**Official** Australia in India Thread

[Richard]

This is extraordinary!
What a ridiculous furore! "It's unsportsmanlike"; "Shamelessly doctored". How stupidly OTT is it possible to be!

I don't care what the pitch is like..so long as it's like that all the time.
Home ground advantage is the crowds, both in and out of the game, having played at the ground before on a regular basis and things like that.

It's all these - and having played at the ground means knowing the pitch. Albeit this pitch doesn't sound like a typical Bangalore wicket! But India's players know pitches like this.
These sorts of pitches give India their best chance of winning, so they prepare them. Any home team who does otherwise is surrendering the biggest advantage in cricket.
There is no point playing in India unless you play on these sorts of surfaces. Proper Indian pitches are like this all the time. The way I understand it this stadium has only started preparing seamer-friendly surfaces in the last 4 or 5 years, since it was relaid. Before that it was a typical dustbowl like anything else.
I find this Australian pre-event sour-grapes absolutely incredible and it's a credit to Kyle and JASON that they're not indulging in it.

 

[Richard]

Not at all. While Katich is an excellent player of spin he is well suited to getting in early and playing against the harder ball and the seamers.

Anyone who thinks Katich is better suited to coming in immidiately against spinners is really rather ignorant.
Katich made his career batting at The WACA - the ultimate seamers' wicket. He has since moved to The SCG - the ultimate spinners' wicket.
To suggest he is better coming in against either is really rather stupid.

 

[aussie_beater]

This is extraordinary!
The way I understand it this stadium has only started preparing seamer-friendly surfaces in the last 4 or 5 years, since it was relaid. Before that it was a typical dustbowl like anything else.

If we don't even go before 2000, I can't see how Bangalore got classed as a fast bowlers wicket.The 2001 match against England was played in the relaid pitch but was more of a swing bowlers match because of overcast conditions. It was not very different from the normal Indian pitches in any regard.

I remember the Bangalore pitch for the match against SA in 2000 which SA won and that pitch was also slow and low. It was lost by India due to very poor batting and a thorough professional effort from SA. Also remember that Nicky Boje was the main destroyer.

Even the pitch for the match that Australia won here in 1998, was a typically slow one. kasprowicz exploited the low bounce and general slowness of the pitch in the second innings and was helped in his cause by Gavin Robertson's off breaks.

So by no stretch of imagination can it be said that Bangalore has been a fast bowler friendly pitch which has suddenly been modified to help the spinners. Its always been like this. If that's the information that the Aussies got before coming here, I guess they should pay someone to get the pitch information correct next time

 

[Richard]

If we don't even go before 2000, I can't see how Bangalore got classed as a fast bowlers wicket.The 2001 match against England was played in the relaid pitch but was more of a swing bowlers match because of overcast conditions. It was not very different from the normal Indian pitches in any regard.

Hmm, I very much agree with the rest of the post but my memory of that match is that there was plenty in the pitch for the seamers - allied, of course, to the heavy cloud-cover.
Srinath, Flintoff and Hoggard all got the ball to move off the seam, as well as Hoggard moving it in the air.
The excellent deliveries that dismissed Hussain, Foster, Dasgupta and Laxman are examples. There wasn't that much turn, either - Kumble managed to snatch his 300th Test-wicket on his home-ground only by getting the last wicket of the innings, Hoggard (who was rather more hopeless than he is now).

 

[iamdavid]

It's official , Clarke will make his test debut.

Cant say I think he deserves it based on what he's done so far , but nevertheless best of luck to him.

Poor old Martin Love must be stewing right now , he performs at domestic level consistently for the best part of a decade , gets his chance and makes the most of it , then continues to do well at domestic level during his absense from the test team , only to be overlooked twice in the space of four months , and on both occasions in the event of an injury to Australia's incumbent number three and second slip fielder.

Two of the men called up ahead of him were Victorians , Elliott and Hodge , David Hookes would be a happy man.

 

[aussie_beater]

Hmm, I very much agree with the rest of the post but my memory of that match is that there was plenty in the pitch for the seamers - allied, of course, to the heavy cloud-cover.
Srinath, Flintoff and Hoggard all got the ball to move off the seam, as well as Hoggard moving it in the air.
The excellent deliveries that dismissed Hussain, Foster, Dasgupta and Laxman are examples. There wasn't that much turn, either - Kumble managed to snatch his 300th Test-wicket on his home-ground only by getting the last wicket of the innings, Hoggard (who was rather more hopeless than he is now).

The seam movement also was due to the moisture in the wicket due to rain and everything. It was weather related and that was my point.

 

[tooextracool]

Trust me there is a big difference. I have been a keeper batsman before and it is much harder to settle into a batting innings after being crouched behind the stumps for almost an entire day then to go out early in the innings, you concerntration just isn't there and if you get a good one early, it is harder to keep out.

However, on the other hand, after a good stint batting down the order it is a tad easier to slip on the gloves and out to the field.

I'm not saying both don't have the positive and negative points, but it is easier keeping after batting, than batting quickly after keeping.

maybe it is, but there isnt too significant a difference that a professional cricketer cant cope with, especially if it might mean that he'll end up with a better score.

 

[tooextracool]

Not at all. While Katich is an excellent player of spin he is well suited to getting in early and playing against the harder ball and the seamers.

yes i know, katich is a fine player from what ive seen off him so far, and i doubt he would not be capable of scoring at no 3, but as i said, he looks to be more comfortable at the start of his innings against spin than pace, and if someone like gilchrist is better off in that position then surely it wouldnt hurt to have him batting at 6?

 

[tooextracool]

Poor old Martin Love must be stewing right now , he performs at domestic level consistently for the best part of a decade , gets his chance and makes the most of it , then continues to do well at domestic level during his absense from the test team , only to be overlooked twice in the space of four months , and on both occasions in the event of an injury to Australia's incumbent number three and second slip fielder.

i must say that from what i say off martin love in his short international career i was extremely impressed, didnt show too many technical weaknesses at all....

 

[Mister Wright]

It's official , Clarke will make his test debut.

Cant say I think he deserves it based on what he's done so far , but nevertheless best of luck to him.

Poor old Martin Love must be stewing right now , he performs at domestic level consistently for the best part of a decade , gets his chance and makes the most of it , then continues to do well at domestic level during his absense from the test team , only to be overlooked twice in the space of four months , and on both occasions in the event of an injury to Australia's incumbent number three and second slip fielder.

Two of the men called up ahead of him were Victorians , Elliott and Hodge , David Hookes would be a happy man.

He's in one of those unfortunate situations where he was born north of the N.S.W. border and he doesn't have blonde hair (however ridiculously died).

 

[telsor]

He's in one of those unfortunate situations where he was born north of the N.S.W. border and he doesn't have blonde hair (however ridiculously died).

You're too harsh on our NSW brethern. You don't have to be *born* there...moving there is quite good enough.

Must be one hell of a recruitment program...hey, look at Katich, was nowhere, moved to NSW and next thing you know, test team!

 

[Andre]

yes i know, katich is a fine player from what ive seen off him so far, and i doubt he would not be capable of scoring at no 3, but as i said, he looks to be more comfortable at the start of his innings against spin than pace, and if someone like gilchrist is better off in that position then surely it wouldnt hurt to have him batting at 6?

He's certainly no liability against pace like you seem to suggest he is. Gilchrist at 3 is by no means better for the side - he plays the number 7 role perfectly, and in the Indian conditions you can't expect him to be able to keep for a day and a half and then go out to bat after an over. It's quite simply not humanly possible to function at your best in such oppressive conditions.

 

[Mister Wright]

You're too harsh on our NSW brethern. You don't have to be *born* there...moving there is quite good enough.

Must be one hell of a recruitment program...hey, look at Katich, was nowhere, moved to NSW and next thing you know, test team!

Thank you for proving my point. If the likes of Love, Maher & Symonds were wearing the baggy blue they would surely be given more chances and Kasprowicz would have played well over 50 tests.

 

[telsor]

Thank you for proving my point. If the likes of Love, Maher & Symonds were wearing the baggy blue they would surely be given more chances and Kasprowicz would have played well over 50 tests.

funky Miller was on the radio here a few mins back, and seemed amazed that Clarke was the favorite...he's a big rap for Clarke, reckons he'll play ~100 tests, but says he's just no ready, and when you have a specialist No3 on hand, who made 200 against India last year, and over 1000/season for the last 3 seasons on hand, he can't understand how they're leaning towards Clarke.

That said, hows this for another option..

Katich at 3,
Gilchrist at 6
White at 7

Whites a good bat, and provides a real 5th bowling option/second spinner.

I don't think he's test quality (yet), but on this pitch, a second spinner, even an 'OK' one could be vital.

Just did a quick check of the averages, and White only averages 10 less at FC level than Clarke.

 

[Mister Wright]

funky Miller was on the radio here a few mins back, and seemed amazed that Clarke was the favorite...he's a big rap for Clarke, reckons he'll play ~100 tests, but says he's just no ready, and when you have a specialist No3 on hand, who made 200 against India last year, and over 1000/season for the last 3 seasons on hand, he can't understand how they're leaning towards Clarke.

That said, hows this for another option..

Katich at 3,
Gilchrist at 6
White at 7

Whites a good bat, and provides a real 5th bowling option/second spinner.

I don't think he's test quality (yet), but on this pitch, a second spinner, even an 'OK' one could be vital.

Just did a quick check of the averages, and White only averages 10 less at FC level than Clarke.

If Clarke isn't ready, White sure as hell isn't. It is a crime that Love isn't in the squad, let alone playing in the first test.

I bet the selectors wish they had of had MacGill in the squad. He may of not performed well against India, but I'd rather have him there, as he is better than Lehmann, Katich & Clarke combined.

 

[tooextracool]

He's certainly no liability against pace like you seem to suggest he is.

never said he was, all i said was that he would be better batting at 6. however i wouldnt be surprised if he scored at 3 because he is a very good batsman.

Gilchrist at 3 is by no means better for the side - he plays the number 7 role perfectly, and in the Indian conditions you can't expect him to be able to keep for a day and a half and then go out to bat after an over. It's quite simply not humanly possible to function at your best in such oppressive conditions.

oh he plays it perfectly allright, whenever he plays against attacks that dont have quality spinners.i'll remind you what his averages are in his last 4 series against india and SL....
vs ind 2001 - 24.80, scored 2 runs in his last 4 innings.
vs ind 03/04 - 16.00
vs SL 04 in SL - 14.25(not counting the 144 that he scored batting at 3)
vs SL in aus - 28.75

AFAICS hes failed enough times at 7 to suggest that they should try something different this time.....

 

[Craig]

If anyone tries to tell me that any Australian except Ponting is a better batsman than Lehmann then you can eat my computer!

Matt Hayden?

And no, I will not waste an airfare to London and spend all day on a bus to Exeter (from the map it looks like at least 6 hours on bus) just to eat your computer

 

[Linda]

Thank you for proving my point. If the likes of Love, Maher & Symonds were wearing the baggy blue they would surely be given more chances and Kasprowicz would have played well over 50 tests.

While I think this "problem" is overrated, you have to remember that its not just confined to Queensland. There are 3 other states, you know.

 

[telsor]

While I think this "problem" is overrated, you have to remember that its not just confined to Queensland. There are 3 other states, you know.

3?

 

[Tony Blade]

Great start!