***Official*** West Indies in New Zealand 2013/14

[hendrix]

All I can say about the game last night:

1) Well done Windies
2) Brendom McCullum is USELESS

They were all useless. Other than Southee's bowling at the death, the bowling was crap.

All the batsmen were crap. Ryder played just as silly a shot as McCullum.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Yes we all tend to moan about the selections a lot, but have you stopped to consider that every single West Indian poster here does it? It's not just me on some kind of campaign. Granted there aren't many of us but the fact remains that our selectors are beyond useless and get it wrong consistently.

Also, this is quite exceptional and I don't remember ever having this many injuries to key players over the last decade.I'd like to see what you would say if New Zealand were on tour somewhere and literally 1/2 of your first team was out injured, See how you would cope with your ODI side playing without Guptil (Gayle), Williamson (Lil Bravo), Taylor (Samuels), Mcullum (Pollard), Southee (Roach) and Mills (Rampaul).

I will give it a rest now as I realise I have gone on about it a lot but it is a legitimate point.

Sri Lanka odi series, the one we drew 1-1 against the top rated team

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Both opening bowlers being unable to bowl at the death really hurts the team balance, relying on Anderson for 5 at the end will always be pretty dodgy

 

[SteveNZ]

tbh as so as that chap took the one handed catch for 100k nobody really gave a toss about the game. But can we please drop Mills, he serves this team no purpose whatsoever, he looked like a club bowler today

What? You didn't actually watch his first spell did you...he hit impeccable lengths, beat the bat more than anyone else managed to, swung it more than Southee did and had a couple of edges fall into gaps and go where a 2nd slip may have laid a hand on it, if not for the fact his opening bowlers were getting pumped and he didn't get one. He was going at less than fives in his first 5 overs. 2013 record - 23 wickets at 29, RPO of 4.8. I'm taking that.

He got wacked at the death but if they keep asking him to do a job he's not suited to, and never really was, he'll continue to. Please, oh please, can we teach someone else to hit the hole other than Southee. It's actually not an unachieveable skill if worked hard at. As someone in commentary mentioned, Arafat did it to perfection in the Big Bash the other night. If someone ramps you, good luck to them - it takes some doing.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Ryder hits the block hole 5/6 times and lack of pace makes ramping more dangerous.

 

[SteveNZ]

Ryder hits the block hole 5/6 times and lack of pace makes ramping more dangerous.

There you go - if he's the man to do it, let him bowl 3 overs exclusively at the death. It sh*ts me to tears watching us trying to manipulate fields - on small grounds a lot of the time - especially with 6-3/7-2 offside fields and then bowling length. Yorkers and attacking the stumps also brings two more modes of dismissal into play, which is a natural go-slow for run rates.

 

[Prince EWS]

I've always felt yorkers well outside off were harder than hit than yorkers right on the stumps, especially with the right field set. Players can manipulate their footwork in a pre-meditated fashion to turn yorker length balls into half volleys or full tosses but if it's outside off they'll struggle to do anything with it anyway from their "new" position.

 

[Athlai]

Surely they'd just give Ryder the charge then, and having Ronchi up to the stumps against Ryder is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[Prince EWS]

Surely they'd just give Ryder the charge then, and having Ronchi up to the stumps against Ryder is a disaster waiting to happen.

If you charged him and then he bowled an almost-off-side-wide-but-not-quite yorker then you'd struggle to get it away IMO, but yeah, just having Ryder execute yorkers might not quite work. The risk isn't the ramp shot, but his pace allowing batsmen to come down the wicket or even go deeper in their crease.

 

[hendrix]

McClenaghan had been pasted all over the ground. Not sure he would've done any better than Anderson tbh.

 

[Prince EWS]

They were all useless. Other than Southee's bowling at the death, the bowling was crap.

All the batsmen were crap. Ryder played just as silly a shot as McCullum.

Think he was slating him for his decision at the toss more than his batting.

 

[SteveNZ]

I've always felt yorkers well outside off were harder than hit than yorkers right on the stumps, especially with the right field set. Players can manipulate their footwork in a pre-meditated fashion to turn yorker length balls into half volleys or full tosses but if it's outside off they'll struggle to do anything with it anyway from their "new" position.

They potentially can be, for players who are backing away looking to give themselves room. It's a tough thing to get right, as it's not a natural line + length to bowl. Players certainly can manipulate, but you've got to back yourself as a bowler to see that and make the right decision. Perhaps Jesse might not be the best at doing so but others should be.

Mitch can bowl at the death, he'll need exposure and the right plans to execute it. If it's not him, it's Anderson who seems to have no desire to hit the hole

 

[Blocky]

I think our bowling attack has major issues if they play on fast true wickets, if the wickets aren't slow and the ball isn't swinging, suddenly you have major issues trying to get twenty overs out of Mills and Anderson, you're relying heavily on Southee or McCleneghan to take early wickets as the performances from Mills are becoming less and less consistent and he's becoming much easier to hit.

The other thing I note that we're not seeing out of our players is the variations most bowlers are starting to use at the death. Southee on his day is excellent at bowling the off side yorker but he doesn't have the slower ball bouncer that you're seeing a lot of quick start to use and in general, his pace isn't quick enough to make his change of pace ball hard to hit. Our spinners rely on coming around the wicket and trying to bowl a middle stump line and again, they're not varying their pace as much as you'll see a Brad Hogg or Narine do.

Other issue is the much of a muchness of the guys in behind, I think its time we look to graduate Boult to white ball cricket personally.

 

[SteveNZ]

I think its time we look to graduate Boult to white ball cricket personally.

I'd imagine this is inevitable, maybe even for India. I still think Jimmy is a bonafide 4th bowling option as well when it gets it right, the only issue being Corey is obviously now ahead of him in the batting stakes and with Nathan's place assured, there's really not a lot of room.

 

[ohnoitsyou]

Mills is up there with the best opening bowlers in the world for ODIs. The problem is that at his pace he will get hit for runs later on, when the ball has stopped swinging and batsmen are lookingfor runs.

Mc**** obviously has no clue how to use him, but 6 overs with the new ball and 4 during the middle stages would normally see him go for 30-45 runs

 

[Bahnz]

I think there is a real problem with playing all three of Mills, Southee and Mitch in the same side. All 3 are fast medium swing bowlers who are all a bit hittable when the ball stops moving, so whoever winds up with first change duties is going to struggle a bit. Ideally New Zealand would have someone a bit different to fill in that 3rd seamer role, maybe more of a bounce bowler. Jacob Oram was certainly very effective in this respect. Unfortunately, I'm not sure if we really have anyone who could perform such a role at this stage.

 

[Athlai]

Mills has always been the worst best ODI bowler IMO.

He tends to have days where he dominates (usually with his first spell) and then has other days where he just gets absolutely pasted and looks village. Southee is almost a reverse Mills in that he usually does his best work at the death but he is merely a serviceable ODI bowler instead of being a world class one.

Still a bit early on Mitch, he has taken a lot of wickets in a very short amount of time but it is hard to determine how much of that is just luck and how much is skill. I personally reckon we need Bennett in the team but at this moment in time I wouldn't drop any 3 of those guys just yet.

 

[NZTailender]

Ideally Neesh would replace Mills once he retires/gets dropped

 

[_Ed_]

Mills has always been the worst best ODI bowler IMO.

He tends to have days where he dominates (usually with his first spell) and then has other days where he just gets absolutely pasted and looks village.

A little harsh, IMO.

231 wickets in 162 games is a pretty damn good record. And his RPO of 4.73 is more than decent as well, especially considering the ill-advised "Mills at the death" experiment has been wrecking his figures for nigh on a decade now.

 

[Flem274*]

Nah I reckon Neesham will come in full time once McCullum hangs up the boots. Anderson/Neesham at 6 and 7 :fap:.

A specialist bowler of some description will replace Mills when he goes.