHAT?
Hamish Marshall? WHAT? OPENING?

Martin has a respectable Test record, his strike rate is pretty good.

Fulton? He's a very good first class player, deserves a crack but not at the expense of Vincent.

I can understand Marshall opening, he has the skills to play that spot IMO.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Well, NZ didn't really have to play that well either to win the series 4-1. NZ rarely looked superb with bat or ball but you never got the feeling that they were going to lose.

But given how New Zealand played, they still beat the West Indies 4-1.

Given how well the West Indies played in spurts in the 2nd and 3rd games, they should have won (those 2 games). People were saying it after those games for good reason. I don't see why it would change now. New Zealand won the series so comfortably because the West Indies could not capitalize on a couple of excellent positions.

 

[Tim]

I suppose The West Indies were in a similar position to that of NZ when they played South Africa last year.

NZ didn't really help themselves by constantly chopping & changing their side, but no-one but themselves can be blamed for that of course.

 

[roseboy64]

But given how New Zealand played, they still beat the West Indies 4-1.

Given how well the West Indies played in spurts in the 2nd and 3rd games, they should have won (those 2 games). People were saying it after those games for good reason. I don't see why it would change now. New Zealand won the series so comfortably because the West Indies could not capitalize on a couple of excellent positions.

That's true. If the West Indies knew how to finish games this would have a 3-2 win for them most likely.

 

[NZTailender]

Pleased with How and Fulton making their debut.

But...

Bowling options - Martin? Mills? Uuuuuuuuuh...Although Martin is a better test bowler (as his record shows) and Mills record is poor, Mills seems to be in some form and Martin isn't. Since they're gonig to have to pick between these two...I'll have to say, Mills.
I will stand by this right here: Mills >>> Martin in this series.


As for Vincent. Kind of a double edged sword, really. He's not an opener and he says so, so he doesn't get screwed around in the order, and gets left out, despite being one of the in form batsman. At least, more in form than Marshall.

As for Marshall opening, it's like Blaze said (Langer and all that)
He could be good. He could be bad. We won't know yet.

My XI (minus Vincent )
1. H Marshall
2. J How
3. S Styris
4. S Fleming
5. P Fulton
6. N Astle
7. B McCullum
8. J Franklin
9. D Vettori
10. K Mills
11. S Bond

12th man: J Patel

 

[Ming]

Of course Mills' record is poor at the moment, but he has been in very good form with the ball in the past year. The one thing I have against a Franklin/Martin/Bond combination, is that they all 'in swing' the ball to the right handers in contrast to Mills who outswings it.

 

[sportychic33]

Chris Martin - had another poor season for Auckland. He's Paul Wiseman's twin for me.
Hamish Marshall - he's not an opener, don't care if he's batted three. He isn't an opener. What's happened to Papps and Cumming?
Peter Fulton - how can he be selected over Vincent? How?
Kyle Mills - he isn't a test bowler! Just look at his stats! Averages 91 with the ball!

I honestly can't quite believe this squad.

Total agree with you on all points there. I haven't really been that impressed with Peter Fulton he has some obvious deficiancies in his range of shots, his fielding and his running between the wickets. It will be interesting to see how he fields in the test matches being the fact that he is been subbed off from fielding the majority of the time in the ODI's. I think it would have been a much better idea to stick with vincent and let him bat in the middle order where he wishes to bat as he is a much better play than fulton, even though his shot selection can be quite rash.
I guess Chris Martin has been selected as we lack depth in the bowling department and there is really no one else to take his spot, it is quite interesting that James Franklin managed to score 208 with a bowling attack that included Martin.
Hamish Marshall is likely going to be the next NZ batsmen to be thrown up and down the order with no consistency in his spot, he deserved to bat at 3 (thanks Ming) as that is where he was most successful for NZ in test matches last year in NZ. Given what has been said about Lou Vincent not wanting to open the batting and then be dropped because of it, I wouldn't be surprised if the same sort of bullying tactic has been applied with Marshall saying that if you want to play you have to open the batting as there is no space in the middle order for you.

 

[NZTailender]

Begs the question: would Marshall be in the side if Vincent said he'd open?

My guess? No.

 

[Ming]

Bullying tactic? Come on. Jeez.

Marshall does not usually bat at 4 or 5 for NZ in Tests, he bats 3. He's had to come in a few times basically as an opener anyway, and has shown he has the application and technique to do well against fast bowling.

Average of 91 for Mills, yes, but if you actually go and watch him bowl James, you will see he has great control of his bowling at the moment and is one of the better pace bowlers going around NZ.

 

[Ming]

Begs the question: would Marshall be in the side if Vincent said he'd open?

My guess? No.

In my team, he would, in place of Fulton.