***Official*** South Africa in India

[social]

Having proven my Nostradamus like qualities in this series, I'll now throw another at you - final test wont last 4 full days

Simple deduction - India need a win and the wicket is likely to be less than favourable to batting

However, that wont guarantee an Indian victory as, without Tendy, their lineup could well fold again no matter how many batsmen they choose and even if the wicket turns square

 

[ret]

Having proven my Nostradamus like qualities in this series, I'll now throw another at you - final test wont last 4 full days

Simple deduction - India need a win and the wicket is likely to be less than favourable to batting

However, that wont guarantee an Indian victory as, without Tendy, their lineup could well fold again no matter how many batsmen they choose and even if the wicket turns square

I agree with your comments on the batting .... yep, it's the quality of batting that counts and not how many batsmen you play, i.e. quantity

Mr Nostradamus, if the pitch will be less than favorable for batting, would this not become a case of who does worse at batting? what gives you the confidence in SA line up to do better than the Indian line up in Kanpur, considering the above case .... and how effective would the SA quicks be on such a wkt

 

[social]

I agree with your comments on the batting .... yep, it's the quality of batting that counts and not how many batsmen you play, i.e. quantity

Mr Nostradamus, if the pitch will be less than favorable for batting, would this not become a case of who does worse at batting? what gives you the confidence in SA line up to do better than the Indian line up in Kanpur, considering the above case .... and how effective would the SA quicks be on such a wkt

The SA quicks have pretty much dominated the Indian lineup bar 4 sessions when Sehwag batted so brilliantly.

If nothing else, I'd expect them to remain a threat no matter what conditions are served up.

Although I've never really rated Harris (far too much of a "roller" of the ball for my liking), spin-friendly conditions are likely to help him far more than Kumble or Harby as the difference in quality is far more readily apparent when conditions are against you.

I think that the big problem for India is that they need enough bowlers of sufficient quality to take 20 wickets but, on the evidence of this test, they also need another batsman

Unfortunately, without Tendulkar and particularly now that Kallis is in his stride, they simply may not have the combination available to pull it off

 

[ret]

The SA quicks have pretty much dominated the Indian lineup bar 4 sessions when Sehwag batted so brilliantly.

If nothing else, I'd expect them to remain a threat no matter what conditions are served up.

Although I've never really rated Harris (far too much of a "roller" of the ball for my liking), spin-friendly conditions are likely to help him far more than Kumble or Harby as the difference in quality is far more readily apparent when conditions are against you.

I think that the big problem for India is that they need enough bowlers of sufficient quality to take 20 wickets but, on the evidence of this test, they also need another batsman

Unfortunately, without Tendulkar and particularly now that Kallis is in his stride, they simply may not have the combination available to pull it off

I must say that^ is one of the better posts of this thread

Lets assume that SA quicks are effective no matter what the conditions but why do you think that the rest of SA batting will be more effective on a turning surface than their Indian counterparts? and it just takes two balls in the game to remove Kallis, who might gets get them early on

 

[silentstriker]

Well, Tendulkar is officially out, and Sharma may be too...no word on Zaheer.

 

[Jono]

No word on Zaheer because he was already ruled out for the whole series right?

 

[Sanz]

Well, Tendulkar is officially out, and Sharma may be too...no word on Zaheer.

Zaheer has already said that he is not fit for international matches.

Had IPL not been around all three would have played this entire series.

 

[Sanz]

Kumble did 3 major mistakes in this test matc :-

1. Elected to bat after winning the test match
2. Picked Pathan ahead of a batsman
3. Continued to play an unfit RP Singh

 

[ret]

Zaheer has already said that he is not fit for international matches.

Had IPL not been around all three would have played this entire series.

?

 

[silentstriker]

No word on Zaheer because he was already ruled out for the whole series right?

Didn't know that. Makes sense though.

Zaheer has already said that he is not fit for international matches.

Had IPL not been around all three would have played this entire series.

Doubtful. Tendulkar didn't rule himself out. Plus playing with injuries just leads to more problems.

 

[Jono]

IPL's a nice scape goat for blame, but Tendulkar wouldn't have played the 1st test if that's the case, and Ishant wouldn't be undergoing these annoying fitness tests and would have just been ruled out of the series.

Its always a lingering thought though, I acknowledge that. That's the way cricket will be in the future though.

Also, can't fault Kumble for batting first IMO. He did it in Perth and was given all kinds of praise (I realise the track wasn't green), showing that they weren't afraid and were willing to take it up to Australia. Not his fault his batting order played like ammateurs.

What is his fault is he went in with 3 test quality batsman surrounded by a keeper who is struggling to find his place in test cricket as a batsman, an opener who goes out the same way time and time again on a pitch that isn't flat, and a number 7 who is a bowling allrounder. That too with a tail who has a history of collapsing.

I've made my voice clear earlier in this thread about how I like 6 batsmen + a keeper, and believe that in India they should never go in with 5 bowlers, so I completely agree with many of Goughy's posts here.

Mind you, the way India player it doesn't matter what side they selected, they were always losing.

 

[silentstriker]

For Kanpur, my ideal side (e.g, they dont have to be in the squad), assuming Ishant is out:

1. Sehwag
2. Chopra
3. Dravid
4. Laxman
5. Badrinath
6. Ganguly
7. Dhoni
8. Kumble
9. Kumar
10. Harbhajan
11. Sreesanth

Ganguly is going to have to bowl a bit of seam up when the ball is new.

 

[Manee]

Had IPL not been around all three would have played this entire series.

In practice though, it works well for players to rehab with T20s rather than play Test matches and aggrevate their injured parts.

 

[Sanz]

Doubtful. Tendulkar didn't rule himself out. Plus playing with injuries just leads to more problems.

Let's see If all three miraculously recover for the IPL. Not suggesting anything on the Player's part though or that they should play through injuries. Just that If not for IPL, BCCI would have made them play the tests with the injury and they will end up playing IPL.

Groin Injuries dont heal in a week or so.

 

[Jono]

For Kanpur, my ideal side (e.g, they dont have to be in the squad), assuming Ishant is out:

1. Sehwag
2. Chopra
3. Dravid
4. Laxman
5. Badrinath
6. Ganguly
7. Dhoni
8. Kumble
9. Kumar
10. Harbhajan
11. Sreesanth

Ganguly is going to have to bowl a bit of seam up when the ball is new.

Wish I could actually see Badrinath in action (the only chance I ever got to see Indian FC cricket of late was the Ranji final in January).

I'm a huge Kaif fan, so am biased, but after his recent season he's almost a shoo-in to replace Sachin I imagine. Particularly with his int'l experience.

 

[Sanz]

Also, can't fault Kumble for batting first IMO. He did it in Perth and was given all kinds of praise (I realise the track wasn't green), showing that they weren't afraid and were willing to take it up to Australia. Not his fault his batting order played like ammateurs.

What is his fault is he went in with 3 test quality batsman surrounded by a keeper who is struggling to find his place in test cricket as a batsman, an opener who goes out the same way time and time again on a pitch that isn't flat, and a number 7 who is a bowling allrounder. That too with a tail who has a history of collapsing.

Perth and Motera are not comparable. Not only was WACA pitch not a greentop but there India played with 7 batsmen.

Needless to say, Indian bowling attack in Perth was fitter and faster. SreeSanth couldn't find a place in WACA test, here he was the leading fast bowler. Not to forget the fact that Kumble himself wasn't fully fit. Sums up the difference in our bowling strength.

Just because he was praised in Perth for taking a tough decision doesn't mean he should be praised every time for electing bat on a tough pitch even if it is an obvious mistake, at least it was in my opinion.

 

[Sanz]

In practice though, it works well for players to rehab with T20s rather than play Test matches and aggrevate their injured parts.

No, it doesn't. A Twenty20 match is very demanding as well. it requires big hitting, extra effort in fielding.

 

[Jono]

Sree would have played in Perth if he was fit though.

I'm confused as to why you say a 'less-fit' bowling attack would affect his decision to bat first. Wouldn't it be better to give them as much a rest as possible (I'm sure he expected his batsman to last longer than 1 session )

Mind you, going in with 5 batsman, I probably would have bowled first too. I just don't think it would have made that much difference, I mean the pitch wouldn't have changed from session 1 day 1 and session 2 day 2, yet it felt like it was different considering how SA bowled and how India bowled.

 

[Sanz]

Wish I could actually see Badrinath in action.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_JxK3R-qfQ

 

[Jono]

Thanks Sanz.