*Official* English Football Season 2014-15

[duffer]

Are the fans on redcafe being serious? Saying Wellbeck will be the new Henry in a couple of seasons. I just don't see it. Completely underwhelmed.

 

[GIMH]

The need for an out and out goalscorer is massively overstated. At the top level, those kind of players make team worse, not better.

 

[King Pietersen]

Yeah, erm, what?

Delighted we didn't end up with Cleverley. Martinez has a soft spot for him after working with him at Wigan, but he'd have had ridiculous wage demands, and it's not a position we need to improve. I'd have taken Rodwell back if we'd gone for him, but delighted we didn't buy Cleverley. Shame we didn't end up with another defender though, liked the Shawcross rumours, as unlikely as they were.

 

[Pothas]

Hull the major winners on Deadline Day. Ben Arfa, Abel Hernandez, Diame and Gaston Ramirez. 4 awesome signings for them.

Welbeck's a weird one. Clearly has heaps of potential, but doesn't really solve anything at Arsenal. He isn't an out-and-out goal scorer and doesn't seem to have the natural goalscoring instinct of a world class striker. He could have a Sturridge-esque turnaround, but I don't see it happening. Think £16m is an awful lot of money for a 23 year old who hasn't really improved all that much since he broke into the first-team. Who knows though, might end up being a great signing. Just surprised they didn't make more of an effort to get Falcao, Remy or even Balotelli. Arsenal also majorly missed the boat in regards to signing another defender. 6 defenders for 4 positions isn't enough, especially given Arsenal's record when it comes.

Not sure how 16 million is an awful lot for Welbeck but 10 million for Abel Hernandez is an awesome deal for Hull. Both may but price wise I would say Welbeck looks a better deal.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Why pay £7.5m for a midfielder you don't really need when you can get him for free next year or for peanuts in January? Presume he will be a long term replacement for Osman who is getting on a bit.

As for the rest of the day, fairly boring as a neutral. My lot had done their business previously, only signed 17 players this summer so can't be greedy. Was expecting United to sign more than a striker and another left back. They look such a lopsided squad so it will be an interesting few months ahead watching how they go.

At the end of the window I would say Chelsea look the strongest, City close behind but they may rue letting Negredo go and not replacing him. Arsenal are strong in midfield (probably the strongest in league) but look light up front and at the back given the injury records of certain players on the books. Liverpool could be anything with so many new signings. Think they will be the top 4 with Chelsea winning it.

 

[sledger]

£16 million is not a lot for Welbeck, relatively speaking. The guy is English and a striker. You won't find a player of his description and level of ability for much cheaper.

 

[King Pietersen]

Not sure how 16 million is an awful lot for Welbeck but 10 million for Abel Hernandez is an awesome deal for Hull. Both may but price wise I would say Welbeck looks a better deal.

Didn't say they were awesome deals, just good signings for Hull as a club. Hernandez was a bit pricey at £10m, but he's a good coup for them. Good goalscorer, international experience, and young enough to develop. Big fan of him on FM too, so hope he does well.

Have to wait and see how Welbeck does, but can't see him suddenly developing into a proper goalscorer, which is what Arsenal need. They should have tried harder to pursue Remy. To say no to Remy for £10.5m, but then buy Welbeck for £16m just seems a bit strange. Remy would probably have higher wage demands, but doubt there'd be that much in it. Another poor transfer window for Arsenal. Sanchez was a fantastic buy, and Chambers has massive potential, but they've not improved the areas they needed to. They've lost experience in defence and not replaced them, still don't have a good holding midfielder, only 6 defenders in the squad and the goal scoring options look very slim. Can't see them getting close to Chelsea or City this year.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

£16 million is not a lot for Welbeck, relatively speaking. The guy is English and a striker. You won't find a player of his description and level of ability for much cheaper.

When you compare it to the two deals Fulham have done for strikers this year in Mitroglou in January and McCormack in the summer he is a bargain. There are plenty of others that make the deal look good. In all honesty I think both Liverpool and Arsenal have got decent deals for their £16m men in comparison to other teams.

 

[Pothas]

Didn't say they were awesome deals, just good signings for Hull as a club. Hernandez was a bit pricey at £10m, but he's a good coup for them. Good goalscorer, international experience, and young enough to develop. Big fan of him on FM too, so hope he does well.

Have to wait and see how Welbeck does, but can't see him suddenly developing into a proper goalscorer, which is what Arsenal need. They should have tried harder to pursue Remy. To say no to Remy for £10.5m, but then buy Welbeck for £16m just seems a bit strange. Remy would probably have higher wage demands, but doubt there'd be that much in it. Another poor transfer window for Arsenal. Sanchez was a fantastic buy, and Chambers has massive potential, but they've not improved the areas they needed to. They've lost experience in defence and not replaced them, still don't have a good holding midfielder, only 6 defenders in the squad and the goal scoring options look very slim. Can't see them getting close to Chelsea or City this year.

Surprise surprise. There was me thinking maybe you saw a lot of Serie B.

 

[social]

£16 million is not a lot for Welbeck, relatively speaking. The guy is English and a striker. You won't find a player of his description and level of ability for much cheaper.

16 mill plus 115 k per week for Welbeck vs 6 mill plus 350 per week for Falcao (basically 1:1)

IF FALCAO IS FIT, ManU are massive winners on this deal

 

[duffer]

If I'm Utd I pull the plug on the Wellbeck deal last minute and laugh at Arsenal having to play Sanogo for 4 straight months. They don't need the money and lose a homegrown player.

 

[social]

If I'm Utd I pull the plug on the Wellbeck deal last minute and laugh at Arsenal having to play Sanogo for 4 straight months. They don't need the money and lose a homegrown player.

Seems to be the conventional wisdom but its almost as if they don't care where their cast-offs go

 

[sledger]

16 mill plus 115 k per week for Welbeck vs 6 mill plus 350 per week for Falcao (basically 1:1)

IF FALCAO IS FIT, ManU are massive winners on this deal

I don't really see what this has to do with the point I made, but yeah ok.

 

[social]

I don't really see what this has to do with the point I made, but yeah ok.

Arse should've done the Falcao deal IF HE IS FIT as he is potentially the difference between 4th/5th and 1st whilst Welbeck is meh and the relative cost is negligible for 1 year

 

[sledger]

Arse should've done the Falcao deal IF HE IS FIT as he is potentially the difference between 4th/5th and 1st whilst Welbeck is meh and the relative cost is negligible for 1 year

Yeah, which doesn't really have anything to do with my original point (i.e. that Welbeck is not overpriced). Nobody here has attempted to claim that Welbeck >>> Falcao.

 

[Uppercut]

Yeah, erm, what?

He just means goal-poachers aren't very useful at the very top level. Which is broadly true, none of the best teams use one.

Always had sympathy for that argument since we immediately improved a ton after selling Van Nistelrooy.

 

[Uppercut]

I think Welbeck's a better fit for Arsenal than Remy would have been. Much more involved.

Is Remy that different from Podolski? They're both run-fast-shoot-hard types, and I think Podolski would get a goal every other game in a mid-table 4-4-2. Although Remy was alright on his own up front too, at least until Cabaye left.

 

[sledger]

I think Welbeck's a better fit for Arsenal than Remy would have been. Much more involved.

Is Remy that different from Podolski? They're both run-fast-shoot-hard types, and I think Podolski would get a goal every other game in a mid-table 4-4-2. Although Remy was alright on his own up front too, at least until Cabaye left.

Yeah, I would be inclined to agree.

 

[Eds]

I think Welbeck's a better fit for Arsenal than Remy would have been. Much more involved.

Agree with this. Remy's great at creating his own shot but that's really not what Arsenal need. His off-ball movement is pretty average and with Ozil, Cazorla etc. crying out for a striker making decent runs in behind, Welbeck's probably a better fit.

 

[Cevno]

https://twitter.com/JakeFCohen/status/506435163837181953

Remy isn't playing for free either tbf.

I've seen it suggested that the option to buy next season might have already been taken, but they just can't confirm it now because of FFP constraints. Would actually love that if true, because I think there's actually decent value in a loan move. At 350 per weak he was never a candidate at Arsenal though. Would be double our next highest earner. Arsenal don't work like that.

I think 350k per week is all guesswork as they are adding up his net wage at Monaco and adding tax rates. I am sure United and Mendes would have found a way to work around that.(Paying Monaco his wage as a fee so they give him to United free of charge like the Nani loan probably.) Falcao wanted to leave really it seemed so might have taken a cut too.

I think there must be a financial imperative to let him go. I don't believe we could have made 4th anyway, but this is essentially giving up altogether. If there was one club we shouldn't have let him go to it was Arsenal.

Yeah, what happened to not letting him go to a top four side as well? Was that just twitter talk?

Think Welbeck insisted to move to Arsenal and permanently at that. United wanted a loan but Welbeck's agent said he wanted a permanent move now.

Alternative was keeping as bit of 4th choice striker, i guess. Van Gaal mismanaged the situation leaving it so late and telling him bluntly something, and Woodward should have been more firm at not allowing him to join Arsenal really. Strengthening a rival in a area where they have a black hole with a player who has some potential doesn't seem good.

It's interesting how Welbeck will do though. Right now his game is somewhatt like Kanu almost but if it clicks for him he has good basic ingredients.