• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

England XI vs India XI (since 1970)

Which test team since 1970 is stronger?

  • Total voters
    17
sayon basak

sayon basak

International Debutant
capt_Luffy said:
For all FC and Test games (Test precedence ofcourse):
  1. WG Grace
  2. Jack Hobbs
  3. Len Hutton
  4. Wally Hammond
  5. Herbert Sutcliffe
  6. KS Ranjitsinhji
  7. Ken Barrington
  8. Joe Root
  9. Denis Compton
  10. Geoff Boycott
  11. Peter May
  12. Arthur Shrewsbury
  13. Alaistar Cook
  14. Kevin Pietersen
  15. Colin Cowdrey
  16. Graham Gooch
  17. David Gower
  18. Ted Dexter
  19. Graham Thorpe
  20. Patsy Hendren
  21. Archie Maclaren
  22. Stanley Jackson
  23. CB Fry
  24. Alec Stewart
  25. Dennis Amiss
  26. Maurice Leyland
  27. Tom Graveney
  28. Phil Mead
  29. Eddie Paynter
  30. John Edrich
  31. Frank Woolley
  32. Tom Hayward
  33. KS Duleepsinhji
  34. Jonathan Trott
  35. Marcus Trescothick
  36. Robin Smith
  37. Allan Steel
  38. Ian Bell
  39. Mike Atherton
  40. Cyril Washbrook
  41. Douglas Jardine
  42. Ernest Tyldesly
  43. Johnny Tyldesly
  44. Michael Vaughan
  45. Andrew Strauss
  46. Joe Hardstaff Jr
  47. Bill Edrich
  48. Jack Russell Sr
  49. Bobby Abel
  50. Ben Stokes
  51. Harry Brook
  52. Allan Lamb
  53. Andy Sandham
  54. Colin Milburn
  55. Basil D'Oliveira
  56. Tony Greig
  57. Ian Botham
  58. Graeme Hick
  59. Peter Richardson
  60. Reggie Spooner
  61. Paul Collingwood
  62. Matt Prior
  63. Jack Robertson
  64. Plum Warner
  65. Andrew Stoddard
  66. George Gunn
  67. Nassir Hussain
  68. Mike Gatting
  69. Bob Wyatt
  70. Cyril Walters
  71. George Ulyett
  72. Raman Subha Row
  73. Chris Broad
  74. Jonny Barstow
  75. Mark Ramprakash
  76. Ben Duckett
  77. Mark Butcher
  78. Peter Parfitt
  79. Keith Fletcher
  80. Tip Foster
  81. Andrew Flintoff
  82. Les Ames
  83. Gilbert Jessop
  84. Walter Reed
  85. Geoff Pullar
  86. Reg Simpson
  87. Gary Balance
  88. Alan Knott
  89. Derek Randall
  90. Mike Denness
  91. Mike Smith
  92. Alan Watkins
  93. Bob Barber
  94. Ollie Pope
  95. Graeme Fowler
  96. Zak Crawley
  97. Phil Sharpe
  98. Chris Radley
  99. Bob Woolmer
  100. Percy Holmes
Click to expand...
There you go.

Good to see Ben stokes in the top 50. Hammond ahead of Hutton for me tho.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
sayon basak said:
There you go.

Good to see Ben stokes in the top 50. Hammond ahead of Hutton for me tho.
Click to expand...
Hammond over Hutton is a take I can't exactly call factually wrong, hell like they are right next to each other in my rankings (not just English, World as well, 10th and 11th). But it really baffles me why.
 
P

Patience and Accuracy+Gut

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
For all FC and Test games (Test precedence ofcourse):
  1. WG Grace
  2. Jack Hobbs
  3. Len Hutton
  4. Wally Hammond
  5. Herbert Sutcliffe
  6. KS Ranjitsinhji
  7. Ken Barrington
  8. Joe Root
  9. Denis Compton
  10. Geoff Boycott
  11. Peter May
  12. Arthur Shrewsbury
  13. Alaistar Cook
  14. Kevin Pietersen
  15. Colin Cowdrey
  16. Graham Gooch
  17. David Gower
  18. Ted Dexter
  19. Graham Thorpe
  20. Patsy Hendren
  21. Archie Maclaren
  22. Stanley Jackson
  23. CB Fry
  24. Alec Stewart
  25. Dennis Amiss
  26. Maurice Leyland
  27. Tom Graveney
  28. Phil Mead
  29. Eddie Paynter
  30. John Edrich
  31. Frank Woolley
  32. Tom Hayward
  33. KS Duleepsinhji
  34. Jonathan Trott
  35. Marcus Trescothick
  36. Robin Smith
  37. Allan Steel
  38. Ian Bell
  39. Mike Atherton
  40. Cyril Washbrook
  41. Douglas Jardine
  42. Ernest Tyldesly
  43. Johnny Tyldesly
  44. Michael Vaughan
  45. Andrew Strauss
  46. Joe Hardstaff Jr
  47. Bill Edrich
  48. Jack Russell Sr
  49. Bobby Abel
  50. Ben Stokes
  51. Harry Brook
  52. Allan Lamb
  53. Andy Sandham
  54. Colin Milburn
  55. Basil D'Oliveira
  56. Tony Greig
  57. Ian Botham
  58. Graeme Hick
  59. Peter Richardson
  60. Reggie Spooner
  61. Paul Collingwood
  62. Matt Prior
  63. Jack Robertson
  64. Plum Warner
  65. Andrew Stoddard
  66. George Gunn
  67. Nassir Hussain
  68. Mike Gatting
  69. Bob Wyatt
  70. Cyril Walters
  71. George Ulyett
  72. Raman Subha Row
  73. Chris Broad
  74. Jonny Barstow
  75. Mark Ramprakash
  76. Ben Duckett
  77. Mark Butcher
  78. Peter Parfitt
  79. Keith Fletcher
  80. Tip Foster
  81. Andrew Flintoff
  82. Les Ames
  83. Gilbert Jessop
  84. Walter Reed
  85. Geoff Pullar
  86. Reg Simpson
  87. Gary Balance
  88. Alan Knott
  89. Derek Randall
  90. Mike Denness
  91. Mike Smith
  92. Alan Watkins
  93. Bob Barber
  94. Ollie Pope
  95. Graeme Fowler
  96. Zak Crawley
  97. Phil Sharpe
  98. Chris Radley
  99. Bob Woolmer
  100. Percy Holmes
Click to expand...
Incredible effort to rank the 100. Ames at 82 kinda too low. Especially Having Flintoff ahead.
 
Last edited:
Johan

Johan

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
In recent years, WI also makes some pretty good turners, but I suffice. I think you can't just differentiate between spin and seam like that for bowling. If the ball turns, Ashwin will be shambolic. Now, what I believe from country to country, England will win pretty easily in England and NZ, India in India and Sri Lanka, with a big advantage in Pakistan, as you know, ball still turns there more than spins. If we count UAE or Bangladesh then there also, but for now let's don't. Of the remaining, I think India will have the advantage in WI, as spinners also have done great there in recent times, especially Ashwin. In South Africa, I will give the advantage to England, as I think their bowling will be there much more important, but in really bad wickets, India will have the advantage for better batting (ATG or not, Jadeja and Ashwin in comparison to tail enders are a significant boost). In Australia, I catch your meaning, and am not sure either..... But for now, will give India the slight upper hand.
Click to expand...
I have similar views, just think I'd favour England just a little bit due to my personal valuing of pace attacks.
 
P

Patience and Accuracy+Gut

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
Ames averaged 28 against Australia. He was a revolutionary batsman-keeper, but his test record is not really that great. But yeah, could had been a little higher than where I placed him.
Click to expand...
Disagree here. From my memory Ames averaged over 40 in Test and FC (iirc around 45 in FC). Flintoff didn’t average over 35 in anything. Ames should be way higher. Also over 100 100s in F.C. Ranking him below someone like Flintoff is a travesty imho.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
Patience and Accuracy+Gut said:
Disagree here. From my memory Ames averaged over 40 in Test and FC (iirc around 45 in FC). Flintoff didn’t average over 35 in anything. Ames should be way higher. Also over 100 100s in F.C. Ranking him below someone like Flintoff is a travesty imho.
Click to expand...
Fair enough (Ames averaged 40 in FC as well). On revision, he should be ahead of Flintoff atleast.
 
P

Patience and Accuracy+Gut

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
Fair enough (Ames averaged 40 in FC as well). On revision, he should be ahead of Flintoff atleast.
Click to expand...
Ames did pretty well against everyone except Australia. Him being at no. 82 is way too low from my reckoning. Also his F.C stats, also did pretty good against Indies. An average of 40 in Tests, and an average of 43 in FC is definitely not no.82.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
Patience and Accuracy+Gut said:
Ames did pretty well against everyone except Australia. Him being at no. 82 is way too low from my reckoning. Also his F.C stats, also did pretty good against Indies. An average of 40 in Tests, and an average of 43 in FC is definitely not no.82.
Click to expand...
Fair. Definitely higher than Flintoff. Don't sure whether I will place him higher Jessop or Stoddard though.
 
P

Patience and Accuracy+Gut

State Vice-Captain
capt_Luffy said:
Fair. Definitely higher than Flintoff. Don't sure whether I will place him higher Jessop or Stoddard though.
Click to expand...
Could I see your points for having Botham that much higher than Ames? You are basically downgrading Ames for not meeting his standards against one team. Botham isn’t a better batsman or comparable to Ames. He is ranked No.57 in your list to Ames no. 82. That’s just not acceptable imho.
 
capt_Luffy

capt_Luffy

Cricketer Of The Year
Patience and Accuracy+Gut said:
Could I see your points for having Botham that much higher than Ames? You are basically downgrading Ames for not meeting his standards against one team. Botham isn’t a better batsman or comparable to Ames. He is ranked No.57 in your list to Ames no. 82. That’s just not acceptable imho.
Click to expand...
Botham has some crazy high peak and played some crazy good knocks in that time, like the 149*. Ames relatively was modest in his Test career.
 
Coronis

Coronis

International Coach
Patience and Accuracy+Gut said:
Could I see your points for having Botham that much higher than Ames? You are basically downgrading Ames for not meeting his standards against one team. Botham isn’t a better batsman or comparable to Ames. He is ranked No.57 in your list to Ames no. 82. That’s just not acceptable imho.
Click to expand...
Against the one team that really mattered, during a friendly batting era. Ames’ big thing is his batting right?


During the 30’s
Ames vs Australia 675 @ 27

The average top 7 English bat (excluding Ames)
10189 @ 42.28
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Top