***Official*** England in New Zealand 2018

[BeeGee]

Rashid is an awesome bowler, but I don't like the idea of bowling him in the death overs, especially when there are bowlers batting who need to score at 12 an over. Sure, he got Taylor, but it's high risk against sloggers.

 

[vandem]

Rashid is an awesome bowler, but I don't like the idea of bowling him in the death overs, especially when there are bowlers batting who need to score at 12 an over. Sure, he got Taylor, but it's high risk against sloggers.

I was surprised when Rashid was given the 48th. NZ needed 34 off 18 without Taylor, and I would have backed Curran + Willey / Woakes to finish. Using Rashid again was like a backgammon player using a high-risk backgame tactic twice, once when they were behind and needed to take a long-shot gamble, but then using the backgame tactic again when they were winning.

 

[veganbob]

Quality game of cricket and a fantastic win. Well done boys.
Santners best innings ever? A match winning finish from him and honestly the first time I remember him playing a meaningfull innings under pressure.

Well done to rosco too, great knock. Can't forget latham and our death bowling (suprisingly) either.

Great game all round should be a top series, two very good odi teams on display. Ill be very happy if we win this odi series

 

[wellAlbidarned]

Goddamn what a champ Santa. I'll never doubt you again.

 

[The Hutt Rec]

After a glut of T20 cricket this game was a breath of fresh air. People keep saying 50 over cricket will die, but it is vastly superior to T20 in almost every way. Bowlers can actually compete and apply strategies. Batsmen have time to build an innings.

T20 is like playing chess with all queens. It's one dimensional and shallow.

I thought this game had more excitement than every match in the Tri Series combined.

 

[SteveNZ]

Rashid is an awesome bowler, but I don't like the idea of bowling him in the death overs, especially when there are bowlers batting who need to score at 12 an over. Sure, he got Taylor, but it's high risk against sloggers.

Nup, Morgan got it horribly wrong against Santner. If they'd done their homework, they'd realise he has the ability to hit pace nowhere but through cow - and that spin was an unneccesary risk. Even then, Rashid should've just bowled wrong-uns wide of off-stump and challenged him to swipe the other way. Santner started slow as a wet week when England were bowling outside the channel, and he couldn't do anything but play through point for one at best. If England had bowled Willey/Stokes/Curran the last 4 overs, taken their ego and wicket tally out of it and bowled wide of off-stump. they'd have done it in a canter. I remember Starc doing it in a CH game here, he had Santner on toast bowling between chest and head height, got bored and tried to go stumps and Santner hit him.

And hey at the end of the day, Santner still had to hit them and he did. I'll still be skeptical of his batting because he's so limited for a guy who's given as much responsiblity as he is, but bloody good on him for getting us over the line. Obviously his bowling is also nigh-on world class for LOs as well.

Can't speak highly enough of Ross too, he is getting better with age. Incredibly skillful, mature, perfectly paced innings. That poster who said he was past his best shouldn't be taking crack on a school night.

 

[SteveNZ]

Oh and ODI envy is definitely a thing. I'm at the game on Wednesday and crossing every appendage I have that it's as good a game as last night. And that it doesn't rain. And that they sell decent beer at Bay Oval (do they?)

 

[Athlai]

He bats 8, how is he given undue responsibility?

 

[SteveNZ]

He bats 8, how is he given undue responsibility?

In recent memory, batting ahead of Seifert and Southee at Sydney then again in the Tri Series final...and any time he bats 6 or 7 in Tests, which is nose blood territory.

He's a determined cricketer but he just doesn't see it well enough or strike it well enough to be a force with the bat at international level. He can't generally hit from ball one, look at his innings' in T20 cricket - the amount of times he's been dismissed or finished 3 off 3, 6 off 6 etc. He's generally OK after a dozen balls but that sort of time isn't always afforded to him. When Ross got out, slogging because he felt he had to up the rate, Santner had 12 off 13 when we needed 10s. Yes, again he got us home through a mix of great hitting and really poor death bowling and captaincy, so whether or not that's then worth overlooking is up for debate.

 

[Athlai]

It’s not Santners fault that the coach/selectors occasionally idiotically bat him higher than 8. He’s definitely international standard at 8.

 

[SteveNZ]

It’s not Santners fault that the coach/selectors occasionally idiotically bat him higher than 8. He’s definitely international standard at 8.

Absolutely it's not, that's where I'm laying the occasional blame - at the coach. I feel he rates Santner's batting way too high. Course Mitchell's not going to tell him he thinks he should bat lower. And as I said, he's out there battling as hard as he can, but he's thrown into scenarios that he's not up to sometimes.

Is he an international 8? Kind of. Certainly he'd be in the bottom half of 8s around in the world. I just have a problem when he bats ahead of Seifert, bats anywhere above 8 in Tests or is sent in with a few balls to go when it's plainly obvious he can't hit without an over or two of looking.

 

[NZTailender]

I think when he came on the scene they thought they found some mythical number 6 all-rounder like Moeen Ali or late career Daniel Vettori. but he's the perfect number 8, and any ambitions to bat higher should be postponed until he tightens his game. Not that he needs to, either. We should be aiming for a specialist there in Tests or at least batting all-rounder.

 

[The Hutt Rec]

Interesting to read that when he came in Taylor told him to take a few dots to get himself in ... and they were comfortable chasing 50 off the last five (we ended up needing 44). Maybe a bit of the Santner early innings criticism has been a bit harsh.

 

[Howsie]

Suck it Santner haterz

 

[The Hutt Rec]

Incidentally Santner scored 35 off 16 from the 46th over onwards. Will go down as great advice and game management from Taylor, despite him getting out.

 

[NZTailender]

Really hope Taylor plays for a while yet. Another 5 years in Test please, and the next week cup + a few years transition/handover to new blood in the middle order before 2023 (although he wouldn't be the first to play a wC up 39 iirc...).

 

[Athlai]

Suck it Santner haterz

Santners mine thx

 

[Howsie]

Can we please get Mark Chapman into this team, we need some power in this middle order. Nicholls has done fairly well for NZ but unfortunately with Latham in this team he can’t bat at six if we want to seriously condisder going anywhere at the next World Cup.

 

[Athlai]

Can we please get Mark Chapman into this team, we need some power in this middle order. Nicholls has done fairly well for NZ but unfortunately with Latham in this team he can’t bat at six if we want to seriously condisder going anywhere at the next World Cup.

Yeah keep Nicholls in the squad but Chapman should be starting

 

[SteveNZ]

Can we please get Mark Chapman into this team, we need some power in this middle order. Nicholls has done fairly well for NZ but unfortunately with Latham in this team he can’t bat at six if we want to seriously condisder going anywhere at the next World Cup.

480 runs at 80 and 102 S/R this season in the Ford Trophy is hard to ignore. And yeah, you'd want Chapman to be involved from November's ODI trip to Pakistan if he's going to be at the World Cup.

Looking at the FTP again, do we seriously have no cricket from a month's time until November? Don't know whether to trust this particular PDF that says we're playing ourselves in Oct 19 then England for 2 ODIs and nothing else in November.