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***Official*** England in New Zealand 2018

straw man

straw man

Hall of Fame Member
Moss said:
I do agree with this bit, in 2014-15 NZ were all about taking wickets and doing their darndest to bowl sides out. Helped that even Anderson was a certified jammy wicket - taker. Don't know if playing Astle at 7 is the answer but it's worth a shot. Can't see de Grandhomme not being in the lineup though.

Gotta get Henry in there for mine. Offers far more penetrative abilities than Southee even if he's not too good at the death. Was impressive in that last ODI against Pakistan and its a damn shame he gets as little game time as he does.
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I was thinking about exactly this and how we moved a long way from that approach after the last World Cup (especially with Southee not taking new ball wickets any more), before moving back a little lately with attacking options of Ferguson and/or a legspinner.

So it's an interesting question of whether the conditions in the next World Cup will reward attacking bowling or whether it will be more about damage limitation. I hope it's the former and we can focus on winning by taking wickets to bowl sides out, or at least restrict run rates that way.

To that end, can stick our current ODI bowling options in buckets along the attacking/defensive continuum:

Attacking:
Sodhi
Astle
Ferguson

Somewhat attacking:
Boult
Henry

Somewhat defensive:
Santner

Defensive:
Southee
Milne

Boult the first selected and then Santner. The remainder would be chosen based on conditions, though I would never select all three of Santner, Southee and Milne in the same side any more - just doesn't take enough wickets. You wouldn't select all three of the most attacking options either.

Haven't included anyone outside those top 8 bowlers; I would be surprised if anyone else managed to push their way into the side before the next World Cup.
 
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NZTailender

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
I want an attacking side, none of this namby pamby stuff

1. G Phillips+
2. C Munro
3. M Guptill
4. M Chapman
5. C de Grandhomme
6. T Seifert
7. T Astle
8. M Henry
9. L Ferguson
10. B Wheeler
11. T Boult

100 ao or 400+ (for batting and bowling)
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

Request Your Custom Title Now!
SteveNZ said:
Southee's place in the side should absolutely be up for consideration. In fact I'd drop him tomorrow in ODI cricket. Watching him at the ground, there's no zip to his bowling. .
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It's easy to forget just how good an ODI bowler Kyle Mills was up-front. Terrible at the death, but that 7-8 overs you got from him up-front was so valuable for so many years. Even if he did start to decline right at the end somewhat.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

Request Your Custom Title Now!
NZTailender said:
I want an attacking side, none of this namby pamby stuff

1. G Phillips+
2. C Munro
3. M Guptill
4. M Chapman
5. C de Grandhomme
6. T Seifert
7. T Astle
8. M Henry
9. L Ferguson
10. B Wheeler
11. T Boult

100 ao or 400+ (for batting and bowling)
Click to expand...
I wouldn't normally mind this thinking, but if we're honest we were badly exposed in the CT last year because we didn't have enough batsmen like Taylor and KW who could actually bat time.
 
P

pdsubbu

Cricket Spectator
Stunning fielding from England. WOW - after a long time!

Silly run outs though.

Jason Roy should be a flying machine!
 
Howsie

Howsie

International Captain
straw man said:
Good to see a side posted and even one that doesn't auto-pick all the ND players ;). Some interesting ones in there:
- Astle over Sodhi - does the batting sway it or do you just prefer Astle's bowling to Sodhi's in ODIs?
- Keeper opening in place of Munro - is it mainly because that's where those two keepers bat domestically? Munro hasn't done much opening in ODIs yet and in fact his record is worse than opening in T20Is, which seems like something he should be able to correct, imo.
- Munro down the order in place of De Grandhomme - you rate his batting higher?
- Five bowlers - you already said your reason for this but the counterpoint is, with Astle coming in at 7, I can see us turning a lot more great starts of 200/4 after 38 into 260/9 after 50. Just like we have a lot of times recently.
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Yeah, pretty much. I honestly don’t know what Astle has done wrong with his short run in the NZ team. Even if you think his and Sodhi’s bowling is even Astle is a better batsman and muuuuuuch better fielder. Obvs with the balance of my team I need an all rounder @ 7 and Astle provides that. de Grandhomme will never get through his 10 so I don’t count him as one.

Um a little bit yes, but mostly because I’d prefer to have Munro down the order where we have lacked power for a good couple of seasons now. You can still score quickly up top by just clearing the in field, NZ don’t have too many Munro’s floating around that can just bang sixes from the get go.

That’s the risk I suppose, but how much of a difference is there between de Grandhomme who is batting seven now and Astle?
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Setting the team up is a little bit tricky atm because we're top four heavy, our best keeper bats prefer to open and our best hitting allrounders can't really bowl.

Feels weird to moan about an NZ team where all the better players prefer to bat higher up the order
 
straw man

straw man

Hall of Fame Member
Good ball from Southee, though the close-up showed a pitch that looked like the surface of the moon (I've only just started watching). That didn't go across Morgan like you might've expected the way Southee rolled his fingers across it - if anything it ducked back in slightly instead,

I was wondering how De Grandhomme bowled 10 overs 1/24 - now I know.
 
straw man

straw man

Hall of Fame Member
Having seen more of this now, it's less of a pitch for spin and plain slow bowling, better for regular medium pace that can take advantage of the variable bounce.

Why isn't Santner bowling though? Richardson's saying he's unlikely to bowl again but why?
 
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