Official Pro-Wrestling Thread (WWE, TNA, ROH etc.)

[cricman]

YouTube - wwe 2-21-09 029.MOV

WOW

 

[Manee]

SPOILERS

Definitely did not catch that, watching it on TV, just looked like he was pissed and ran to the ring out of anger, or something. Wasn't crazy about the whole PPV tbh, Cena making Triple H tap looked a bit pathetic, as the STFU always does and then Batista coming out sort of devalued the entire chamber match.

A lot of the PPV seemed like it was just time wasting, such as the Miz-MVP match and the women's 'match' and the weird Regal-Edge segment. The Smackdown chamber was okay, but R Truth got majorly buried and Jericho looked weak as hell crawling over Taker for the three count.

 

[GIMH]

Can't agree with you really. Triple H was in the STF for ages and had no choice but to tap - I don't see how that looked pathetic - unless you mean the way Cena applies the hold in general?

As for Batista devaluing the match, depends how you look at it. It was the payoff from some great TV over recent weeks and will add tonnes of value to their Mania rematch, which let's face it is what this PPV is all about. The whole story is that Cena's heroics were all in vein because Batista sold out. I love it.

There certainly was a lot of time-wasting - why not just announce Miz-MVP in advance? It was a good match though. Women's match was ********. The Miz' promo on Danielson was off the charts, though! And the Regal-Edge thing seemed just to be, "hmm, how can we promote NXT and how can we get Edge on the show?"

As for the Smackdown Chamber, I don't think R-Truth was buried, although readers of this thread are probably aware that I believe it is a term which gets thrown around far too much. I would have liked to see him stay in later, but he got some strong offence in while he was there so it wasn't like he was squashed. Also, we got to see CM Punk do his Rumble schtick again

Morrison got put over huge in the Chamber, Taker sold like a bitch for him and basically in story terms he'd have been able to pin the deadman but for his ankle issue. He gained more from this match than anyone, IMO.

Finally, I have to disagree with your assertion that Jericho looked 'weak as hell'. It was an Elimination Chamber, he was supposed to be hurt! Jericho was genius as ever throughout the match and it's great to see him with the belt as he's been my favourite wrestler since about 1997.

Sorry Manee, feel like I always disagree with you lately

 

[sledger]

Agree with Corrin completely here, on every point. Both Chamber matches were booked pretty damn well I thought. Have to wonder what HHH has in line for him at WM now though, presumably a match with Sheamus. Though it's going to be great to see HBK vs Taker again...I still feel it shouldn't be done, I find it hard to imagine how it's going to live up to their last effort, or get close to topping it. But otherwise everything is in place for a great WM card. Don't see why Miz vs MVP wasn't prior announced though. The Edge/Regal segment was stupid, but at least it got Edge on screen for a bit. Dunno why they couldn't have him as a guest commentator or something instead. In fact a more logical way for that segment to have been booked would surely just be for Edge to come out to make his announcement and then have Regal interupt rather than the other way around...but oh well, not really an issue.

I did wonder why Taker was almost running to the ring during his entrance though, kind of makes sense now that it's clear he was set alight by his pyro. Apparently he was mega pissed off backstage, not surprised really.

 

[GIMH]

HBK-Taker II is an interesting one. I said after their match last year that I never wanted them to face off again. But the minute it started being teased, I was like hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Even if it's not as good as last year it's hard to see them putting on anything other than a classic. Interested in seeing how this plays off in the coming weeks - I have a feeling HBK may have his career on the line at Mania...

 

[Manee]

Can't agree with you really. Triple H was in the STF for ages and had no choice but to tap - I don't see how that looked pathetic - unless you mean the way Cena applies the hold in general?

Yeah, the way he applies the hold.

As for Batista devaluing the match, depends how you look at it. It was the payoff from some great TV over recent weeks and will add tonnes of value to their Mania rematch, which let's face it is what this PPV is all about. The whole story is that Cena's heroics were all in vein because Batista sold out. I love it.

Was okay, but a bit predictable.

There certainly was a lot of time-wasting - why not just announce Miz-MVP in advance? It was a good match though. Women's match was ********. The Miz' promo on Danielson was off the charts, though! And the Regal-Edge thing seemed just to be, "hmm, how can we promote NXT and how can we get Edge on the show?"

Miz and Danielson ought to be interesting, and Miz may actually help make him more mainstream, tbh.

As for the Smackdown Chamber, I don't think R-Truth was buried, although readers of this thread are probably aware that I believe it is a term which gets thrown around far too much. I would have liked to see him stay in later, but he got some strong offence in while he was there so it wasn't like he was squashed. Also, we got to see CM Punk do his Rumble schtick again

I've rarely supported a superstar, since back in the Austin-Rock days, as I have with CM Punk - the guy is beyond awesome. He is that good and more.

Morrison got put over huge in the Chamber, Taker sold like a bitch for him and basically in story terms he'd have been able to pin the deadman but for his ankle issue. He gained more from this match than anyone, IMO.

Not sure. Mid card face getting in genuine offense isn't something too exciting and happens quite often, because after all, they dominate matches against the heels that they face until a roll up or dirty move costs them the match. However, it is definitely part of a Morrison push which I hope goes further. He has the look and the moves of a champion and he is somebody who worked up from obscurity, which I quite like.

Finally, I have to disagree with your assertion that Jericho looked 'weak as hell'. It was an Elimination Chamber, he was supposed to be hurt! Jericho was genius as ever throughout the match and it's great to see him with the belt as he's been my favourite wrestler since about 1997.

Sorry Manee, feel like I always disagree with you lately

Jericho was good in the match but I felt he could have locked in the Walls of Jericho or hit a lionsault or something, rather than crawl over the burnt carcas of Taker. Jericho is good though - I don't love, but I quite enjoy his promos and he's good in the ring with a strong moveset. A wrestler with four big impact moves (the high kick, lionsault, walls of jericho and codebreaker) who is a strong technical wrestler will always have depth and quality to matches and Jericho definitely has that.

Lol, no worries. I was a little annoyed since I'd just run 10 minutes home from the bus stop (after a 30 minute bus journey) because I needed a piss.

 

[sledger]

HBK-Taker II is an interesting one. I said after their match last year that I never wanted them to face off again. But the minute it started being teased, I was like hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Even if it's not as good as last year it's hard to see them putting on anything other than a classic. Interested in seeing how this plays off in the coming weeks - I have a feeling HBK may have his career on the line at Mania...

It'll be a good one, no doubt about it, as both guys are taking time off afterwards I imagine both of them will be going pretty much all out to put on the best match possible. If they can improve on what they did last year, then I will be mega impressed and mark out like crazy, because their last effort was almost certainly the best match I have ever seen. I'm guessing what we are getting at WM now looks something like this.

Jericho vs Edge

Cena vs Batista

Taker vs HBK

HHH vs Sheamus (not so keen on this one myself, but reckon Sheamus will probably pick up the win, which would be good in the long run, as no matter how much the commentary team are trying to put him over, the fans are just having none of him at the moment)

Punk vs Rey

Imagine there will also be some sort of Tag Team battle royal or something or some sort of match for the IC/US title too, particularly if the MITB is scrapped, because otherwise the likes of Kofi, Christian, Miz and Morrison etc...will be left off the card, and that would be criminal.

 

[GIMH]

Jericho was good in the match but I felt he could have locked in the Walls of Jericho or hit a lionsault or something, rather than crawl over the burnt carcas of Taker.
.

Just watched this again - really can't agree on this one. He'd just gone for the last ride, is pretty much done and then one of his biggest enemies superkicks his opponent - after Sweet Chin Music no other move should be required anyway, least of all at the end of a Chamber match. The last gasp crawl was great IMO, as was his face while he did it. Best in the world, for me.

 

[Manee]

Agree with Corrin completely here, on every point. Both Chamber matches were booked pretty damn well I thought. Have to wonder what HHH has in line for him at WM now though, presumably a match with Sheamus. Though it's going to be great to see HBK vs Taker again...I still feel it shouldn't be done, I find it hard to imagine how it's going to live up to their last effort, or get close to topping it. But otherwise everything is in place for a great WM card. Don't see why Miz vs MVP wasn't prior announced though. The Edge/Regal segment was stupid, but at least it got Edge on screen for a bit. Dunno why they couldn't have him as a guest commentator or something instead. In fact a more logical way for that segment to have been booked would surely just be for Edge to come out to make his announcement and then have Regal interupt rather than the other way around...but oh well, not really an issue.

I'm not sure I want to see HBK Vs Taker II either, there will be a new dynamic with HBK as the traditional heel, presumably, but I still do not think it'll work. I would love to see Bret as referee for this, if his broken leg gets him out of his Vince fued, but that is wishful thinking. Sheamus Vs HHH looks likely, but without the title, what is the point? It'll just be a clean HHH win, surely.

I did wonder why Taker was almost running to the ring during his entrance though, kind of makes sense now that it's clear he was set alight by his pyro. Apparently he was mega pissed off backstage, not surprised really.

Yeah, I think under the list of reasons for getting pissed, getting set on fire by the pyro would be up there. Just think though, if he'd been an oiled up wrestler like Hogan or the Warrior, back in the day, he could have died, that is pretty severe right there - somebody really must get fired () for that.

HBK-Taker II is an interesting one. I said after their match last year that I never wanted them to face off again. But the minute it started being teased, I was like hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Even if it's not as good as last year it's hard to see them putting on anything other than a classic. Interested in seeing how this plays off in the coming weeks - I have a feeling HBK may have his career on the line at Mania...

Yes, I think there may be a stipulation of sorts which may salvage the concept of HBK Vs Taker II.

 

[sledger]

Reckon the Bret "leg break" thing is just a way of them kayfabing a reason for why they can't have a Vince/Bret match tbh, the feud will certainly continue, but clearly under a Cena representing Bret, Batista representing Vince angle.

 

[Manee]

Just watched this again - really can't agree on this one. He'd just gone for the last ride, is pretty much done and then one of his biggest enemies superkicks his opponent - after Sweet Chin Music no other move should be required anyway, least of all at the end of a Chamber match. The last gasp crawl was great IMO, as was his face while he did it. Best in the world, for me.

Jericho is awesome, but I wasn't crazy about the ending, but it is nothing more than opinion and yours probably has more logical basis to mine, anyway.

 

[Manee]

Reckon the Bret "leg break" thing is just a way of them kayfabing a reason for why they can't have a Vince/Bret match tbh, the feud will certainly continue, but clearly under a Cena representing Bret, Batista representing Vince angle.

That just doesn't make sense though. I really hope that it is not the case, because Cena and Bret have no history other than Cena being a 'great guy' - it just seems like a cop out to me. I'd rather nothing than Cena representing Bret by virtue of being such a hero. It is for the title anyway, I'm not sure why they'd have two different focusses for the feud.

 

[sledger]

That just doesn't make sense though. I really hope that it is not the case, because Cena and Bret have no history other than Cena being a 'great guy' - it just seems like a cop out to me. I'd rather nothing than Cena representing Bret by virtue of being such a hero. It is for the title anyway, I'm not sure why they'd have two different focusses for the feud.

With the way Cena has been an on screen friend with Bret for the majority of the time he has been back I would say this is a lock, and is clearly been in the works for a while. Tbh it is going to be someone representing Bret vs someone representing Vince, and who else would be better placed to do this than the two guys who have been the most over for the best part of the last decade? Cena and Batista are the companies two real franchise players, just like Bret was back in the day, having Cena represent Bret makes perfect sense to me. Besdies, what else could be done? Bret simply cannot work a match, and canning his feud with Vince to make him a referee elsewhere would be a massive waste imo.

 

[Manee]

It'll be a good one, no doubt about it, as both guys are taking time off afterwards I imagine both of them will be going pretty much all out to put on the best match possible. If they can improve on what they did last year, then I will be mega impressed and mark out like crazy, because their last effort was almost certainly the best match I have ever seen. I'm guessing what we are getting at WM now looks something like this.

Jericho vs Edge

Cena vs Batista

Taker vs HBK

HHH vs Sheamus (not so keen on this one myself, but reckon Sheamus will probably pick up the win, which would be good in the long run, as no matter how much the commentary team are trying to put him over, the fans are just having none of him at the moment)

Punk vs Rey

Imagine there will also be some sort of Tag Team battle royal or something or some sort of match for the IC/US title too, particularly if the MITB is scrapped, because otherwise the likes of Kofi, Christian, Miz and Morrison etc...will be left off the card, and that would be criminal.

I would really enjoy a triple threat of Edge Vs Christian Vs Jericho rather than the singles match. A triple threat would be epic, especially with Christian's history with both Edge and Jericho. I think that Punk Vs Rey would be a waste considering that they have wrestled on Smackdown and Rey is a pretty clean cut sort of guy. Punk Vs Morrison would have some depth to it and I'd much rather see it because I really do tire of watching Mysterio wrestle and would not want to see Punk wasted on him. Though I do understand that people do enjoy Rey's highflying style, I am just not a fan.

Sheamus is awesome, btw. The music, the look on his face, the fact that he is pale, his accent - he is just an all round legend.

 

[Manee]

With the way Cena has been an on screen friend with Bret for the majority of the time he has been back I would say this is a lock, and is clearly been in the works for a while. Tbh it is going to be someone representing Bret vs someone representing Vince, and who else would be better placed to do this than the two guys who have been the most over for the best part of the last decade? Cena and Batista are the companies two real franchise players, just like Bret was back in the day, having Cena represent Bret makes perfect sense to me. Besdies, what else could be done? Bret simply cannot work a match, and canning his feud with Vince to make him a referee elsewhere would be a massive waste imo.

Yes, it was more wishful thinking because they'd just have to give up on the Vince feud. I do think that even DH Smith could represent Hart against Batista. I think there'd be fan support for a mid carder, challenging the monster for the title with Bret in his corner. It'd be a great underdog story and to add heat, Bret could say that Vince was responsible for the death's of Owen and Bulldog, to get it off him and more toward the whole Hart family. Again, not looking like happening, but would proper enjoy such a move. It just makes a joke that you have a whole dynasty of Hart wrestlers and people from the dungeon and you just choose some guy from the US who is a mega face.

 

[sledger]

I would really enjoy a triple threat of Edge Vs Christian Vs Jericho rather than the singles match. A triple threat would be epic, especially with Christian's history with both Edge and Jericho. I think that Punk Vs Rey would be a waste considering that they have wrestled on Smackdown and Rey is a pretty clean cut sort of guy. Punk Vs Morrison would have some depth to it and I'd much rather see it because I really do tire of watching Mysterio wrestle and would not want to see Punk wasted on him. Though I do understand that people do enjoy Rey's highflying style, I am just not a fan.

Sheamus is awesome, btw. The music, the look on his face, the fact that he is pale, his accent - he is just an all round legend.

Punk vs Mysterio would be a show stealer, were it not for the fact that HBK/Taker will likely be on the same card. The Punk/Mysterio match from about two years ago was a match of the year candidate, and probably Punk's best match in the WWE since he joined. Having them face each other again in a PPV quality match imo would not at all be a waste, esspecially considering Punk isn't going to get any meaningful feud elsewhere with all the big names already booked up.

As for the triple threat...hmm...not sure, much as I love Christian, he would have to be pushed pretty hard for him to be legitimately involved in this match, it would also detract from the Edge/Jericho storyline which has been building for the best part of a year, so I wouldn't be in favour of this, though it would no doubt be a good match. With Edge now face though, a Christian heel turn is probably in the works and an Edge/Christian feud will almost certainly happen a few months down the line.

 

[GIMH]

Reckon the Bret "leg break" thing is just a way of them kayfabing a reason for why they can't have a Vince/Bret match tbh, the feud will certainly continue, but clearly under a Cena representing Bret, Batista representing Vince angle.

Reckon he'll fight Vince anyway tbh. Either the thing comes out as a worked work by Cena/Bret to get Vince to accept the match (on the basis that Bret can't wrestle) or he just makes some kind of unfeasible comeback. Dunno, but Cena-Batista has gone way past being about Bret and Vince for mine, could be wrong though.

Jericho is awesome, but I wasn't crazy about the ending, but it is nothing more than opinion and yours probably has more logical basis to mine, anyway.

NO YOU'RE WRONG

Nah, fair

 

[sledger]

Yes, it was more wishful thinking because they'd just have to give up on the Vince feud. I do think that even DH Smith could represent Hart against Batista. I think there'd be fan support for a mid carder, challenging the monster for the title with Bret in his corner. It'd be a great underdog story and to add heat, Bret could say that Vince was responsible for the death's of Owen and Bulldog, to get it off him and more toward the whole Hart family. Again, not looking like happening, but would proper enjoy such a move. It just makes a joke that you have a whole dynasty of Hart wrestlers and people from the dungeon and you just choose some guy from the US who is a mega face.

Tbh the only person from the dungeon currently in the E who is high profile enough to represent Bret on this scale is Jericho, and a face turn for him and shunting him in here was never going to happen. DH Smith is nowhere near over enough for this sort of role, and I cannot see them EVER doing a storyline regarding Bulldog's or anyone elses death and blaming it on the company, probably the last thing they would ever want to do given what has happened to various workers over the last few years.

 

[sledger]

Reckon he'll fight Vince anyway tbh. Either the thing comes out as a worked work by Cena/Bret to get Vince to accept the match (on the basis that Bret can't wrestle) or he just makes some kind of unfeasible comeback. Dunno, but Cena-Batista has gone way past being about Bret and Vince for mine, could be wrong though.

I agree, but I imagine the "fight" Bret and Vince will have will consist of no more than Bret maybe getting in a few punches/chair shots and locking him in the sharpshooter, there is no way a legit match of any substantial length can be made out of it surely. Cena and Batista has gone beyond Vince/Bret yes, but Vince has been integral to the whole thing, and with Cena being close knit with Bret for the last few weeks it all ties very closely together, I might be wrong, but imo there will be some sort of cross involvement for WM. I reckon in fact, that there might be a stip on the Batista/Cena match, say if Cena wins Vince is forced to spend 5 mins in the ring with Bret or whatever, and Bret will sit up from his "broken leg" ala Linda McMahon from the wheelchair at WM17.

 

[GIMH]

Yes, it was more wishful thinking because they'd just have to give up on the Vince feud. I do think that even DH Smith could represent Hart against Batista. I think there'd be fan support for a mid carder, challenging the monster for the title with Bret in his corner. It'd be a great underdog story and to add heat, Bret could say that Vince was responsible for the death's of Owen and Bulldog, to get it off him and more toward the whole Hart family. Again, not looking like happening, but would proper enjoy such a move. It just makes a joke that you have a whole dynasty of Hart wrestlers and people from the dungeon and you just choose some guy from the US who is a mega face.

Am I the only one who thinks the Hart Dynasty are way overrated? I think they are gaining loads of Internet support by connection alone, they don't interest me at all.

Also, you'd be pushing credibility to blame Bulldog's death on WWE, it was WCW's fault really. Though I suppose you could do a chain of causation as he wouldn't have been in WCW but for the screwjob...

Tbh the only person from the dungeon currently in the E who is high profile enough to represent Bret on this scale is Jericho, and a face turn for him and shunting him in here was never going to happen. DH Smith is nowhere near over enough for this sort of role, and I cannot see them EVER doing a storyline regarding Bulldog's or anyone elses death and blaming it on the company, probably the last thing they would ever want to do given what has happened to various workers over the last few years.

Isn't it a bit of an urban myth to claim Jericho is from the dungeon?