**Official** 2004 Natwest Series (Eng, NZL, WI)

[Neil Pickup]

I cannot see how you can blame the captain or suggest that he's been exposed. We've been hammered twice - and both times it has been batting collapses and indiscipline.

In the field, he didn't do much wrong against the WI - but you can't defend 147, especially if you drop catches - and I can't see how that's his fault.

Fleming's captaincy in the Tests, however, was to me a complete and utter let-down, standing at slip looking confused and bored was the general game plan, so it seemed.

I think there's something about Gidman - but that's just a personal hunch.

 

[superkingdave]

Harmison seems to really be up on confidence now with his slightly reworked action. I saw on Sky that his fastest ball was clocked at 96.0mph which is 154.5 kph. He also averaged over 92mph through 7 overs. Outstanding speed, certainly the fastest spell of bowling by an englishmen ive ever seen, and coming from a great height too. Lets hope he can keep it up and not burn out.

Jesus thats quick, that would put him third behind Akhtar and Lee in terms of current bowlers - fastest ever englishman?
I suppose its more impressive to average 92 over 7 overs though

 

[gio]

I know what you mean. I think Gidman has that quality and feel about him that makes you think he can make it as a test player. He won't get in through weight of runs (his only hundred came 2 years ago), but through attitude. This seems to play a major part in the England management. Hopefully he can score a few more centuries and stake a claim.

 

[Tim]

You can't blame Fleming's captaincy too much in the test series...what can you do when your bowlers are just constantly bowling four balls?
Vaughan can start by leading the way with the bat which he has failed to do so far. With the current make-up of the English team, Trescothick & Vaughan have to bat sensibly.

You obviously have a different opinion to the radio commentators..they were getting stuck into Vaughan.

 

[Neil Pickup]

My point exactly - not the captain's fault in either case.

Vaughan batting irresponsibly is not bad captaincy - it's just bad cricket and is no different to Trescothick batting irresponsibly and not a case to criticise his captaincy.

Besides, there's no alternative.

 

[Tim]

That's where I disagree...as soon as you become Captain, the other players look to you to lead by example. It's bad cricket yes, but I also believe it's bad Captaincy when he's going out and playing rash shots knowing how fragile the middle order is and the team is his responsibility.

 

[Tim]

But anyway I think England have to get rid of McGrath or Blackwell for the time being and bring in Key.

I'd open with Trescothick & Key then with Vaughan at 1st drop.

 

[marc71178]

Disgrace we got hammered Twice in 3 days.... Something has to be done Giles and McGrath out

So drop Giles for not playing in the first game then not bowling in the second.

Good Call.

 

[marc71178]

On the bright side,

Eurobet offered 11-10 on NZ and I took advantage.

 

[marc71178]

You obviously have a different opinion to the radio commentators..they were getting stuck into Vaughan.

Which were those?

I've heard almost all praise for him on TMS.

 

[marc71178]

That's where I disagree...as soon as you become Captain, the other players look to you to lead by example.

So how come Fleming is "so" great on that basis then?

He's had a good run, but was being praised as a captain before then.

 

[Tim]

Aggers came on at around 4.30 in the morning NZ time with someone else who I forget the name of & they were being very critical of Vaughan. Aggers BBC column also highlights that.

Fleming has been praised because NZ are supposedly a team lacking talent..I beg to differ these days.

 

[Kent]

What Vaughan can definitely be criticised about is his alarmingly poor ODI batting record. And I thought McMillan was an under-achiever!

I may be off the mark, but I get the feeling a lot of English players are yet to take OD cricket 100% seriously. All our players pretty much have to, because without an income from OD's they don't earn a particularly comfortable living. In NZ you've got to be good in the field, decent between the wickets and know how you'll keep the runs flowing, without turning to tap on full blast. Otherwise you better be as good as Mark Richardson, or you'll be quickly in need of a real job.

In the UK it seems to be more the game for lazy Sundays and twilight slogs, with imports often featuring strongly. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's just the impression.

 

[Tim]

NZ are now 10 wins from their last 12 matches...I wish we could translate that form to test cricket.

 

[anzac]

well done James Franklin on his return to ODIs since the VB series several years back........

if he is able to maintain his form with the ball it will pose some interesting problems for the selectors in both forms of the game re bowler selections..........

my main concern is still a lack of pace as the options used on tour thus far have all been around 80 - 85 mph - by comparison Gough was the slowest ENG bowler seen last night at about 85..............

Harmison showed the advantage of having pace & lift, with both Fleming's & Marshall's dismissals being attributable to this combination.............shades of what NZL have been hoping for from Butler?????

 

[Tim]

I just hope he doesn't turn out like Chris Martin & flop in the next series.
Im not surprised though that the NZ bowlers have performed better since the kookaburra balls came in for the ODI's.

 

[Macka]

Thanks England, I got to bed 2 hours early. Is it me or are the commentators on Sky Sport really bad? They spent the whole lead-in to the game discussing England, and I think it was Ian Botham saying "England need something extraordinary here if they are to win" when NZ needs 30 runs?

I think Shane Bond has been clocked at 156kph, I might be wrong on that though. I found on the web that Shane Bond bowled a ball at the World Cup at 153.4kph.

In 2001 England were bowled out by NZ for 89 and came back to win the next two games. But this England ODI team looks pretty bad.

 

[MoxPearl]

yeah macka.. they really are bad.. maybe for the next ODIS we get that other channel.. cant remember what its called.. but they were far far better the one with richie..

And yep im SURE bond has made 156kph... trying to remember when it was...

Also.. the umpire.. jeremy lloyds is the best umpire i seen in a long long long time!

 

[Tim]

Im absolutely certain England will bounce back..they've reached their low & they'll be far more competitive from here on in.

But South Africa were unable to come back against NZ in the recent ODI series here so NZ should be confident they can get 1 more win over a desperate England side at least.

 

[Eclipse]

well done James Franklin on his return to ODIs since the VB series several years back........

My only memory of Franklin was Pollock hitting him for 4 sixes in a row.

I think Boucher had his way with him once or twice as well during that series.