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**Official** Asia Cup 2004 Thread

biased indian

International Coach
Swervy said:
yeah i feel sorry for Pakistan...India certainly had the advantage of playing a weakened Sri Lankan team
i thought u where more sensible

india ns SL played 2 close match

Pak lost badly aganist SL and IND lost the same way aganist Pak
and if IND beat SL well in Final what is the difference between the teams.
But india will have to perform well to WIN THE CUP
 

ReallyCrazy

Banned
I don't feel sorry for Pakistan because in hindsight they were pretty bad in this tournament. They crashed to 122 all out and were badly beaten by Sril Lanka. India didn't crash to any such heavy defeat. So they deserve their place in the final.

Now I'm sure India is going to win the final!!
 

Swervy

International Captain
biased indian said:
i thought u where more sensible

india ns SL played 2 close match

Pak lost badly aganist SL and IND lost the same way aganist Pak
and if IND beat SL well in Final what is the difference between the teams.
But india will have to perform well to WIN THE CUP
the top and bottom of it all is that Sri lanka have been the best team of the tournament..both Pakistan and India have been poor.

But i guess before the tournament began i would have thought that Sri lanka would be playing India in the final anyway.

The final should be a great game, the edge must be with Sri Lanka though with Murali and Vaas to come back in
 

Slow Love™

International Captain
Anil said:
my signature doesn't say whether i am an optimist or a pessimist, does it?
:D
Hahaha, good answer - it's funny how I infer that the writer must be an optimist, 'cause you're right, it doesn't say either way. Cheeky. :p

Can't fault how India have gone about it, though. They haven't played well - yet their batting has still been relatively solid (if their bowling has been erratic), and plucking the bonus point from Pakistan's hands the other night got them here.

Swervy - if you think about the system, it doesn't favor India as much as you think. Vishnu Reddy already explained for the most part - the fact is that if the teams kept their points going into the second phase, Pakistan would have been unfairly advantaged, as one of Sri Lanka or India would have had to have lost against the other in the other group, and they (Pakistan) weren't exposed to the same risk. The only purpose of the group phase is to eliminate the bottom teams of each group, being HK and UAE.

What DID work in India's favor was the order of their fixture - playing a half-strength Sri Lankan team right at the end for a place in the Final. But it's one of those things. Pakistan just really needed that bonus point, and couldn't quite get it.
 

Swervy

International Captain
Slow Love™ said:
Hahaha, good answer - it's funny how I infer that the writer must be an optimist, 'cause you're right, it doesn't say either way. Cheeky. :p

Can't fault how India have gone about it, though. They haven't played well - yet their batting has still been relatively solid (if their bowling has been erratic), and plucking the bonus point from Pakistan's hands the other night got them here.

Swervy - if you think about the system, it doesn't favor India as much as you think. Vishnu Reddy already explained for the most part - the fact is that if the teams kept their points going into the second phase, Pakistan would have been unfairly advantaged, as one of Sri Lanka or India would have had to have lost against the other in the other group, and they (Pakistan) weren't exposed to the same risk. The only purpose of the group phase is to eliminate the bottom teams of each group, being HK and UAE.

What DID work in India's favor was the order of their fixture - playing a half-strength Sri Lankan team right at the end for a place in the Final. But it's one of those things. Pakistan just really needed that bonus point, and couldn't quite get it.
yep I agree, th advantage wasnt so great by the not carrying through of points, so fair enough, however yes the order of the fixtures was certainly no advantagous to Pakistan.

It is one of those things,and fair enough, I think it will be a great game in the final

BUT I still dont like bonus points
 

maxpower

U19 Cricketer
not a convincing win by IND but a win nonetheless. Zaheer is just not the same bowler anymore, IND will have to double the effort in all areas if they want to win the final, coz SL is tough to beat at home.
 

RealPk

School Boy/Girl Cricketer
Now the Sri Lankans will lose the game against India in the final..
And i also said, that if India comes in the final, they will get the cup.
In spite of the Indians didnt performed welll...Also this one, should be gone clearly to them since they had a so weakened bowling attack from the Sri Lankan side and only made 271..
The bowling attack was again very bad against a so weakened Sri Lankan team and there was a possibilitie for the Sri Lankan to win the match..

I know there are lot of a examples alike that but this is one clear one:
If the Javasuriya got in his 21 run over over Zaheer Khan those two shots at the on side as 2 sixes it would already been a tie.

And Pakistan could easyly be in the final....
 

imranrabb

U19 Debutant
the truth is india were lucky becuase of the poor bonus point system.It is stupid becuase it is 60 run within the total and it should be 30 or 40.I dont know why the losing team can gain a bonus point from losing.
 

biased indian

International Coach
imranrabb said:
the truth is india were lucky becuase of the poor bonus point system.It is stupid becuase it is 60 run within the total and it should be 30 or 40.I dont know why the losing team can gain a bonus point from losing.
its not 60 runs u have to win with in 40 overs if u r batting 2nd or u have to restrict opp to 1.20 runrate less than yours. if u score 300 u have to restrict opp to 240 and if u score 200 it will be around 160
 
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Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
Swervy said:
yep I agree, th advantage wasnt so great by the not carrying through of points, so fair enough, however yes the order of the fixtures was certainly no advantagous to Pakistan.

It is one of those things,and fair enough, I think it will be a great game in the final

BUT I still dont like bonus points
No system will be good enough, losing teams are always going to complain about the system no matter how good it is.
 

Swervy

International Captain
Sanz said:
No system will be good enough, losing teams are always going to complain about the system no matter how good it is.

i just dont know why a league table cannot be done on how many wins you have..the more wins the more points you have....if a tie breaker is needed, the net run rate seems to be sufficient (it worked for 30 years with no problems) I think cricket is the only sport that rewards a defeat
 

RealPk

School Boy/Girl Cricketer
Yeah, thats stupid.....
It would be correct and understandable, if the losing team couldnt win a bonus point e.g. if India reach 240 in the match against Pakistan on last sunday, the Pakistani Team wouldnt get a bonus point..
India will only get then the Bonus Point, if they win against Pakistan...



Maybe this is a solution...^^
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
And how many wins Pakistan has in the second round ?? If No. of win should be the criteria then all teams should have played each other. I mean India playing SL/UAE and Pak playing BD/HK in the first round isn't really a fair comparison or fair calculation , is it ??
 

shankar

International Debutant
A point to note is that although the Srilankan bowling was weakened by losing Vaas and Murali, that meant they were able to play 7 batsmen and it was because of the 7th batsman (Dilshan) that SL got close to the target.
 

Sanz

Hall of Fame Member
RealPakistani said:
Yeah, thats stupid.....
It would be correct and understandable, if the losing team couldnt win a bonus point e.g. if India reach 240 in the match against Pakistan on last sunday, the Pakistani Team wouldnt get a bonus point..
India will only get then the Bonus Point, if they win against Pakistan...
RealPakistani, In that case India and Pakistan will end up with same no. of points and chances are more likely that India would go to the finals on net run rate. someone will come up with another excuse that NRR should not be used and Pakistan should go to finals because it won the league match against India. The fact is, people will find excuses, no matter what system we use.
 

Swervy

International Captain
Sanz said:
And how many wins Pakistan has in the second round ?? If No. of win should be the criteria then all teams should have played each other. I mean India playing SL/UAE and Pak playing BD/HK in the first round isn't really a fair comparison or fair calculation , is it ??
no but Pakistan will probably whip Bangladesh's bottom in the next game..chances are the net run rate will go above Indias....now each team will have played each other in this second round, with Pakistan and India on equal number of wins....surely it makes sense that Pakistan should really go through based on the fact that they beat India and will probably have a better net run rate (ie. played better than India in this round)

Of course if Bangladseh beat Pakistan (which is now a dead game and so this is quite conceivable) then I will be wrong
 

Swervy

International Captain
shankar said:
A point to note is that although the Srilankan bowling was weakened by losing Vaas and Murali, that meant they were able to play 7 batsmen and it was because of the 7th batsman (Dilshan) that SL got close to the target.

yeah but with out Murali and Vaas, surely India had an easier time of scoring their winning target
 

shankar

International Debutant
Yes. But they would have scored lesser runs since they would have had only 6 batsman and that 7th batsman proved crucial. Added to that India were also missing Laxman. I agree that overall SL were weakened more but not by a lot.
 

Swervy

International Captain
shankar said:
Yes. But they would have scored lesser runs since they would have had only 6 batsman and that 7th batsman proved crucial. Added to that India were also missing Laxman. I agree that overall SL were weakened more but not by a lot.

not by a lot??? you have to be joking..Murali, arguably the greatest ODI bowler (certainly spinner) of all time and Vaas (one of the better ODI bowlers around) compared to Laxman...please be serious
 

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