Nate
You'll Never Walk Alone
Or... let's bowl four pacemen. If our spin options are as hopeless as you put them, let's not pick a spinner.
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***Official*** Australia in India
- Thread starter TT Boy
- Start date
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Or pick Bracken as the spinner! He gets some turn at times with those fast left-arm-orthodox balls in the middle overs of ODIs.
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Or, better yet, if Hogg can back to domestic cricket and score some runs, we can pick four pacemen and him and drop Symonds!!
(Yes, it always gets back to dropping Symonds with me.)
(Yes, it always gets back to dropping Symonds with me.
)
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
Surely you'd support any decision that got Bracken in the team, even if it did mean owning up to the fact that he's a spinner.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
If that had happened, we would have seen an explosive re-entry of JustTool to these forums as well....Don't worry, we'll fall five short after Tendulkar makes 80, and it will be because Tendulkar can't handle pressure.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
not really. 99 out of 100 times umps won't give it when they see the keeper not appealing. And of course, if Gilly can miss the nick, so can the umpire. Not a big fault, not a big wrong decision. You didn't deserve to win if you can create only 3 wicket taking opportunities against the Indian tail after having them 60/6.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
not really. Hogg was not out caught at short leg but I thought it was a pretty ok decision to be given out LBW, given that he was not playing a shot and Kartik was turning them into the stumps. I would have given that out LBW, watching it on real time. (Granted I m not a gr8 umpire, but looked close enough to me.
) Clarke was only as unlucky as Uthappa, because the ball that got Uthappa was shown by hawk eye was only very very marginally clipping the top bail of leg stump and you expect umpires to give the benefit of the doubt to the batsmen in those cases all the time. And the Kartik decision, as I said, Gilly was closer to it and perhaps had a better view and even he missed it, so why can't the umpire miss it? If you wanna talk about getting lucky, think of the 5 or 6 wides that were NOT called by the umpires as well when India were batting. And as I said, regardless of luck, if this is the best Aussie bowlers can do against the Indian tail, they did deserve to lose.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
Clarke's decision was hardly dubious. Most guys would have given that out on first sight because he just looked so plumb. And no, umpires can have a hard time judging the bounce from the pitch FIRST ball of the match, because you have got nothing to go on. You thinking that decision was dubious shows how much you know about the game. It was unfortunate, yes and a wrong decision, yes, but not a dubious one and it is a mistake that would have been made had it been Tendulkar out there facing Mitch. It looked out and was given out. Dravid's first baller in that match after the Chandigarh one had an inside edge feel to it, which snicko confirmed. But we didn't come out here and whine about it, like you, because again it was a decision which looked out in real time. Can't blame the umpires for that.
Hogg, as I said, was a really really bad decision because it was given out caught short leg. Still think he had a veery decent case for the LBW though. And it is not like his dismissal cost you the match, given the way those guys were playing Kartik. Ponting got a close call for a LBW as well, from what I heard from guys who watched the Aussie inning on TV. These things happen in cricket and there is yet to be a match which was won PURELY on luck. Luck helps, but it cannot and will not win you matches.
And plz let go of the Kartik thing already. And if you are expecting umpires to uphold appeals when the keeper himself isn't appealing, I am sorry but you are going to be disappointed more often than not.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
does ur blood boil when Langer and Ponting and the likes nick and stay back and score 100s? did ur blood boil when Steve Waugh did that EVERY other test? Did your blood boil when Langer flicked the bails off against Sri Lanka when the batsman wasn't watching and your ever so honest Ponting and Hayden appealed for a hit wicket?
Hold on, it only counts when it is non-Aussies, right?
andyc
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Haha, you're such a ****.
dontcloseyoureyes
BARNES OUT
He actually has already stated previously that yes, it did get to him.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
some thoughts on the series:
* India, for that matter, any side, needs a settled TOP 3. That SHOULD NOT change based on the opening stand or whatever. You put the guys you think can do the best job at those positions and you DO NOT change them. The best sides work that way. The odd occassion, you can get in a pinch hitter, but to keep the no.3 as a permanent flexible spot is just asking for trouble. The last time India looked like being consistent in ODIs was when we had a settled top 3, either it was Sachin, Sehwag and Sourav or Sachin, Sehwag, Laxman or Sehwag, Sourav, Laxman/Mongia. We didn't shunt up the other middle order guys to 3 too much and it worked well for us. Time for us to go back to that again. Sachin/Sourav are obviously gonna be our openers and we need a real #3 now. Gambhir doesn't look the answer, Uthappa has found his niche lower down, IMO, and I think it should be one of Sharma, Karthik and Badrinath. And I am still leaning towards Karthik. I know he failed thrice in that position recently but as I keep saying, he is one Indian youngster with a pretty decent technique and I think he warrants a run for at least one whole series as our permanent #3. If he is not good enough, we can go to the next options.
* Australia have to be complemented for sticking with Hodge. I like the policy, tbh. I know it is unbelieveably hard on Haddin, but if you think someone has potential, you have to give them a decent run. India is not an easy place for a guy to be making his debut in (almost, given that he has had very limited experience internationally) and one needs to be given a decent run. Now, he has failed in this series, so maybe they will take the final call on where he stands in the Aussie ODI set up now. But if they had done that after just a couple of games, it would have been harsh on him. That is why I think India need to do the same with their youngsters. Just look at how Bell has developed now after England kept giving him so many chances.
* Johnson, Lee, Clark will be a formidable attack under all conditions in all forms of cricket. Australia may have lost out on a genius paceman in McGrath but it seems it will be offset by the combination of this trio, at least to a great extent. They have got everything, searing pace of Brett Lee, swing at good pace from Mitch and bounce and control from Clark. Should go places, this attack.
* Haddin looks like a good enough replacement for Gilly as and when he decides to give up, at least in ODIs. But Australia will have a problem replacing him at the top of the order. Clarke is perhaps NOT the ideal reserve opener for them. How good is Haddin at the top of the order?
* Uthappa should be permanently playing at 6 or 7 in this side. His technique will get found out if he bats too high and he seems to be the ideal power player to have at 6 or 7. Been a discovery out of accident, this, but India should make good use of his talents at this position.
* India SHOULD NOT play 3 left arm seamers, I know we won two games with that attack, but it is too predictable and none of them are exactly GREAT as bowlers. At best, play with two left arm seamers, two spinners and 7 batsmen.
* India, for that matter, any side, needs a settled TOP 3. That SHOULD NOT change based on the opening stand or whatever. You put the guys you think can do the best job at those positions and you DO NOT change them. The best sides work that way. The odd occassion, you can get in a pinch hitter, but to keep the no.3 as a permanent flexible spot is just asking for trouble. The last time India looked like being consistent in ODIs was when we had a settled top 3, either it was Sachin, Sehwag and Sourav or Sachin, Sehwag, Laxman or Sehwag, Sourav, Laxman/Mongia. We didn't shunt up the other middle order guys to 3 too much and it worked well for us. Time for us to go back to that again. Sachin/Sourav are obviously gonna be our openers and we need a real #3 now. Gambhir doesn't look the answer, Uthappa has found his niche lower down, IMO, and I think it should be one of Sharma, Karthik and Badrinath. And I am still leaning towards Karthik. I know he failed thrice in that position recently but as I keep saying, he is one Indian youngster with a pretty decent technique and I think he warrants a run for at least one whole series as our permanent #3. If he is not good enough, we can go to the next options.
* Australia have to be complemented for sticking with Hodge. I like the policy, tbh. I know it is unbelieveably hard on Haddin, but if you think someone has potential, you have to give them a decent run. India is not an easy place for a guy to be making his debut in (almost, given that he has had very limited experience internationally) and one needs to be given a decent run. Now, he has failed in this series, so maybe they will take the final call on where he stands in the Aussie ODI set up now. But if they had done that after just a couple of games, it would have been harsh on him. That is why I think India need to do the same with their youngsters. Just look at how Bell has developed now after England kept giving him so many chances.
* Johnson, Lee, Clark will be a formidable attack under all conditions in all forms of cricket. Australia may have lost out on a genius paceman in McGrath but it seems it will be offset by the combination of this trio, at least to a great extent. They have got everything, searing pace of Brett Lee, swing at good pace from Mitch and bounce and control from Clark. Should go places, this attack.
* Haddin looks like a good enough replacement for Gilly as and when he decides to give up, at least in ODIs. But Australia will have a problem replacing him at the top of the order. Clarke is perhaps NOT the ideal reserve opener for them. How good is Haddin at the top of the order?
* Uthappa should be permanently playing at 6 or 7 in this side. His technique will get found out if he bats too high and he seems to be the ideal power player to have at 6 or 7. Been a discovery out of accident, this, but India should make good use of his talents at this position.
* India SHOULD NOT play 3 left arm seamers, I know we won two games with that attack, but it is too predictable and none of them are exactly GREAT as bowlers. At best, play with two left arm seamers, two spinners and 7 batsmen.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
still didn't say if it made his blood boil, did he? All he said was every batsman should walk, which is a bit rich considering he is a fan of the Australian side..
Not that I am saying they are wrong in not walking, hell, I even support them on this, but it is a bit rich for an Aussie fan to state such strong views about people who don't walk, when it is a given that the most vocal supporters of "not walking" have been the Aussie players themselves.
dontcloseyoureyes
BARNES OUT
But the Australian cricket team aren't spokesmen for his feelings on cricket. Surprisingly enough, he's allowed to have opinions on cricket that the national team don't. It's called freedom of thought.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
and surprisingly enough, I haven't yet seen him admit to this particular line of thought of his when it has been the Aussies who have nicked and NOT walked. Surprise, surprise!!!
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
Hey HB
I did notice yesterday what you were saying about Dravid. He did seem forlorn and when Zaheer and Harbhajan were returning, everyone was enthusiastically rushing to embrace them warmly. Dravid was at the end unsurely trying to catch Zaheer's attention. Finally when Zaheer looked at him he gave a wry smile and they shook hands very briefly. I was stunned honestly.
I really wonder whats happening.
I did notice yesterday what you were saying about Dravid. He did seem forlorn and when Zaheer and Harbhajan were returning, everyone was enthusiastically rushing to embrace them warmly. Dravid was at the end unsurely trying to catch Zaheer's attention. Finally when Zaheer looked at him he gave a wry smile and they shook hands very briefly. I was stunned honestly.
I really wonder whats happening.
honestbharani
Whatever it takes!!!
I know. It doesn't look good, does it? I just get the feeling, for whatever reason, that the old coterie of Sourav, Yuvraj, Zaheer, Harbhajan (perhaps) have reunited now and have taken Sachin in along with them as well. And maybe Dhoni. It just seems to me that not a lot of guys have time for Dravid in this team. I am not sure who was in the wrong here. Maybe it was some mistake on the part of Dravid, or maybe it is just a bit of attitude on the part of the others, maybe a bit of payback for being Chappell's yes man to Dravid. But things are not looking good for him.
Such a shame that he has to be in bad form at such a time too. Not many are gonna support him now, even from the public, when his adversaries (as it seems to me) within the side are all doing so well now. I fear the worst for Dravid.
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
Yes. All that you say is possible. It may also explain why he decided to quit the captaincy. He must have seen the straws in the wind.I know. It doesn't look good, does it? I just get the feeling, for whatever reason, that the old coterie of Sourav, Yuvraj, Zaheer, Harbhajan (perhaps) have reunited now and have taken Sachin in along with them as well. And maybe Dhoni. It just seems to me that not a lot of guys have time for Dravid in this team. I am not sure who was in the wrong here. Maybe it was some mistake on the part of Dravid, or maybe it is just a bit of attitude on the part of the others, maybe a bit of payback for being Chappell's yes man to Dravid. But things are not looking good for him.
Such a shame that he has to be in bad form at such a time too. Not many are gonna support him now, even from the public, when his adversaries (as it seems to me) within the side are all doing so well now. I fear the worst for Dravid.
It is a terrible situation I must say. I wish someone would take the initiative to interven in this but I cant see who. Sachin has his supporters and Ganguly had the entire country rooting for him. Dravid has always been a misfit in our 'super-star' culture much like Kumble and Laxman and the smallest slip would see these guys sidelined.
Its really sad but its also early days. Lets wait and watch.
Nate
You'll Never Walk Alone
1) Clark - left out in favour of one of the best One Day International bowlers in the last five years, Nathan Bracken. Unless of course you missed out on the second half of the series, which would make it my bad.
2) What is the problem with Uthappa's technique? Looks gun to me, one of the only batsman to combat Hogg's spin well and was solid against all the pacemen. 6 is doubtful, 7 would be plain wasteful IMO.
3) If you're three best bowlers happen to bowl with their left-arm, pick 'em. Not saying it was the casee for this series, but just in general. Australia played Bracken, Johnson, Hogg and Clarke. Hardly did them any bad.