honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
Bradman
Sobers
Lara
Sachin
Hobbs
Hutton
Rest
Sobers
Lara
Sachin
Hobbs
Hutton
Rest
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Debate thread for 2024 Ranking of batsmen poll
- Thread starter CricAddict
- Start date
subshakerz
International Coach
What the heck happened to Smith's standing in CW? Posters here are so fickle and easily influenced by latest games.
A year or so ago he was rivaling Sachin. Now he is dropping like a rock somehow.
And funnily enough when I argue that late careers dip should cost players, I get huge pushback on this yet everyone is very influenced by it.
A year or so ago he was rivaling Sachin. Now he is dropping like a rock somehow.
And funnily enough when I argue that late careers dip should cost players, I get huge pushback on this yet everyone is very influenced by it.
Line and Length
Cricketer Of The Year
In our 2022 poll he was ranked #10 - well below Sachin, Sobers. Hutton. Lara, Richards. Since then his average has dropped a few points yet, if anything, he is rating more highly in the current round.
OverratedSanity
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The **** you talking about, he's getting several votes as a top 5/6 batsman.
subshakerz
International Coach
Interesting. I may have missed that. Could have sworn in direct comparison with several players in between he was beating Viv, etc.
Socerer 01
International Captain
i think more people realise how ****ing good his peak was and how difficult batting has been in general, him being at 10 in 2022 feels wrong more like
OverratedSanity
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I don't really think there's really a strong argument to rank guys like Viv over Smith, it's just falling into the trap of underrating the present imo. Sobers, Hobbs, Sachin etc have a case yeah.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
More than anything, his difficulties opening prove openers' tax is real and we have forever been underrating openers IMO. There is no reason to not rate Hobbs, Hutton, Gavaskar at the same level as Sobers, Lara, Sachin - that is my takeaway.
As far as Smith is concerned, his career is still ongoing. So its a roughie as some will rank based on what he has done so far, some will rank based on how they think he will go from now and some will still keep ranking him on his peak.
As far as Smith is concerned, his career is still ongoing. So its a roughie as some will rank based on what he has done so far, some will rank based on how they think he will go from now and some will still keep ranking him on his peak.
subshakerz
International Coach
You're right, he is picking up so I spoke too soon.
Red_Ink_Squid
Global Moderator
He was being overrated a year or so ago.
centurymaker
Cricketer Of The Year
King Viv is massively underrated here. It's sad.
CricAddict
Cricketer Of The Year
Steve Smith is quite overrated here one feels. How different has been his career path compared to Ponting?
centurymaker
Cricketer Of The Year
Ponting's average at the same stage of career was 59.4 (after 109 tests).
Yeah. Sobers should make it but the others could be any two of Lara, Hutton, Richards and S Smith and I wouldn't have a problem with it.
OverratedSanity
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This is only true if you think his peak wasn't better than Ponting. Which is nonsense imo. Smith is up there with the best to have played the game.
Ponting's peak came in a much flatter era, against worse bowlers, and he failed hugely in some very high profile series repeatedly. None of which are true for Smith. Think it's plain nostalgia that people are trying to say Ponting was equal or better.
centurymaker
Cricketer Of The Year
As if Smith's peak didn't come on super flat Australian roads just like Punter's. Now that the pitches are fair again last few yrs, things have changed drastically for him and his teammates.
At least Ponting had to face Wasim, Donald, Ambrose, Murali, Steyn for at least a part of his career and he had some success against each of them. So overall I don't buy that he faced weak attacks compared to Smith.
TBH the thing Smith has over Ponting is one series in India and Ashes 2019. But Ponting was great in South Africa iirc. And Smith hasn't done a lot outside of his 5 year peak. Ponting had a bigger body of work and more sustained excellence. In fact, Smith hasn't done much since late 2019. He needs to do well over the next 2+ years to consider him in top 5/6, otherwise he is around 8th to 12th with the likes of Punter.
At least Ponting had to face Wasim, Donald, Ambrose, Murali, Steyn for at least a part of his career and he had some success against each of them. So overall I don't buy that he faced weak attacks compared to Smith.
TBH the thing Smith has over Ponting is one series in India and Ashes 2019. But Ponting was great in South Africa iirc. And Smith hasn't done a lot outside of his 5 year peak. Ponting had a bigger body of work and more sustained excellence. In fact, Smith hasn't done much since late 2019. He needs to do well over the next 2+ years to consider him in top 5/6, otherwise he is around 8th to 12th with the likes of Punter.
centurymaker
Cricketer Of The Year
Let's wait for another 2-3 years before passing proper judgement on existing players because Ponting even in 2009 was seen very close to Tendulkar.
Only in 2010-2011 a clear gap emerged. So two years can change a lot.
By 2009 Ponting was below his best but most thought that he could turn it around and return to his best. It didn't happen. 2-3 years later it all looked like a drawn out late career decline. Smith is already going down the same route believe it or not. He is going to have to do really well to turn it around, now that his reflexes/hand and eye is not the same. His game and unorthodox technique is so reliant on it so I believe it's more difficult for him. Only certain champions (due to their 'technical ability' and will power) have defied the deterioration caused by father time. So let's see how he goes.
Only in 2010-2011 a clear gap emerged. So two years can change a lot.
By 2009 Ponting was below his best but most thought that he could turn it around and return to his best. It didn't happen. 2-3 years later it all looked like a drawn out late career decline. Smith is already going down the same route believe it or not. He is going to have to do really well to turn it around, now that his reflexes/hand and eye is not the same. His game and unorthodox technique is so reliant on it so I believe it's more difficult for him. Only certain champions (due to their 'technical ability' and will power) have defied the deterioration caused by father time. So let's see how he goes.
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Red_Ink_Squid
Global Moderator
Smith averages sub 30 in the hardest away conditions. Can't handle tough assignments imo.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
I have stated time and time again, the only reason people include Ponting in their Top 10-12 is pure nostalgia ****. Guy piled on runs in some of the flattest of pitches and against some pretty mediocre bowlers for the most part. His SA tours are massively overrated, the biggest challenge he faced thier was by far Ntini. In the 2001 tour, SA's best bowler was Kallis, Pollock didn't played any matches and Donald played only one, well past his prime. In 2006, Ntini was thier best bowler and Pollock on his last leg; he played only two matches and was pretty horrible in them. And in 2011, he faced a great lineup with Steyn, Morkel, Philander, etc and well, he hadn't done anything in his 2 matches.