Slifer
International Captain
Ok so I just looked up that '98 series and admittedly Australia's batting was pathetic. The bowling though. Who the heck is Gavin Robertson and were Mcgrath/Gillespie injured??
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Will current Aussie side beat 95-99 ( Till WI 99 series ) side ?
- Thread starter Sunil1z
- Start date
Sunil1z
International Regular
Yes
Warne was toothless. So they were probably trying everyone.
Burgey
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I don’t recall saying I held it against you. Don’t be defensive, I was just pointing out the 96 tour was a one off test. 98 tour was probably the first time we really got a lot of SC on tv here. Was great stuff.
And yeah. Sunny was pathetic. Same when playing for the ROW here in the early 70s. Beyond terrible.
Burgey
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McGrath was injured, Gillepsie probably was injured but he wasn’t all that great at that stage of his career anyway. It would t have made much of a difference because the batting was so bad in any event
Robbo literally got a game because he was Steve Waugh’s mate. that’s genuinely the case.
He lived in Wenty and was playing soccer in the park for Dundas one day then on a plane to india to play test matches the next.
Slifer
International Captain
Agreed.
Victor Ian
International Coach
Some of the logic here is stupidly ****ed. How would Australia do against Australia?.... Well, Australia lost to India back in back then and they lost recently so the modern one wins because, der, I like them. They won a game in a 4 test series, but the old ones lost a game in a 1 test series. These are not comparable series and certainly matter not the slightest bit when assessing Aus v Aus. The grounds the Aussies will play on are familiar to them all. There is no playing on alien dustbowls or whatnot.
McGrath called out his bitch every series and took them out. He was just very reliable. Warne destroyed everyone, except India, who is NOT who he is playing here. Warne, at this time was pre shoulder injury and immense. He would get into the head of this current Australian team and clean them up. But the real thing that separates the teams, is that Taylors team did not crumble under attack. They cleaned up a series. The modern team can pound someone to the deck like India for 36 or England in that first test, and yet let the opposition somehow get back into the contest. Mentally, they don't have the killer instinct. McGrath and Warne got into heads that are not Indian and became haunting. Australia regularly took out an extremely tough outfit with a huge fighting spirit in the form of SA. Starc, at best is like Wasim light, and The original Australia team took care of Wasim in Australia reasonably well. Hazelwood, is a bit of a sad case of 'he could be mcgrath' but he just cant bowl long spells without missing time due to strains and stuff. The old middle order, took everything the Windies threw at them, while the Windies were still supreme and refused to bow down to hostility. This Aussie team, Smith aside, just doesn't seem to have the mental edge. It is the mental aspect that would see the old team beat the new one. There is no nostalgia here. The old team were just mentally tougher, and at the top levels of sport the mental side is what distinguishes best ever from just pretty f'in good.
So, yeah.....don't trigger me with your big dumb ass, you people with big dumb asses.
McGrath called out his bitch every series and took them out. He was just very reliable. Warne destroyed everyone, except India, who is NOT who he is playing here. Warne, at this time was pre shoulder injury and immense. He would get into the head of this current Australian team and clean them up. But the real thing that separates the teams, is that Taylors team did not crumble under attack. They cleaned up a series. The modern team can pound someone to the deck like India for 36 or England in that first test, and yet let the opposition somehow get back into the contest. Mentally, they don't have the killer instinct. McGrath and Warne got into heads that are not Indian and became haunting. Australia regularly took out an extremely tough outfit with a huge fighting spirit in the form of SA. Starc, at best is like Wasim light, and The original Australia team took care of Wasim in Australia reasonably well. Hazelwood, is a bit of a sad case of 'he could be mcgrath' but he just cant bowl long spells without missing time due to strains and stuff. The old middle order, took everything the Windies threw at them, while the Windies were still supreme and refused to bow down to hostility. This Aussie team, Smith aside, just doesn't seem to have the mental edge. It is the mental aspect that would see the old team beat the new one. There is no nostalgia here. The old team were just mentally tougher, and at the top levels of sport the mental side is what distinguishes best ever from just pretty f'in good.
So, yeah.....don't trigger me with your big dumb ass, you people with big dumb asses.
subshakerz
Hall of Fame Member
Not to mention that Taylor was a tactical genius who somehow knew which card to play at which time.
Australia lost in Sri Lanka in 1999.
In Australian conditions I think the current Australia team wins 2-1 or 3-1. Better Batting lineup and more depth in the Bowling with Green as the all-rounder.
Australia at home 1995-1999 (Ended at WI series)
Batting Average 34.28
Bowling Average 25.95
Australia at home the last 3 years
Batting Average 37.18
Bowling Average 22.48
Gob
International Coach
Well they did beat all of SA, Pak and WI both home and away in that 3 year period and given the great fast bowlers were still firing somewhere close to their best for those teams, it was very impressive
India was the only glitch
Salamuddin
International Debutant
If India are full strength (and they haven’t been in their most recent away tests), then I think they would give Taylor’s guys a real run for their money.
a win ? Maybe not given the McGrath factor but I think it would be closer than people think.
India with a relatively weak bowling attack ran powerful Aus sides quite close in 2003-04 and 2007-08.
Slifer
International Captain
Losing in SL has absolutely no bearing how playing in Australia. If you read what I wrote you'd understand i mentioned that for my overall perspective of this Aus team vs Taylor's. And fun fact, Taylor didnt captain that Aus team that lost to SL in 99 and second the SL team from 99 was much much better than the current SL team. Surely you see that.
Anyway this same Cummins' Aus team that lost to India is going to beat Taylor's that lost to no one at home?
The last three years Australia has played :Eng, WI, SL, Pak and NZ. Taylor's team in that convenient timeframe played: WI, Pak, RSA, SL, NZ, Eng.
You have to put things in proper perspective. For example, in 1996-97 at home Australia beat a WI with Lara, Chanderpaul, Adams, Bishop, Ambrose and Walsh. That WI team is leap years ahead of the one that recently toured. As a matter of fact, that team is better than any that toured Australia in the last 3 years maybe barring India. Ditto South Africa and Pakistani from Taylor's time.
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Slifer
International Captain
But India had way better batting as well. And with respect, McGrath didn't play in the 2003 series.
Sunil1z
International Regular
Truth be told , McGrath is the only reason I am not claiming India 18/20 would beat Taylor’s Australia . Guy was a genius.
This brings me to my next question:
Was McGrath the most important reason behind Aussie domination between 95-07 ?
If you replace McGrath with Cummins , would that Australian side be as good ?
Coronis
International Coach
Yes. Which 2 matches did England win in the 05 Ashes?
Sunil1z
International Regular
Do you believe Cummins has the same aura behind him ?
Slifer
International Captain
Yeah Cummins is already an atg in the McGrath level. I feel like McGrath bowled to generally better batting, especially in the case of teams like WI, India, Rsa, Pak etc. But what Pat did in Pakistan really impressed me. And that's on top of everything else he already accomplished.
Yes McGrath for me, was the "main" (not only) reason for Aus domination, that and the arrival of Gilchrist that made that team completely unfair. And their fielding was unreal.
Sunil1z
International Regular
If you replace Cummins with McGrath in 18 and 20 , do you think Ind would have won ?
Slifer
International Captain
Honestly, idk. That's the best I can come up with. Because as I said McGrath was the "main" reason but he wasn't the only one. And having Warne at the other end vs a Lyons will make one hell of a difference.
Gun to head though, I'm going with Australia only because they lost zero from 1992 until they lost to RSA in 2007 (I believe ).
Slifer
International Captain
Glenn McGrath is probably the best pace bowler of all time. I know a lot of people emphasize flat wickets he bowled on and imo it's overblown but the man bowled to some seriously good batting lineups. SL in his time were no slouches. India needs no introduction. The the WI in the 1997 series came to Aus with a red hot Lara, still world classnAdams , Chanders, etc and they all got owned by Glenn.
Cummins just hasn't bowled to that level of batting; not his fault. But he has been outstanding to what's been put infront of him. And he just did well on the roads of Pakistan so that series honestly sold me on the man. Lillee is making room for Pat in an ATG Aus team for me.