**Official** England in The West Indies

[Craig]

Andre brought up a very interisting point when I was talking to him earlier. What now for Harmison? Not many people are going to read past the figures, so immediately he's got amazing pressure put on him. What now? Will he carry on and become one of the best in the world (or at least damn good) like Ntini, or will he follow Brett Lee and many others on the path to under-achievement? At the end of his career we could quite easily see "...apart from his 7-12 against the West Indies he failed to scale such heights again." Now that he's done it he will be expected to perform a lot more, against a lot stronger teams, against batsmen who actually value their wickets. Let's see what happens. Best in the world or down that lonely path? I'm going for the latter, seems I'm not the only one.

That is always going to be the case.

The expectations on VVS Laxman were unbelieveably huge from the Indian public and it effected him producing inconsistent form until the Indian tour of Australia.

 

[chris.hinton]

Well done England a Great 4th days play. Harmison was Lethal and got great Potenial to be the best quick in the World,

My rating

Trescothick: 6
Vaughan 7
Butcher 7
Hussain 6
Thorpe 6
Flintoff 6
Read 6
Giles 5
Jones 7
Harmison 9
Hoggard 7

 

[marc71178]

Certainly I don't see Liam being told he's "small" here,

No, because rather than fight a clearly losing battle, he's kept away from here...

 

[Mister Wright]

I apologise for not following this thread closer, but I have been following the series (as I do all Windies series'). Very dissapointed the Windies didn't put up a much better fight, although I'm pleased for Harmisson, I've always thought the critics were too harsh on his performances in Australia.

Bring on the 2nd test!

 

[Craig]

I will be interested to see if the WI can bounce back as it no doubt will be in their minds.

Is it true Liam that the WI issued a public apology?

 

[Tim]

Yes it is true, Cricinfo just released it.

Apparently 4 West Indian players were seen drinking & partying in the stands after the match!

 

[V Reddy]

Four players partying just after an embarrassing loss. How shamelessness can that be ?

 

[V Reddy]

And you're one of them. Seriously, all you've done now is inflate my ego, by informing me that my knowledge is more accurate than 'well over a million' other people's.

As I've said, 'Hara' is stomach, 'Kiri' is cut. Gee, figure out how that works. I'm sure you're smart enough.

Harakiri - There's a dictionary definition for you.

Alternatively, you could look up the movie 'Harakiri' on Amazon.com.

Also Rik, I'm quite sure you're not noted for your spelling.

I was happy to explain it the first time, but now I've just had to prove myself right once and for all. :P

Never knew it was a Japanese word :duh: . It is used quite a lot here. I thought it was an another word for suicide in English.

 

[Craig]

Yes it is true, Cricinfo just released it.

Apparently 4 West Indian players were seen drinking & partying in the stands after the match!

An absolute disgraceful act.

Who are they? They must be punished either with a fine or being dropped.

 

[Tim]

They have not been named, but we'll probably find out sooner rather than later.

 

[Craig]

Never knew it was a Japanese word :duh: . It is used quite a lot here. I thought it was an another word for suicide in English.

If you make cut your own stomch (a proper cut right inside) I dont think you will live for very long.

I believe it is how Suamairi used that method when they lost and lived.

 

[Arjun]

Is any channel in India showing this series? What about Ten Sport? I read they are. Or is ESPNSTAR going to show the matches after the series ends, or in the middle?

 

[Gaijin-san]

If you make cut your own stomch (a proper cut right inside) I dont think you will live for very long.

I believe it is how Suamairi used that method when they lost and lived.

Samurai would also do it when they had shamed themselves. The idea of it was it was staged in front of certain people, and it was supposed to be quick and relatively painless. If they displayed any signs of pain their servant would be standing behind them with their sword and would cut the nerves in their neck to make them feel nothing.

 

[garage flower]

Now it's time for us Windies supporters to look forward to the next Test I guess. It will be played here in Trinidad, so no TV coverage, but I'll be going to see a day (day 3 likely) so hopefully we'll hold out until then. :P

I would suggest adding another right-hander into the mix to add some variety to the left-hand bias, but Gayle, Smith, Chanderpaul and Hinds are supposedly the best of the batsmen in the region (although only two of them looked it) so that won't be happening. That in mind, I'd keep the batting lineup as is. Hopefully Lara will be fit. If not, they'll stick Powell or Dwayne Smith in there. Of those two I prefer Powell, but ideally I would like to see Floyd Reifer.

The bowling will have to change. Sanford must go. He shouldn't even be allowed to spectate at Test cricket anymore - dreadfully substandard he is. Edwards shouldn't play unless he's 100% fit. Yes, we want to beat England, but preserving his career is more important than a quick fix of glory. This is the way I would have it for the next match...

CH Gayle
DS Smith
RR Sarwan
BC Lara *
S Chanderpaul
RO Hinds
RD Jacobs +
D Mohammed - a spinner should play at the QPO
M Dillon
TL Best
CD Collymore

If Edwards is fit, I'd pick him for either Collymore or Dillon. Tough choice, but Dillon took 8 wickets for QPCC (admittedly not a high standard of cricket though), so he may get the edge.

Had we won or drawn this Test, I would play Ravi Rampaul for Sanford in the next one. However, I would like to see some experience in there with the situation as is.

I'm hesitant to pick Dave Mohammed right now. He seems very much out of form at the moment.

Nice line about Sanford, the only positive in realtion to him was that his fielding seemed much improved (though there's only 1 way to go from abject).

I think I'd go along with your team for the 2nd test. For all his faults, Dillon should have played at Sabina and - worryingly - the top 6 is probably the best available at the moment. Hang on a minute though! Is that - no it can't be - Daren Ganga's number I can see Sir Viv dialing?! Noooooooooooo..........

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

West Indies at their worst, are the poorest team in the world.

Agreed that they can be pretty bad.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I will be interested to see if the WI can bounce back as it no doubt will be in their minds.

Is it true Liam that the WI issued a public apology?

This is true.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Gayle: 1/10 - did he even play in this game?
Smith 9/10 - very purposeful.
Sarwan 2/10 - I like his captaincy - attacking.
Lara - 3/10 - lowest rating I've ever given him.
Chanders - 1/10 - horrible case of deja vu.
Hinds - 7.5/10 - well-tried young man.
Jacobs - 6/10 - solid keeping and meaningful knock.
Best - 9/10 - can't really fault him.
Sanford - 1/10 - for the # of wickets he took.
Collymore - 6/10 - bowled well without success.
Edwards - 9/10 - great passion.

 

[garage flower]

Pretty much agreed again (this is getting boring). I'd give Sanford a 3 because I don't think he bowled that badly relative to his talent and his fielding was good. I'd also give Sarwan a 1. He got a pair by missing two straight balls and there was at least one inept fielding incident that cost 3 runs. A decent little captaincy cameo doesn't provide any mitigation in my book. It might be knitpicking, but I'd also give Best an 8.5. Could have bowled a fuller length more often.

On reflection, I would also add McGarrell and Collins as possible contenders for the 2nd test

 

[Top_Cat]

Well done to Steve Harmison, a guy who I've defended from the increasingly indefensible Rik on many occasions (quote his stats at me all you want; I still rate him. Remember, Steve Waugh took almost 30 Tests to score his first Test ton and one could say he's succeeded somewhat). Here's to hoping that this leads to many more successes for England because a sport in which the country who invented it is poor (or not 'one of the best') can't be good for the sport overall.

I knew Harmie had it in him and I don't care what anyone says; to bowl out a team including Lara, Chanders, Gayle and Sarwan, you need to bowl exceptionally well. Anyone who denies that or tries in vain to portray it as 'luck' has NO IDEA what it's like to bowl to batsmen of any quality.

 

[tooextracool]

No one has mentioned Hoggard yet, so I'll be the 1st. I think he showed exactly how useful he is for England, as the leader of the attack. He's the only England bowler willing to consistantly pitch it up so he will go for a few but will allways trouble the batsmen with his swing, and he bowled well in this Test without full reward. Jones came through well, and when he pitches up he can be deadly, but Hoggard has been unfairly forgotten, he played a blinder.

no doubt hoggard bowled brilliantly and stuck to his role of keeping it tight. he mentioned before the series that he could be like angus fraser was on their last tour so it seems quite clear that he knows his role in the team. however i am still skeptical about whether he is a good enough bowler to bowl when the ball doesnt swing or seam much. his performances in australia were nothing less than dreadful. i would like to see hoggard keep that mcgrath like line just outside the off stump coz no matter how good u are you're gonna have problems playing that line. however with his lack of height and pace i seriously doubt he can be anything special.