*Official** New Zealand in England

[luckyeddie]

Out of interest, I assume Tuffey is still either a) unfit or b) short of match practise.

If it's the former then do you rest him in the County game and play him in back-to-back Tests, if the latter then surely he must play this week?

Damned if you do, da......

 

[Craig]

it's a pity we can't take a leaf out of the Aussie book & pluck a few more of the youngsters from relative FC obscurity, although it is perhaps a bit too much of a risk in a Test as opposed to ODIs. Eg Bracken hadn't played any more than a handful of FC matches for NSW b4 he was drafted as a replacement for Lee in ODIs when he was injured

Eh?

Butler had played only a handful of matches fo Northern Districts, and was so unknown, not even his Stephen Fleming had seen him bowl, Vettori played two first class matches for ND and got called up, nobody had heard of Shane Bond before Bond was picked, Craig McMillan was 19 when he made his ODI debut and Bendon McCullum had a List A average of 14 when he first got picked.

Mark Richardson was plucked from relevative obsucrity as well.

 

[Kent]

Out of interest, I assume Tuffey is still either a) unfit or b) short of match practise.

If it's the former then do you rest him in the County game and play him in back-to-back Tests, if the latter then surely he must play this week?

From Scott Styris' column this morning: "A lot has been mentioned since the game finished about why our bowlers seem to be down on their speeds. We can't put our finger on it either. Certainly Daryl Tuffey was down about 10km/h, but that has a lot to do with his sore knee that plagued him towards the end of last summer."

So he was playing through an injury it seems. People will blame the 14-man squad, although it's not like Mills or anyone else would've had a decent warm-up game because of the bad weather. Tuffey will now be rested from tonight's match.

 

[Loony BoB]

Last Wicket: 0/1
MHW Papps c Robinson b Dakin 0 (1m 2b 0x4 0x6) SR: 0.00

I'm actually sort of hoping Papps won't start the next test now. He's really out of touch lately.

 

[Neil Pickup]

Credit to Papps, he managed to last twice as long as I thought he would..

Fleming and Astle adding runs right now.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Credit to Papps, he managed to last twice as long as I thought he would..

Fleming and Astle adding runs right now.

Fleming out just after getting his 50 and Styris soon follows. Looks like the out of form NZ players arent gonna bat themselves into form in this match anyway

At least McMillan has got a start.

 

[tooextracool]

If I thought Papps was any better at defending or leaving the ball than Fleming is, I'd understand your blueprint. Who's to say Papps won't feel the pressure and play a false shot, seeing he's a young player and he knows his side is trying to win consecutive tests?

the thing that you fail to realise is papps is a specialist opener....fleming is not. now i havent seen much of papps so i dont know how good he is but the fact still remains....fleming is one of your better players.....dont waste him at the top just because papps would probably play a false shot just like him. if papps wasnt a good enough opener then why is he in the side in the first place?14 man squad with only 2 openers and one of them misses out throughout the series?

 

[SpaceMonkey]

the thing that you fail to realise is papps is a specialist opener....fleming is not. now i havent seen much of papps so i dont know how good he is but the fact still remains....fleming is one of your better players.....dont waste him at the top just because papps would probably play a false shot just like him. if papps wasnt a good enough opener then why is he in the side in the first place?14 man squad with only 2 openers and one of them misses out throughout the series?

Whether Fleming comes in to Open or at no.3 makes almost no difference. Alot of the time a team will lose 1 wicket in the first 6 overs (especially in swinging / seaming conditions) so he'd still be facing a new ball with fresh opening bowlers.

 

[anzac]

Eh?

Butler had played only a handful of matches fo Northern Districts, and was so unknown, not even his Stephen Fleming had seen him bowl, Vettori played two first class matches for ND and got called up, nobody had heard of Shane Bond before Bond was picked, Craig McMillan was 19 when he made his ODI debut and Bendon McCullum had a List A average of 14 when he first got picked.

Mark Richardson was plucked from relevative obsucrity as well.

yeah and Flem was in his early 20's when he made his debut.................

I was referring to the way they blood youngsters as an ongoing development, as opposed to the NZ example which is more or less all or nothing..........

eg Butler has 3 Tests & 10 ODIs, Marshall has 1 Test & as a result of this season has 16 ODIs, Franklin 2 Tests & 24 ODIs,

whereas for AUS Williams & Watson both have 2 dozen ODIs & Bracken a dozen, with only Watson yet to make his Test debut...........even Kasper made his debut 9 seasons ago in his early - mid 20's & now has nearly 2 dozen caps in each form of the game.............

IMO their system ensures a certain amount of experience, option & continuity as their players retire etc.......whereas we bemoan the fact that the cupboard looks bare so far as optons are concerned................

 

[anzac]

oh dear & bugger me...............

Papps & Styris continue their poor form, whereas Macca rises to the occaision & scores some runs................probably ensures that we will see the same batting lineup for the 2nd Test.............

either that or McCullum will be promoted up the order as a specialist bat & Hopkins will come in as 'keeper with Styris getting the chop..........

 

[anzac]

to start with I thought it was interesting to see NZL line up with 6 'specialist' batsmen with McCullum at #6 & Hopkins #8, but with both Oram & Tuffey out thru' injury they didn't have much choice....................

 

[Loony BoB]

Whether Fleming comes in to Open or at no.3 makes almost no difference. Alot of the time a team will lose 1 wicket in the first 6 overs (especially in swinging / seaming conditions) so he'd still be facing a new ball with fresh opening bowlers.

Especially with New Zealand. Fleming has effectively been a #2 batsman for half of his career.

 

[blackcapsrule]

Yes. Fleming opens in the One Dayers. So he should cope fine opening in the tests.

 

[tooextracool]

Yes. Fleming opens in the One Dayers. So he should cope fine opening in the tests.

because hes been opening in odis with richardson and because hes played patiently against the new ball in ODIS?it would be inane to say that since hes opened in ODIs he should be a shoe in for tests....

 

[tooextracool]

Especially with New Zealand. Fleming has effectively been a #2 batsman for half of his career.

what about the other half? it would be easy to say that if he continues to open he'll only be half the player he used to be.

 

[marc71178]

Yes. Fleming opens in the One Dayers. So he should cope fine opening in the tests.

They're completely different ball games, hence you don't see people like Gilchrist or SRT opening in Tests.

 

[blackcapsrule]

I said he should cope fine, though i'd much rather see him batting at 3.

 

[marc71178]

But why should he cope fine though? You haven't provided a valid reason.

 

[Kent]

I'm just waiting for Southern Man to come on and make a "Hopkins for McMillan" pitch for the 2nd test. His local hero McCullum could play as a specialist #3!

If only Hamish Marshall could've been drafted in early like Hopkins has been. I wouldn't mind Macca being put under pressure by someone outside the current squad of 14, seeing Papps batting in the middle-order just isn't realistic.

As a heavy-bat basher rather than a nimble deflector, McMillan will struggle against England's pace and bounce (or the defensive spin of Ashley Giles for that matter). On the other hand, Marshall has looked at his best when facing the likes of Shoaib, Shabbir, and Sami.

 

[Isolator]

Yes to the Marshall Plan.