How would 80s WI and 2000s Australia fare in unbeatable current India?

[subshakerz]

Ok I am tired now . Everyone is free to believe what they believe. I believe that we might edge both series 2-1 but won’t be surprised if other side also win 2-1 . No one is demolishing one another .

Common sense position. It will be a tight series.

 

[R!TTER]

He is one bat not an entire lineup.

Oz even at their best were not great players of spin.

Khwaja was also very good . And so was Labu

Khawaja was batting with very little pressure when we imploded in the first innings, Marnus was one review away from another failure that test - RGS didn't take that review. Khawaja's best innings was similar to Smith's in 2017 with little scoreboard pressure & some amount of luck, although Smith was dropped more times.

Balanced pitches means the superiority of Aus and WI batting and all-round bowling will eventually shine through as the series goes along.

It also means that better bowlers, suited to those conditions, would take more wickets. I'd back our bowlers to dismiss the opposition more often/quickly on such tracks!

 

[Sunil1z]

Oz even at their best were not great players of spin.
Khawaja was batting with very little pressure when we imploded in the first innings, Marnus was one review away from another failure that test - RGS didn't take that review. Khwaja's best innings was similar to Smith's in 2017 with little scoreboard pressure & some amount of luck, although Smith was dropped more times.

Khwaja is the best opener of the last 3 years . Why don’t you believe in giving other side some credit?

 

[Gob]

WI in India '74: Chandra, Bedi and Prasana
WI in India '78: Chandra, Bedi (2nd WI team)
WI in Pakistan '80: Qadir, Qasim
WI in pakistan 86: Tauseef and Qadir
England '76: Underwood

To say WI would get massacred would be to imply that either of Australia or England that recently toured india were better than WI (inference). They weren't. Yes we assume that the WI are given enough prep time, the likes of Lloyd and Kalli and Greenidge would find a way. Again, WI would not win but they won't get steam rolled.

Now imagine the reverse, transporting India now back to the 70s /80s without DRS and no bouncer rules....

Those spinners have nothing on Ashwin and Jadeja in India tbh. India have 17 straight series wins at home ffs and before this generation, they were barely winning clean sweeps even under Dhoni. People don't seem to understand exactly how dominant they are

Although my point I was making may not have been clearer. What I'm saying is that the very first series they play, India will absolutely dominate but eventually great teams will find their feat in second or third attempts.

Also which WI paceman was great with the reverse? Because that's the only way the pace attack would succeed. Asking this since I genuinely don't know and WI pacemen don't usually come up when people discuss great exponents of reverse

 

[R!TTER]

Khwaja is the best opener of the last 3 years . Why don’t you believe in giving other side some credit?

That's fine but we're talking about Aus best side & WI, he wouldn't make it to either of them. In the context of this thread he's irrelevant.

Also which WI paceman was great with the reverse? Because that's the only way the pace attack would succeed. Asking this since I genuinely don't know and WI pacemen don't usually come up when people discuss great exponents of reverse

Most great (A tear) pacers in India did a lot of damage with the new ball, this is assuming pitches aren't like Ranchi 2017 or Ahmedabad 2023 et al.

 

[Socerer 01]

And I am telling you Great fast bowlers don’t depend on pitch .
I can’t believe I am arguing against my own side . We might beat WI 2-1 but we aren’t thrashing them 3-0 or 3-1 which you believe .

so why have fast bowlers like Cummins or Rabada not won series for their teams then? they may not be comparable in stature and skill to Marshall but they’re not **** either

 

[Socerer 01]

Are you comparing Bazball to WI side of 80s ?
This England side can’t beat even Aus at home and they are comparable to WI of 80 s .

no im arguing that it isnt a given that they will make lottery pitches like you claim when everyone said they would for this series due to cowardice and yet didnt

when did i even compare bazball to that team? dude why are you going off in random tangents

 

[Sunil1z]

so why have fast bowlers like Cummins or Rabada not won series for their teams then? they may not be comparable in stature and skill to Marshall but they’re not **** either

Because Cummins is alone. Marshall isn’t. He is supported by Garner , Holding and Roberts .

 

[Gob]

so why have fast bowlers like Cummins or Rabada not won series for their teams then? they may not be comparable in stature and skill to Marshall but they’re not **** either

I'd cut cummins some slack for personal reasons.

At the end of the day, you need to be able to reverse the ball. That's the only way you are going to succeed

 

[subshakerz]

Are Ashwin/Jadeja are bigger threat than spinners that Aus and WI faced? Yes, but those sides were well tested against quality spinners.

Are Aus 2017 and 2023 good batting lineups? Relatively yes, but clearly not as good as WI and Aus 2000s.

Have Kohli's India faced any bowling lineup approaching the quality of WI and Aus? No.

 

[Socerer 01]

Because Cummins is alone. Marshall isn’t. He is supported by Garner , Holding and Roberts .

you dont think that maybe the best trio of pace bowlers Australia have ever had in their test history in Starc, Hazlewood and a good spinner like Lyon isnt sufficient support???

 

[Gob]

Because Cummins is alone. Marshall isn’t. He is supported by Garner , Holding and Roberts .

How do you suppose they'll get the wickets?

 

[Socerer 01]

I'd cut cummins some slack for personal reasons.

At the end of the day, you need to be able to reverse the ball. That's the only way you are going to succeed

i didnt mean it as a dig against Cummins tbf, i love that dude

im just pointing out that people are assuming way too many things about how great and untouched by factors like form, fitness, condition suitability these two teams from the older eras are while applying every filter of scrutiny possible to the Indian one because the latter is more recent, thats been my biggest issue of strawmanning with the entire exercise

 

[Xix2565]

They were far better tested.

Balanced pitches means the superiority of Aus and WI batting and all-round bowling will eventually shine through as the series goes along.

Subzibeta absolutely hating the idea of a reasonable discussion.

 

[Sunil1z]

you dont think that maybe the best trio of pace bowlers Australia have ever had in their test history in Starc, Hazlewood and a good spinner like Lyon isnt sufficient support???

No . They lost to IND twice at home . They aren’t as good as WI of 80s or AUS 99-07

 

[Gob]

Are Ashwin/Jadeja are bigger threat than spinners that Aus and WI faced? Yes, but those sides were well tested against quality spinners.

Are Aus 2017 and 2023 good batting lineups? Relatively yes, but clearly not as good as WI and Aus 2000s.

Have Kohli's India faced any bowling lineup approaching the quality of WI and Aus? No.

They are playing in India though. Cricket is all about conditions

I think Aus would fare better with Warne and McGill

 

[Socerer 01]

No . They lost to IND twice at home . They aren’t as good as WI of 80s or AUS 99-07

because their batting failed ffs and because bowling in present day Indian pitches is ****ing hard

jeez how many more random tangents and circles are you going to go into

 

[Sunil1z]

Subzibeta absolutely hating the idea of a reasonable discussion.

And what are you guys doing? Neither side are doing reasonable discussion.

 

[Xix2565]

Are Ashwin/Jadeja are bigger threat than spinners that Aus and WI faced? Yes, but those sides were well tested against quality spinners.

Are Aus 2017 and 2023 good batting lineups? Relatively yes, but clearly not as good as WI and Aus 2000s.

Have Kohli's India faced any bowling lineup approaching the quality of WI and Aus? No.

Again, absolutely trying to dunk on a discussion with delusions. Is there a point to your posts here, or has it always been irrelevant rubbish?

 

[Xix2565]

And what are you guys doing? Neither side are doing reasonable discussion.

I made my points, Subzi is having a fit about it and you're going with him for some reason. Like come on.