Fringe Aussie fringe Players who would excel in other teams..

[chaminda_00]

Presonally i don't think hayden has problem on seaming pitches as most of his FC matches were played in Australia and England (county cricket), were pitches seam more then in other plases in the world. The only problem Hayden has is aganist really fast bowlers like Ahktar, Ambrose, Walsh and Schultz. If hayden fails in England it will be down to how well Harmy bowls, not how much the ball seams around.

 

[Mr Casson]

I don't think that Hayden will have a huge problem with someone who gets the ball to bounce as much as Harmison, especially given Harmison's current form. Hayden can be very much like Graeme Smith in his temperament; if you bowl anything short, it doesn't matter if it's a meter and a half outside off-stump - he'll thwack it through midwicket. They're both very good at it. I think Flintoff would be a more dangerous bowler.

 

[chaminda_00]

I don't think that Hayden will have a huge problem with someone who gets the ball to bounce as much as Harmison, especially given Harmison's current form. Hayden can be very much like Graeme Smith in his temperament; if you bowl anything short, it doesn't matter if it's a meter and a half outside off-stump - he'll thwack it through midwicket. They're both very good at it. I think Flintoff would be a more dangerous bowler.

But if u look at hayden's career he has had more problems with bowlers that bowl at 100 miles/h then bowlers like Flintoff. But i do agree that unless Harmison can improve his form he will not create any problems for the Australian Batsmen.

 

[mavric41]

But if u look at hayden's career he has had more problems with bowlers that bowl at 100 miles/h then bowlers like Flintoff. But i do agree that unless Harmison can improve his form he will not create any problems for the Australian Batsmen.

Who hasn't had trouble against extreme pace.

 

[Zinzan]

Who hasn't had trouble against extreme pace.

exactly

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

I'd like to know what is considered a "seaming" wicket according to Haydens critics??

Any wicket on which Hayden fails.

 

[mavric41]

Well there can't have been too many in the last four years.

 

[Zinzan]

You would have thought in the 3 or 4 years in a row (whatever it was) of scoring 1000+ runs in a calender year he may have come up against a seaming track. Or have they ALL been marble??

 

[tooextracool]

Agree entirely ....Its almost like suggesting Murali does bowl well on dry cracking pitches on the 5th day...

even though hes bowled well throughout the world on all of days 1-4?

 

[tooextracool]

You would have thought in the 3 or 4 years in a row (whatever it was) of scoring 1000+ runs in a calender year he may have come up against a seaming track. Or have they ALL been marble??

which is precisely what ive been explaining all along. ive said its a rare case, but it is precisely whats happened. and no i havent said that hes never come up on a seaming track. ive said that on the rare occasions that he has hes failed, but because its only been in a few games it hasnt affected his average.

 

[Zinzan]

even though hes bowled well throughout the world on all of days 1-4?

I was being sarcastic about Murali, I was trying to illustrate what an obserd comment you've made of Hayden....

You should recognise Sarcasim when you see it.

 

[tooextracool]

Which wicket in Australia would be a seaming wicket if the Gabba is not. It is one of the few times when the captain ins the toss he thinks about putting the opposition in.

took you a while to figure out the problem didnt it? fact is almost every wicket in the last few years in australia has been flat.

 

[tooextracool]

I was being sarcastic about Murali, I was trying to illustrate what an obserd comment you've made of Hayden....

You should recognise Sarcasim when you see it.

and you should realise the difference between fact and not fact. what im saying is that i could point out a million instances where murali has actually bowled well on days 1-4, which would easily prove the person who made the comment wrong. but i cant do that with hayden, hence there is a significant different difference between the 2 comments. the fact that the only argument you can use to come up against me is "but he averages over 50 in test cricket" says enough about facts

 

[Zinzan]

which is precisely what ive been explaining all along. ive said its a rare case, but it is precisely whats happened. and no i havent said that hes never come up on a seaming track. ive said that on the rare occasions that he has hes failed, but because its only been in a few games it hasnt affected his average.

Why don't you just answer my question as to which Pitches in the world you would consider seaming tracks?? Since your adament that Hayden fails on seming pitches, you must have some example??

 

[Zinzan]

and you should realise the difference between fact and not fact. what im saying is that i could point out a million instances where murali has actually bowled well on days 1-4, which would easily prove the person who made the comment wrong. but i cant do that with hayden, hence there is a significant different difference between the 2 comments. the fact that the only argument you can use to come up against me is "but he averages over 50 in test cricket" says enough about facts

Where-as your only argument is that he doesn't play well on seaming tracks full stop.

 

[tooextracool]

ive done it a million times before. nonetheless i will give you every occasion on which hayden came across a seamer friendly wicket since his return.
the 2nd, 3rd and 4th test of the series in england in 01, durban 02, antigua(1st inning)
and cairns vs SL.

 

[Zinzan]

ive done it a million times before. nonetheless i will give you every occasion on which hayden came across a seamer friendly wicket since his return.
the 2nd, 3rd and 4th test of the series in england in 01, durban 02, antigua(1st inning)
and cairns vs SL.

Right, so only 6 tests in probably around 100 innings since his return. Hardly significant....I'm sure he would have played on more seaming tracks than that?

 

[tooextracool]

then lets hear you name some examples then, because i cant clearly find any occasions where he has. ive said that when he has played on them hes looked clearly poor against it, he could very well make improvements against it much like he did against spin before he went to india, but the fact is that until now hes been miserable.

 

[Zinzan]

then lets hear you name some examples then, because i cant clearly find any occasions where he has. ive said that when he has played on them hes looked clearly poor against it, he could very well make improvements against it much like he did against spin before he went to india, but the fact is that until now hes been miserable.

Okay- just off the top of my head...I remember a brilliant 100 against NZ in the first test 2001-02 at5 the Gabba on a very seaming track. After Hayden and Langer put on over 200 the middle order crumbled...

As i said thats just off the top of my head and I'm sure I can come up with some others.....

 

[tooextracool]

really? even though gilchrist came in and hammered 118 after that and of course of all players brett lee hammered 61! not to mention of course that both warne and gillespie got 20s. just because the middle order collapsed, it doesnt mean that it was seamer friendly. and the fact that NZ absolutely hammered australia in the 4th inning scoring at 4.8 runs an over only emphasises that the pitch was flat. not to mention of course that not one side managed to dismiss the other side in any of the innings.