England can beat India "every day of week": Gough

[GIMH]

Bit too much Broad-love from you these days, Spark. Save it for those of us who were actually in there defending him, eh?

Some of us have been doing it on this forum since 2008

Wtf are you on about? GIMH doesn't even post much anymore.

He called it, so has no need to gloat

Never accused GIMH of it ftr, he's one of the few people who has the right to do it if anything imo

 

[Jacknife]

But how much of Ponting/Clarke learning to bat again is down to them feasting on Ishant and Yadav as opposed to Jimmeh and Tremlett?
I think it's Uppercut who made the point a number of times but it's not just coincidence how many batsmen "lose form" and start getting out for **** all when presented with a really good, disciplined bowling attack.

This.

 

[Spark]

But how much of Ponting/Clarke learning to bat again is down to them feasting on Ishant and Yadav as opposed to Jimmeh and Tremlett?
I think it's Uppercut who made the point a number of times but it's not just coincidence how many batsmen "lose form" and start getting out for **** all when presented with a really good, disciplined bowling attack.

Ponting I could buy, but Clarke would have struggled against Bangladesh, the way he batted in some of those Tests. Worth noting that he made bucketloads against close to the same attack - granted, not bowling as well as in 10/11 but it's not a world apart. Looked absolutely atrocious at times, especially at the Gabba with the back injury.

Bit too much Broad-love from you these days, Spark. Save it for those of us who were actually in there defending him, eh?

I'm pretty sure I was one of them

 

[Cevno]

The one time I've seen England play on anything remotely resembling a "dustbowl" in the last five years was at the World Cup, when they played South Africa in Chennai. And won. When was the last time India played a home Test on one? Three, four years ago?

~~

South Africa? Depends what you mean by Dustbowl, but India have played on pitches where Spinners have played the main role decent times,(Which don't give that much help to the seamers, but aren't a dustbowl at the same time).

And if we are talking about ODI's then the English Batsman didn't look too great every time the bowl turned with some nip in both the series in England as well as in India. But hard to judge based on ODI's.

 

[Cevno]

Honestly, the way people keep banging on about such an irrelevant point you'd think India played all of their home Tests on crumbling dustbowls with an attack of Kumble, Murali and Saqlain rather than the reality - that India's spinners would be flattered by being referred to as average and most Indian pitches tend to be utter roads.

There are lot of room between a Crumbling dustbowl and utter roads(which "most" of the wickets aren't ftr, unless you think ever ywicket offering less assistance to seamers and more to spinners = Road). Also Indian spinners are certainly better at home.

 

[Shri]

Honestly, the way people keep banging on about such an irrelevant point you'd think India played all of their home Tests on crumbling dustbowls with an attack of Kumble, Murali and Saqlain rather than the reality - that India's spinners would be flattered by being referred to as average and most Indian pitches tend to be utter roads.

Dustbowls are rarely seen these days in the SC but pitches that take slight turn with invariable bounce are seen once in a while. Those pitches are almost as hard to bat on as a dustbowl with lots of LBWs and bat pad catches possible. Seen so many batsmen beaten by bounce in the SC like at the Feroz Shah Kotla.

So yeah I wasn't talking about dustbowls when I was talking about pitches in the SC. It was about pitches that have slight help for the spinners in it with invariable bounce.

 

[deerkick]

England might be able to beat Indian any day of the week in test crickets but Gautam Gambhir was signed to Kolkata Knight Riders for $2 million .

 

[Shri]

Wtf?

 

[Daemon]

Wasn't exactly brilliant either. Took a 5-for in the first Test he played in the series, did pretty much **** all else.

edit: Spinners in England 2010-2011

Name            Team T    W    Ave      SR  Econ  5w

S Ajmal         Pak  3   12   29.41   62.5  2.82   1
S Al Hasan      Ban  2    8   34.75   60.3  3.45   1
HMRKB Herath    SL   3    6   49.83   95.8  3.12   0
A Mishra        Ind  2    3  106.66  162.0  3.95   0
Mahmadullah     Ban  2    2   80.50  150.5  3.20   0
Harbhajan Singh Ind  2    2  143.50  209.0  4.11   0
BAW Mendis      SL   1    1   66.00  126.0  3.14   0
D Kaneria       Pak  1    1  171.00  198.0  5.18   0

GP Swann        Eng 13   53   24.35   47.4  3.07   4

Yeah, England struggle against spin, non subcontinental spinners get belted.

Why would you even post that? Completely irrelevant.

 

[flibbertyjibber]

Why would you even post that? Completely irrelevant.

Well I guess he is saying that if England will struggle against the SC spinners then Swann will feast as he has a far better record than any of them on pitches that do bugger all for him most of the time. The talk of spin defeating England is a bit much as we have the best spinner in the world so what will he do in return.

Considering SC players are so great against spin it is surprising to see Swann has such a good record against SC batsmen in England.

 

[Xuhaib]

I don't think Swann will find as much success in sub cont/ME as he finds in England. Swann is a bowler who relies a lot on drift and he will not get the same amount of drift in SC/ME as he gets in UK. Also he has to contend with Misbah and Younis this time the two are possibly the best batsman of spin from Pakistan in the last 20 years.

 

[Daemon]

Well I guess he is saying that if England will struggle against the SC spinners then Swann will feast as he has a far better record than any of them on pitches that do bugger all for him most of the time. The talk of spin defeating England is a bit much as we have the best spinner in the world so what will he do in return.

Considering SC players are so great against spin it is surprising to see Swann has such a good record against SC batsmen in England.

But the topic was about whether or not Ajmal got 'owned' in England..

 

[smash84]

I don't think Swann will find as much success in sub cont/ME as he finds in England. Swann is a bowler who relies a lot on drift and he will not get the same amount of drift in SC/ME as he gets in UK. Also he has to contend with Misbah and Younis this time the two are possibly the best batsman of spin from Pakistan in the last 20 years.

Salim Malik? MoYo? Anwar?

 

[smash84]

But the topic was about whether or not Ajmal got 'owned' in England..

exactly

 

[Xuhaib]

Salim Malik? MoYo? Anwar?

Malik is a product of 80's. Anwar ok might be a good call never rated Mo Yo very highly vs quality spin.

My rating

Miandad
Younis
Malik
Anwar
Misbah

 

[smash84]

Malik is a product of 80's. Anwar ok might be a good call never rated Mo Yo very highly vs quality spin.

My rating

Miandad
Younis
Malik
Anwar
Misbah

Played most of his cricket in the 90s

 

[Furball]

But the topic was about whether or not Ajmal got 'owned' in England..

No it wasn't.

 

[Daemon]

They've owned Ajmal, - admittedly all in England.

seems a bit OTT to me

Averaged 29 against them

which isn't exactly being owned

which was my point..

Wasn't exactly brilliant either. Took a 5-for in the first Test he played in the series, did pretty much **** all else.

edit: Spinners in England 2010-2011

Name            Team T    W    Ave      SR  Econ  5w

S Ajmal         Pak  3   12   29.41   62.5  2.82   1
S Al Hasan      Ban  2    8   34.75   60.3  3.45   1
HMRKB Herath    SL   3    6   49.83   95.8  3.12   0
A Mishra        Ind  2    3  106.66  162.0  3.95   0
Mahmadullah     Ban  2    2   80.50  150.5  3.20   0
Harbhajan Singh Ind  2    2  143.50  209.0  4.11   0
BAW Mendis      SL   1    1   66.00  126.0  3.14   0
D Kaneria       Pak  1    1  171.00  198.0  5.18   0

GP Swann        Eng 13   53   24.35   47.4  3.07   4

Yeah, England struggle against spin, non subcontinental spinners get belted.

So yes, it was about Ajmal.

 

[Furball]

Your first quote is a bit selective is it not? Also missing a quote from Shri.

 

[smash84]

it is selective because he is not quoting the irrelevant part