***Official** Malaysia Tri-Series

[aussie]

Pathan situation

For a neutral its unfortunate to the bloke struggle like this especially with the ball, all who remember him in Australia in 2004 & throughout that top year knows how good he can be.

I think his main problem is the amount of cricket he has had to played & the high responsible he has had to take up @ such a young age. His situation is a perfect example of how this jam packed international schedule can kill young talents.

 

[Anil]

And burn them.....

i thought i was the biggest pessimist around... looks like i've got stiff competition...

 

[adharcric]

The Pathan situation is confusing, i think i saw him bowl in his first few test/ODIs and i thought he looked really good.

Now he seems to have reverted to being a batsman who bowls medium pace, my thoughts are that he started concentrating too much on his batting when he got put at number 3 and now he maybe has the mentality of 'even if i bowl crap, i can still get runs and stay in the side'

Someone in the Indian set-up needs to sort him out, drop him if need be, he can be so much better than he is atm.

The added responsibility certainly seems to have gotten to him, but he did so well in this season before going to the West Indies. Some say it's because he was bowling at home, but his line-and-length and control was brilliant back then as well. He certainly needs to be dropped for at least the next match. Dravid needs to explain to him that his primary role is that of a strike bowler and that coming in at #3 as a pinch-hitter is not what he's there for. This Pathan experiment is no longer an experiment, now it's just having adverse effects. Dhoni and Raina should be tried out at #3 too, both are being wasted down the order.

As for what happened yesterday, Pathan got a very good delivery from Johnson. Once again, we saw Dravid getting out and the rest collapsing in a heap. Not sure if this means that Dravid should revert back to #3 and let Sehwag open again.

 

[Jono]

All Indian fans having a whinge, don't forget Harbhajan's performance. He was quite brilliant. Australia should have scored 290+ with their start.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Precisely why I clearly stated that while I agree with the headline, I don't agree with what the Indian media was trying to imply. The West Indies were not on the verge of losing, but they were not on the verge of winning either. It was still wide open at that point. No one can say that the India were simply denied 5 points, but they were certainly denied the chance to get those 5 points. Similarly, the West Indies weren't simply gifted 5 points, but they were certainly helped along their way considerably by the rain.

The West Indies weren't saved by rain. That's the only valid point here.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Just in case you don't have a clue what you're talking about, this is the same Irfan Pathan who has averaged 21.51 in 2006, with 29 wickets in 17 matches and an economy rate of 4.77. All that includes the out-of-form performances against the West Indies. He's certainly a better ODI bowler than Bradshaw, Taylor or Edwards. Don't take cheap shots when he's going through a bad patch.

Paints a bleak picture of West Indian cricket, doesn't it?

Ooooh, because I've been so hyping up the West Indian bowling attack right? How childish is that, that you feel the need to state "well at least he's better than your guys". I'm well aware of the shortcomings of the West Indies. I don't see where that comes into this.

There is no way that Pathan is a better ODI bowler than Bradshaw btw. There's a tad bit of delusion in there.

All I was saying is that the Indian attack is pretty unfortunate if they can't afford to drop an out-of-form Pathan. Now I'm waiting for you to tell me I'm wrong.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Pathan to silent all his critics this game watch......

Top post.

 

[adharcric]

Ooooh, because I've been so hyping up the West Indian bowling attack right? How childish is that, that you feel the need to state "well at least he's better than your guys". I'm well aware of the shortcomings of the West Indies. I don't see where that comes into this.

There is no way that Pathan is a better ODI bowler than Bradshaw btw. There's a tad bit of delusion in there.

All I was saying is that the Indian attack is pretty unfortunate if they can't afford to drop an out-of-form Pathan. Now I'm waiting for you to tell me I'm wrong.

Oh I definitely agree that an out-of-form Pathan (like right now) should be dropped. It just seemed like you were taking a cheap shot at the guy like some of our pessimistic Indian fans around here and ignoring the fact that he was an excellent ODI opening bowler for just about the entire year before he arrived in the West Indies. He's pathetic right now, but you should be aware that he's a very good ODI bowler when in form.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Oh I definitely agree that an out-of-form Pathan (like right now) should be dropped. It just seemed like you were taking a cheap shot at the guy like some of our pessimistic Indian fans around here and ignoring the fact that he was an excellent ODI opening bowler for just about the entire year before he arrived in the West Indies. He's pathetic right now, but you should be aware that he's a very good ODI bowler when in form.

Well his record is good against pretty much everyone other than Australia and the West Indies. Right now he's lost the plot.

 

[adharcric]

The West Indies weren't saved by rain. That's the only valid point here.

Helped, not saved. I guess you could say "potentially saved", but that doesn't mean anything. I think we both know what we mean, let's move on ...

 

[adharcric]

Well his record is good against pretty much everyone other than Australia and the West Indies. Right now he's lost the plot.

Right. It's not like he was bowling the way he is right now and poorer teams weren't able to hit him earlier. He played against Pakistan, South Africa and Sri Lanka and bowled quite well ... if he'd played the Aussies (or WI) at that time I reckon he would've had some success. Anyways, dire conditions right now for IKP ...

 

[Jono]

They are both off spinners and I was talking of the "pssibility' of 'considering/discussing' swapping between them.

The fact that Powar is in the team while someone of the caliber of Kumble is not (besides the dact that Kumble would bring variety to spin department) shows that Powar is rated highly.

To talk of medium pacers is to show one's immaturity.

To talk of Harbhajan being india's best bowler is satrange if one has to go back and back to find proof of that.

In the whole of 2006, Harbhajan has been struggling.

He took 5 wickets in the first game he played in this calendar year against England at home since then he has been far from impressive.

Powar played two games in March 2004 and never played again till this calendar year. How does talking of Harbhajan's performance of any period before 2006 make a comparison with Powar more relevant?

In the 9 games that both of them have played in together this year, Harbhajan has 10 wkts at 36.6 , a strike rate of 54 while Powar has 15 wickets at 27 each with a strike rate of 34.9 !

I was just suggesting that Powar could be considered too but since you seem to feel that Harbhajan has some kind of permanent hold on an India place I thought I might enlighten you with some information you may have missed.

By the way, forget the statistics, I consider Romesh Powar a better off spinner than Harbhajan Singh and this is based on what I can see. The statistics just happen to be good too.

I know most people disagree with this but thats okay

Hindsight is 20/20, but Harbhajan was brilliant yesterday, and whilst I rate Powar higly, its either both of them or only Harbhajan. Personally, 'd play both, adds to the batting. But if having to choose, Harbhajan has the "runs on the board" so to speak, and is less likely to wilt under pressure in the WC.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Not really, he got a ball from Edwards that kept low & played a bad shot after looking very good earlier today.

I don't think he has looked "very good" at any point in the two games. He played two good shots off Agarkar, but he looked nervous and fidgety, which isn't the Jaques you see in domestic cricket at all. Really shows how harsh people have been on Katich. The guy went out there and made 30 odd in the first game, saw off the tough period with the new ball and saw the team make 280 and win the game, while Jaques looks all over the place and is the first batsman out in both games, and it's Katich who gets criticised.

Anyway, I'd expect a team like this for the next game:

Hayden
Katich
Ponting
Watson
Symonds
Hussey
Haddin
Hogg
Lee
Clark
McGrath

Clarke, Cullen, Bracken and Martyn will come in again for the last game, you'd expect.

 

[adharcric]

I'd have the same team for the Aussies. Perhaps Martyn could come in for Watson, but that would mean only five bowling options.

For the West Indies, the team should be as follows:

Gayle
Chanderpaul
Sarwan
Lara
Morton
Samuels
Bravo
Baugh
Bradshaw
Taylor
Collymore

 

[Jono]

I'd give Jaques one more crack.

 

[adharcric]

I'd give Jaques one more crack.

Jaques, Cosgrove and Johnson are due to return to Australia.

 

[vic_orthdox]

I remember watching a fair bit of Pathan over the past 6 months when I've been lucky enough to be away - and it amazed me how many of his wickets came from bad balls. It was like watching the medium pace version of Stuart MacGill; he wasn't bowling terribly, but he seemed to get away with a lot of the bad balls he bowled. I think this to an extent hid a problem that's been arising for a while.

 

[R_D]

All Indian fans having a whinge, don't forget Harbhajan's performance. He was quite brilliant. Australia should have scored 290+ with their start.

Harbhjan bowled brilliantly yesterday but lets see how he does against players like symmonds, Hussey etc. DOn't want to undermine turbinators performance yesterday but as we all know soon as he gets hit for few runs... his bowling just goes downhill.
IF anything he benefited from Aus in-experienced middle order who didn't really attack him much.
I'm getting quite sick of seniors like Harbhjan taking their place guranteed and only perofrmign once in a blue moon.

 

[Mister Wright]

, and it's Katich who gets criticised.

I think you're undervaluing experience for this one. Katich has plenty of international experience, especially compared to Jaques. I don't know why you keep backing Katich, Katich shouldn't be getting out after all these starts. As the anchor he needs to occupy the crease for 35+ overs, especially if he is going to use up valuable balls at the start of the innings without going on with it.

 

[Nate]

Not sure if I agree with those three going home. At least they got some time on the big stage.