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***Official*** Australia in England (The Ashes)
- Thread starter James
- Start date
simmy
International Regular
EVERYONE READ THIS: http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/engvaus/content/story/218989.html
This is why I am so happy!
This is why I am so happy!
Neil Pickup
Request Your Custom Title Now!
We've got a separate thread on that here.jlo33692 said:
The consensus is Trescothick, (2), Ponting, Vaughan, Pietersen, Flintoff, (7), Warne, Hoggard, Jones, McGrath
Where (2) is an even split between Langer and Strauss and (7) between the two keepers, on the grounds that neither batted well and both dropped a lot.
Gary Pratt twelfth man.
Neil Pickup
Request Your Custom Title Now!
Probably should quanitify TEC's statement - I assume he meant that Gilo's the best batsman out of the spinners who can actually bowl.Prince EWS said:
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Ahh, then he is correct.Neil Pickup said:
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Cameel picked both Langer and Strauss, and left out Trescothick.
Pedro Delgado
International Debutant
To be honest I'd have agreed with a lot of them prior the the series, myself I backed us to win one test, and lose 3-1.simmy said:
Always happy to admit when I'm wrong but
and I got it very, very very wrong.
jlo33692
U19 Debutant
Its very hard to fit many Aussies in when we are going on this series alone and not reputation.
I think this goes to show the difference between the two on this tour,England played as a team and all players put in.Australia played in fits and starts and seemed to play as individuals although when your losing that is how it always appears.Credit has to go to England for not allowing Aus to play to capacity as this is what Aus has done for last 15 years to most teams.They were taken on and beaten at thier own game and it takes a great team to be able to do that. Eng certainly are a top team and will get stronger now. The challenge is on to Aus and all other nations to lift the standard.This must only be a good thing for cricket.The hunted now becomes the hunter.Anyone in England can you tell me if the cricket is still dominating the football over there? when i was leaving it was pleasing to see the footballers pushed back a few pages .Our family even saw something in suburban eng and london that we had never seen before,young kids were playing cricket in the streets. You see that in Aus,india,pak,NZ,Sri l, but never in england ,well not that our family have seen. How good that is for cricket will be shown in the next 10 years as the kids come through.
How good is that for cricket to have a healthy aus /eng/ind/pak/SA/ who said cricket was dying ?
I think this goes to show the difference between the two on this tour,England played as a team and all players put in.Australia played in fits and starts and seemed to play as individuals although when your losing that is how it always appears.Credit has to go to England for not allowing Aus to play to capacity as this is what Aus has done for last 15 years to most teams.They were taken on and beaten at thier own game and it takes a great team to be able to do that. Eng certainly are a top team and will get stronger now. The challenge is on to Aus and all other nations to lift the standard.This must only be a good thing for cricket.The hunted now becomes the hunter.Anyone in England can you tell me if the cricket is still dominating the football over there? when i was leaving it was pleasing to see the footballers pushed back a few pages .Our family even saw something in suburban eng and london that we had never seen before,young kids were playing cricket in the streets. You see that in Aus,india,pak,NZ,Sri l, but never in england ,well not that our family have seen. How good that is for cricket will be shown in the next 10 years as the kids come through.
How good is that for cricket to have a healthy aus /eng/ind/pak/SA/ who said cricket was dying ?
tooextracool
International Coach
neither of them are good enough bowlers.Prince EWS said:
and is batty actually a better batsman, considering that giles has the better FC record?
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
You didnt really mention bowling though - you said Giles was a more capable batsman than all the other spinners. You didnt say how good a spinner they had to be, and there is no doubt that Blackwell and Batty are spinners.tooextracool said:
Mister Wright
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Says a lot about England's future spin bowling prospects then, doesn't it?tooextracool said:
Son Of Coco
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Congratulations to England and their supporters, simply too good for 99/100ths of the series. Andy Flintoff - I'm now utterly convinced! haha A very impressive player.
tooextracool
International Coach
as usual my end of series player ratings:
ENGLAND
trescothick 7/10: despite not actually improving on his troublesome footwork, hes started to leave more balls that are in the danger zone- just outside the off stump going away at the right length. of course the fact that his chief tormentor in past series jason gillespie was run of the mill, glenn mcgrath was fully fit in only one test and kaspa was half the bowler that he can be all helped him a fair bit, but nonetheless still a quality performance that suggests that he might finally be worth as much as his test match batting average suggests. his weakness against seam and swing still exists though, and with that so will his lengthy periods of poor form.
strauss 6/10- a fairly disappointing series until the oval, a liablility against spin gettiing dismissed 6 times in the series by shane warne usually after doing all the hard work and getting a start. however his gutsy performance at the oval managed to round up his series with a fairly decent average.
vaughan 5/10 - another disappointing series with the bat as his test average continues to plummet. at the start of the series he was missing straight balls and at the end of the series he tried to play as stupid a shot as possible, getting himself out twice to part timers and giving ponting his first wicket in over 6 years. while his 166 was a master class in strokeplay it still involved a lot of good fortune. his captaincy on the other hand was exemplary as almost every one of his plans for each batsman payed off.
bell 1/10- hard to see what exactly he contributed in the series, he looked like a walking wicket during his first half century and his prowess against spin is as close to being 0 as possible.
Pietersen 7/10- averaging less than 40 before his final innings and dropping every single catch that came his way meant that he owed england. and despite getting several lives, he played the innings of his career and once against proved that he is a man for the big occasion. his temperament is probably the best in the entire english side, with all his best performances in the series coming when england were in deep trouble.
flintoff 10/10- cant say much about someone who will have this series named as his own. he surprised everyone when for the first time in his career started to reverse swing the ball both ways and along with jones caused plenty of problems. the only thing left for him to prove now is to perform away from home with the bat. what surprised me was the ease with which he was playing warne towards the end of the series.
g.jones 3/10- not surprisingly geraint jones batting like a man without a brain and at the end of the day a test match average of under 30 for someone who cant keep is simply not good enough. the only runs hes scored in this series, like in the rest of his career came when Flintoff scored a fair few before or in partnership with him. not good enough
paul collingwood 5/10- did as good a job as he could have done and played his part in the test match. should have bowled more.
ashley giles 5/10- provided decent support without being outstanding with the ball and played some particularly good innings with the bat despite looking completely at sea against warne and the short bowling from lee earlier on in this series. his role will expand in the subcontinent.
matthew hoggard 7/10- when the conditions suited him he went into his zone, but when they didnt he was cannon fodder, and one can only hope that the selectors realise that they'd be better off if they went in with another spinner on a dusty pitch in the subcontinent.
steve harmison 6/10 - after Lords he struggled to come across a pitch that suited him and he really isnt a significant threat when theres no seam movement or uneven bounce. however unlike in SA he was still both the right lines(and the wrong lengths) at pace and managed to cause a few problems. overrated and definetly not the number # 2 pace bowler in the world.
S. jones 9/10- as predicted by yours truly englands bowler of the series. not particularly surprising given the improvement he showed against bangladesh earlier this summer and the fact that no one gave him a hope at the start of this series. a bowler who can reverse swing and conventionally swing the cricket ball is a major asset on its own, but being able to do that at 90 mph is something unheard off in world cricket at the moment. if he stays fit, he'll be one of the top bowlers in the years to come. and where is the striped animal who didnt give him a hope after Lords?
ENGLAND
trescothick 7/10: despite not actually improving on his troublesome footwork, hes started to leave more balls that are in the danger zone- just outside the off stump going away at the right length. of course the fact that his chief tormentor in past series jason gillespie was run of the mill, glenn mcgrath was fully fit in only one test and kaspa was half the bowler that he can be all helped him a fair bit, but nonetheless still a quality performance that suggests that he might finally be worth as much as his test match batting average suggests. his weakness against seam and swing still exists though, and with that so will his lengthy periods of poor form.
strauss 6/10- a fairly disappointing series until the oval, a liablility against spin gettiing dismissed 6 times in the series by shane warne usually after doing all the hard work and getting a start. however his gutsy performance at the oval managed to round up his series with a fairly decent average.
vaughan 5/10 - another disappointing series with the bat as his test average continues to plummet. at the start of the series he was missing straight balls and at the end of the series he tried to play as stupid a shot as possible, getting himself out twice to part timers and giving ponting his first wicket in over 6 years. while his 166 was a master class in strokeplay it still involved a lot of good fortune. his captaincy on the other hand was exemplary as almost every one of his plans for each batsman payed off.
bell 1/10- hard to see what exactly he contributed in the series, he looked like a walking wicket during his first half century and his prowess against spin is as close to being 0 as possible.
Pietersen 7/10- averaging less than 40 before his final innings and dropping every single catch that came his way meant that he owed england. and despite getting several lives, he played the innings of his career and once against proved that he is a man for the big occasion. his temperament is probably the best in the entire english side, with all his best performances in the series coming when england were in deep trouble.
flintoff 10/10- cant say much about someone who will have this series named as his own. he surprised everyone when for the first time in his career started to reverse swing the ball both ways and along with jones caused plenty of problems. the only thing left for him to prove now is to perform away from home with the bat. what surprised me was the ease with which he was playing warne towards the end of the series.
g.jones 3/10- not surprisingly geraint jones batting like a man without a brain and at the end of the day a test match average of under 30 for someone who cant keep is simply not good enough. the only runs hes scored in this series, like in the rest of his career came when Flintoff scored a fair few before or in partnership with him. not good enough
paul collingwood 5/10- did as good a job as he could have done and played his part in the test match. should have bowled more.
ashley giles 5/10- provided decent support without being outstanding with the ball and played some particularly good innings with the bat despite looking completely at sea against warne and the short bowling from lee earlier on in this series. his role will expand in the subcontinent.
matthew hoggard 7/10- when the conditions suited him he went into his zone, but when they didnt he was cannon fodder, and one can only hope that the selectors realise that they'd be better off if they went in with another spinner on a dusty pitch in the subcontinent.
steve harmison 6/10 - after Lords he struggled to come across a pitch that suited him and he really isnt a significant threat when theres no seam movement or uneven bounce. however unlike in SA he was still both the right lines(and the wrong lengths) at pace and managed to cause a few problems. overrated and definetly not the number # 2 pace bowler in the world.
S. jones 9/10- as predicted by yours truly englands bowler of the series. not particularly surprising given the improvement he showed against bangladesh earlier this summer and the fact that no one gave him a hope at the start of this series. a bowler who can reverse swing and conventionally swing the cricket ball is a major asset on its own, but being able to do that at 90 mph is something unheard off in world cricket at the moment. if he stays fit, he'll be one of the top bowlers in the years to come. and where is the striped animal who didnt give him a hope after Lords?
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tooextracool
International Coach
yep but its something we've known for quite a while now. fact is giles wouldnt be picked if there was a significantly better spinner than him in domestic cricket, and there isnt.Mister Wright said:
tooextracool
International Coach
AUSTRALIA
Hayden 1/10- if hayden doesnt get dropped after this series it would be an absolute catastrophe as far as im concerned. his weakness against seam and swing was so clearly exposed and the fact that he took almost the entire series to realise that he needed to do something about planting his front foot as far forward as possible and showing the bowlers some respect says a fair bit about his character. while he played the ball a lot later at the oval, its still not particularly surprising that his only big score in the series came in the flattest conditions of the entire series either. nor was it surprising that he looked clueless against flintoff once the ball started to seam around at the oval.
Langer 6.5/10- vintage langer really, plenty of inconsistency, a few good scores and an average of over 40 at the end of the series. however he threatened to score big throughout the series.
ponting 5/10- if anything this series proves that hes a tad overrated with the bat and despite a few very good innings, on the whole he struggled. his 156 was arugably the best innings hes played in his career but after that he didnt cause too many problems. his captaincy though is simply not upto test standard and he made some of the most ridiculous decisions during the series.
martyn 2/10- martyn's failure in this series has been inexplicable for me. its hard to suggest that he cant play seam and swing given his past record in england and the quality of his play in the last year. he got runs in the warm up games so its hard to put it down to lack of form. he may have got a few rough decisions but at the end of the day averaging 19.78 is very poor and with the australian selectors possibly looking for a scapegoat for the loss of this series, he might be the first man cut.
clarke 6/10- temperamental weakness,his shot selection is also questionable but he is undoubtedly the future of australian cricket and his performance this series was better than expected.
katich 5/10 - struggled to pick flintoff throughout this series, and despite some gutsy efforts didnt make a name for himself. still a player i rate quite highly though.
Gilchrist 1/10- undeniably worked out by flintoff and vaughans field placings throughout the ODIs and tests, to the point where he had no idea what game to play- attacking or defensive. he doesnt like the around the wicket bowling tactic employed by flintoff and struggles when he doesnt get width.
Warne-9.5/10- absolute legend, didnt deserve to be on the losing side. fought till the very end with both bat and ball.
b.lee 6/10 - bowled with pride throughout the series, but his major problem is that he doesnt swing the red ball frequently enough and therefore when the pitch is flat, hes more up and down and starts bowling too short.
Gillespie 0.5/10- he gets 0.5 for being a quality bowler in the past.
shaun tait- 3/10 - not good enough at the moment, his accuracy is all over the place and until he fixes that theres no way hes going to be a success at the international level, no matter how many wickets he takes in domestic cricket.
glenn mcgrath - 7/10- would have been better if he had not suffered the injury. bowled as good as anyone has ever bowled at Lords.
Hayden 1/10- if hayden doesnt get dropped after this series it would be an absolute catastrophe as far as im concerned. his weakness against seam and swing was so clearly exposed and the fact that he took almost the entire series to realise that he needed to do something about planting his front foot as far forward as possible and showing the bowlers some respect says a fair bit about his character. while he played the ball a lot later at the oval, its still not particularly surprising that his only big score in the series came in the flattest conditions of the entire series either. nor was it surprising that he looked clueless against flintoff once the ball started to seam around at the oval.
Langer 6.5/10- vintage langer really, plenty of inconsistency, a few good scores and an average of over 40 at the end of the series. however he threatened to score big throughout the series.
ponting 5/10- if anything this series proves that hes a tad overrated with the bat and despite a few very good innings, on the whole he struggled. his 156 was arugably the best innings hes played in his career but after that he didnt cause too many problems. his captaincy though is simply not upto test standard and he made some of the most ridiculous decisions during the series.
martyn 2/10- martyn's failure in this series has been inexplicable for me. its hard to suggest that he cant play seam and swing given his past record in england and the quality of his play in the last year. he got runs in the warm up games so its hard to put it down to lack of form. he may have got a few rough decisions but at the end of the day averaging 19.78 is very poor and with the australian selectors possibly looking for a scapegoat for the loss of this series, he might be the first man cut.
clarke 6/10- temperamental weakness,his shot selection is also questionable but he is undoubtedly the future of australian cricket and his performance this series was better than expected.
katich 5/10 - struggled to pick flintoff throughout this series, and despite some gutsy efforts didnt make a name for himself. still a player i rate quite highly though.
Gilchrist 1/10- undeniably worked out by flintoff and vaughans field placings throughout the ODIs and tests, to the point where he had no idea what game to play- attacking or defensive. he doesnt like the around the wicket bowling tactic employed by flintoff and struggles when he doesnt get width.
Warne-9.5/10- absolute legend, didnt deserve to be on the losing side. fought till the very end with both bat and ball.
b.lee 6/10 - bowled with pride throughout the series, but his major problem is that he doesnt swing the red ball frequently enough and therefore when the pitch is flat, hes more up and down and starts bowling too short.
Gillespie 0.5/10- he gets 0.5 for being a quality bowler in the past.
shaun tait- 3/10 - not good enough at the moment, his accuracy is all over the place and until he fixes that theres no way hes going to be a success at the international level, no matter how many wickets he takes in domestic cricket.
glenn mcgrath - 7/10- would have been better if he had not suffered the injury. bowled as good as anyone has ever bowled at Lords.