TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
They lost 8 for 72 in the 1st test at Dubai. Pak's overly cautious approach since then seems to be a by-product of that.
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*Official* - Pakistan in New Zealand 2010/2011
- Thread starter Faisal1985
- Start date
smash84
The Tiger King
Oh.....I had forgotten that......
TT Boy
Hall of Fame Member
Worrying thing is, I don't think New Zealand's biggest problem is the batting. McCullum, Taylor, Ryder and Williamson all pick themselves but Martin, Southee and Arnel don't. Southee bowled pretty well to be honest without being particularly threatening but Martin was gun barrel and bowled at a pedestrian pace (as did Southee and Arnel for that matter).
vcs
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Yeah, agreed. Apart from that Martin spell in Ahmedabad, you just can't see one of their bowlers really ripping through the opposition. It's going to take a lot of disciplined batting and scoreboard pressure to put them in a position to get results.
Howsie
International Captain
And he's copping an absolute shellacking from both the public and media because of it. It's a shame though, he's basically been carrying this batting lineup since he came into test cricket, one form slump and everyones after him. It looks like he's replaced Brendon McCullum and become the media's new target after he picked up that ridiculous amount of money in the IPL auction.
smash84
The Tiger King
You can hope for a bad day from Pak too. They are quite simply the most unpredictable side in the world. They might just fold within 3 days themselves after crushing NZ this week. When you are playing Pakistan there is always hope
Zinzan
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Haha, some truth in that, McCullum suddenly seems back in the good-books after that double ton & top scoring in this latest debacle. To be fair to Taylor, at least he has been regularly dismissed playing that dire slog-sweep in recent Tests.
Leg Cutter
School Boy/Girl Cricketer
Now what would NZ do to level the series
Any Changes in the side? or stick with the same combination??
In My opinion R.Taylor should dropped from the side because he's not in the good form
Any Changes in the side? or stick with the same combination??
In My opinion R.Taylor should dropped from the side because he's not in the good form
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
The basin, as a venue, has always been a lot more conducive to swing. Hopefully there should be a lot more movement in the air for Martin and Southee at least.
I think the bigger issue for New Zealand is who will do the into-the-wind work. Can't say that anyone in our current bowling lineup is particularly suited to it.
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Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Chris Martin usually bowls stupidly good new ball spells at the Basin doesn't he? Just one of those random things.
straw man
Hall of Fame Member
I've been hoping for a while that Arnel would follow the Iain O'Brien career path - break into the team while in early 30s, do the hard jobs and continue to improve with age. Then once Martin retires become the senior bowler to support Tim Southee. Not giving up yet, but still needs to add a little more pace like O'Brien did.
Very uncertain about whether I'd like to see McIntosh retained for the next test... no matter how awful he looked he is due runs and will know he's playing for his spot, and dropping him would require a reorganisation of the whole batting order. But if it gives NZ a better chance of winning the next test then it needs to be done.
No other changes worthwhile for NZ - for a change I have no complaints about selection. It's those much more difficult to manage and difficult to define things like player mindset that need to improve.
Very uncertain about whether I'd like to see McIntosh retained for the next test... no matter how awful he looked he is due runs and will know he's playing for his spot, and dropping him would require a reorganisation of the whole batting order. But if it gives NZ a better chance of winning the next test then it needs to be done.
No other changes worthwhile for NZ - for a change I have no complaints about selection. It's those much more difficult to manage and difficult to define things like player mindset that need to improve.
Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
He certainly did in these two matches:
3rd Test: New Zealand v South Africa at Wellington, Mar 26-30, 2004 | Cricket Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/64134.html
But over the last few years his performances at the basin have been a bit more mixed (ie. last season, he took 4/52 in the match against Pakistan, but then managed only about 1/a gazillion against Australia later in the year).
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Bahnz
Hall of Fame Member
Not sure if I can ever see that happening. O'Brien was quickish (135-140) when he first came into the team in 2005 in his late 20's, and didn't have anything like the history of injuries that Arnel has. Yes, in his last couple of seasons he added another 5k's of pace, but if Arnel succeeds in doing that he'd still only be a 130-135 bowler, not nearly quick enough to cause any real problems for international batsmen. And I don't think he'll manage even that. Arnel strikes me as the type of bowler who's pretty much set in his ways and won't really change very much over the remainder of his career. That isn't a bad thing, he is on the wrong side of 30 afterall. Making any noticeable improvements in speed would probably require some pretty radical changes to his run up and delivery, and the last act of your career generally isn't the best time to try and make big changes.
straw man
Hall of Fame Member
You may be right, however even if he bowled consistently 130-135 and was very accurate then I think he could do a job for NZ over the next few years.
I would not expect him to get up to 140, but I would like to see him become the guy Vettori turns to to bowl a lot of overs accurately and exert control, and at least dry up the runs. And he should always be a bit more than that on any pitch that offers seam movement. This requires some improvement from where he is now, but doesn't seem unattainable to me.
I would not expect him to get up to 140, but I would like to see him become the guy Vettori turns to to bowl a lot of overs accurately and exert control, and at least dry up the runs. And he should always be a bit more than that on any pitch that offers seam movement. This requires some improvement from where he is now, but doesn't seem unattainable to me.
Woodster
International Captain
Yes I've since seen the rest of the debacle and agree with your judgement on the dismissals. Ryder's sure was a beauty, thought Riaz looked pretty good in this Test, be interesting to see how he goes in the next one.
Absolutely he could do a job at 130-135 (I hate this speed nonsense, last mention). Look at the ball that got Misbah, on a completely flat deck, and tell me that's not a guy with the right tools to be an effective bowler in Test cricket. Add in height and from all I've seen a good command of accuracy and there is no reason he can't be a good third seamer - a very good third seamer.
All this abandoning ship/giving up on your side in this thread, incidentally, is pretty weak. Were we not singing the praises of how resilient our side was only 2 Tests again in India? Seems like some of us might be talkback callers/Mark Watson.