*Official* Warne vs Murali Discussion

[Tom Halsey]

I for one think Murali pulling out of OZ is perfectly reasonable. I would've done the same if i were him. Hell, i would probably have not come back after 95/96.

You've got to be able to take it though.

 

[luckyeddie]

If you lived locally, I would send you a box of Chocolates in apology for my error .

I'm fat enough, thank you, but the thought is appreciated.

 

[C_C]

You've got to be able to take it though.

Why ? Why do i have to be able to take abuse instead of avoiding it if i can ?!
Why is sledging being sanctioned instead of making efforts to root it out ? Or is it now 'normal' to abuse someone for no good reason ? Remember that this is a game- not the fate of humanity. Winning at 'all cost' is not justified for the objective is to enjoy the game and give enjoyment to the crowd. And sledging sours the pot.

Murali is there to entertain and to play. But each time he steps on an Aussie ground, he hears the jeers and the boos towards his action. He doesnt hear the 'c'mon Murali..go murali' or much applause. And unlike sledging, they arnt poking fun at his competence, they are questioning his integrity and showing a distinct desire of wanting him to stop playing.
So why would he wanna go to OZ if the most vocal crowd in OZ doesnt want him to play ?

 

[Tom Halsey]

I'm not trying to justify the Aussie crowds, because they're wrong. But being barracked is part of being a sportsman.

 

[C_C]

I'm not trying to justify the Aussie crowds, because they're wrong. But being barracked is part of being a sportsman.

There is a huge difference between people barracking you in good humour and poking fun at ya and implying that yer a cheat and you should get off the field.
And even then, if being barracked is part of being a sportsman, maybe we should work to eliminate that kind of hostile environment rather than encourage it and play into it.

 

[Tom Halsey]

implying that yer a cheat and you should get off the field.

That's happened to many people before, not just Murali.

 

[luckyeddie]

That's happened to many people before, not just Murali.

Not to the same extent. He has been subject to systematic vilification over the last decade.

 

[C_C]

That's happened to many people before, not just Murali.

Who did that happen to ? Who else was greeted with chants of 'no ball', etc ?

 

[social]

Not to the same extent. He has been subject to systematic vilification over the last decade.

To be fair, he has chosen not to play so hasnt been subject to anything.

Murali's problem, like Hadlee before him, is that he reacts to the crowd in the wrong fashion.

Look at Andre Nel, by way of comparison. He copped every bit as much as Murali did this season but used the crowd's reaction to his advantage.

At the end of the day, he enjoyed it and so did the crowd.

Warne gets at least as bad a reaction in almost every country that he plays but he learnt how to thrive on it.

Way things are going, Murali may not be back and I can almost guarantee that he'll regret it more than the Aus crowds

 

[JBH001]

I'm not trying to justify the Aussie crowds, because they're wrong. But being barracked is part of being a sportsman.

True - but within limits and within reason.
It also depends on the nature of the barracking.
Is it the usual essentially harmless banter and sledging or is it more personal and direct?
Whether someone is saying something, in this case at least, is less important than what is being said - it makes a difference. In Muralis case, the content of the abuse is the issue at hand.

 

[Anil]

Warne gets at least as bad a reaction in almost every country that he plays but he learnt how to thrive on it.

didn't know about this....where do they jeer/insult/abuse warne? also according to you, as bad as the aussies treat murali???

 

[Dasa]

To be fair, he has chosen not to play so hasnt been subject to anything.

Murali's problem, like Hadlee before him, is that he reacts to the crowd in the wrong fashion.

Look at Andre Nel, by way of comparison. He copped every bit as much as Murali did this season but used the crowd's reaction to his advantage.

At the end of the day, he enjoyed it and so did the crowd.

Warne gets at least as bad a reaction in almost every country that he plays but he learnt how to thrive on it.

Way things are going, Murali may not be back and I can almost guarantee that he'll regret it more than the Aus crowds

You're missing an important point. While Nel was jeered there was a respect behind that, and it was always in good humour...you speak to most Aussie cricket fans and they would profess to still respect Nel, whereas with Murali the amount of vitriolic hate for the man is just incredible. There is no respect in jeering Murali, it's based purely on trying to demoralise him because an ignorant populace has deemed him a cheat.

 

[andyc]

You're missing an important point. While Nel was jeered there was a respect behind that, and it was always in good humour...you speak to most Aussie cricket fans and they would profess to still respect Nel, whereas with Murali the amount of vitriolic hate for the man is just incredible. There is no respect in jeering Murali, it's based purely on trying to demoralise him because an ignorant populace has deemed him a cheat.

Yeah, good point. You ask most people here and they'll tell you that he's 'a ****ing (four asterixes written there, thank you filter) chucker.'

 

[social]

didn't know about this....where do they jeer/insult/abuse warne? also according to you, as bad as the aussies treat murali???

Oh, try the entire cricketing world!

Take the last Ashes series as an example.

Booed at every ground, harassed by the paparazzi off the field, takes 40 wickets for the series and gets a standing ovation at the end.

Or Bree Lee in NZ.

Feared before the start of the series, condemned because he bowled a beamer (irrelevant that it was unintentional), and then was pelted with oranges, water bottles and a chair!

 

[social]

You're missing an important point. While Nel was jeered there was a respect behind that, and it was always in good humour...you speak to most Aussie cricket fans and they would profess to still respect Nel, whereas with Murali the amount of vitriolic hate for the man is just incredible. There is no respect in jeering Murali, it's based purely on trying to demoralise him because an ignorant populace has deemed him a cheat.

Nel earnt their respect.

He was a loud-mouthed medium-pacer that made a general fool of himself.

However, through whole-hearted performances and good-natured banter, he endeared himself.

Murali gets jeered by a maximum of 1% of the crowd and retaliates with an obscene gesture.

Greg Chappell has rightfully been condemned for the same in India. But because it happened in Aus, the Murali incident is the crowd's fault.

 

[Ikki]

Nel earnt their respect.

He was a loud-mouthed medium-pacer that made a general fool of himself.

However, through whole-hearted performances and good-natured banter, he endeared himself.

Murali gets jeered by a maximum of 1% of the crowd and retaliates with an obscene gesture.

Greg Chappell has rightfully been condemned for the same in India. But because it happened in Aus, the Murali incident is the crowd's fault.

Yeah agreed, I'm more than positive that if Murali displayed a more battling quality he'd be respected at the very least. The Ashes is one of the hottest rivalries between two fierce sporting nations, in Australia and England, yet the English respect Warne. Likewise the Australian's respecting a lot of the English talent even if they beat them after 20 years.

Murali isn't thick-skinned I guess. Whatever his problem, the one-finger salute will not buy you respect with any sides in this argument.

Addition: This is sport, whether it's right or wrong is not the problem because we all know it isn't right. The issue is if rivalries are heated for fans to be entertained and the game sweetened, there will always be this side to the sport and as a sports person one must endure it and if really upsetted, post formal complaint after the event without insulting anyone and to show class. This isn't to say Murali is less than, it has happened to plenty of sports figures, it just won't help him any. Furthermore, not coming to Australia is not the answer.

 

[luckyeddie]

Oh, try the entire cricketing world!

Take the last Ashes series as an example.

Booed at every ground, harassed by the paparazzi off the field, takes 40 wickets for the series and gets a standing ovation at the end.

Or Bree Lee in NZ.

Feared before the start of the series, condemned because he bowled a beamer (irrelevant that it was unintentional), and then was pelted with oranges, water bottles and a chair!

That's not right, social. Warne is absolutely revered over here as a cricketing god. Murali gets greeted by a 'Black and White Minstrels' racist cretin with 'No Ball' written across his chest when he plays in Australia.

There's a difference.

 

[luckyeddie]

Murali isn't thick-skinned I guess. Whatever his problem, the one-finger salute will not buy you respect with any sides in this argument.

I'm going to reserve about 15% of my contempt for Murali.

The rest goes to the perpetrator of the incident - and to those who appear to be supporting his right to 'banter' Murali in such an inflammatory manner.

 

[social]

That's not right, social. Warne is absolutely revered over here as a cricketing god. Murali gets greeted by a 'Black and White Minstrels' racist cretin with 'No Ball' written across his chest when he plays in Australia.

There's a difference.

Warne would know that he's respected (and even if he wasnt, the fat pillock would convince himself that he was) but the difference is in attitude.

People abuse Warne and he lifts his performance and shoves it down your throat.

People abuse Murali here and he whines about it.

Unfortunately, youre never going to change the cretins behaviour but you can neutralise it.

IMO, Murali plays right into the cretins' (notice that was plural) hands by making a song and dance about it.

 

[Top_Cat]

Why not get him tested by the proper super speed frame by frame analysis and current technology available by an independant testing facility , since this technology is now available and there are facilities capable of doing it.

No idea why you rail against the UWA testers and infer they're somehow biased. Murali and all other bowlers are referred there and they, prima facie, seem to be assessed objectively. Murali, to my recollection, has never once been found to be chucking by them. Their results, in fact, correlate pretty strongly with Hong Kong's generally and the team at UWA have, in fact, always been the last word in the matter in the debate, finding in Murali's favour each time. If they're biased, so is Hong Kong. Some of the team members may have their own personal opinions but none of them have, from what I've seen, said "Murali chucks" but that he might need to be looked at again. Remember; no bowler, having been cleared of chucking, is (nor should be) cleared for life. That's what I've seen, anyway. Just because they're raising doubt, doesn't mean they're not objective anymore.