Which teams would be adversely effected by Cond/Pitches in SA ?

[aussie_beater]

Originally posted by marc71178

Those were Test Matches though, this is a completely different beast.

No one even thought of beating the WI in any form of the game(ODI or tests) in those days... Their pace quartet ruled everything.No variety was needed....seam friendly conditions or not they didn't mind....it was a blitzkrieg all the way.

[Edited on 7/11/2002 by aussie_beater]

 

[anzac]

the Pakistan attack can be described as 1 x R express, 1 x R f/med, 1 x L f/med, 1 x R med/fast and either a quality leggie or off break depending on which way you go. Both the f/med (Wasim & Waqar) have a wealth of experience and are former 'fast' bowlers in their own rights. This gives them a good variety particularly with Wasim as a lefty. 8D

I agree with the earlier comment that variety itself does not bring quality - India's attack may have all the variety but what do you expect with so many bowlers selected - it's like going for a boxed trifecta at the races & having an each way bet on half the field because you can't make up your mind......and the reason that you can't make up your mind is the opening seam attack are not as good as they need to be!!!!

Hey even the NZ squad attack has variety - Bond, Cairns, Vettori, Harris, , Tuffey/Butler, McMillan, Astle, Oram & Styris - and I would say that this is a better attack than India's, yet I don't claim them to be the best!!!!!!:saint:

 

[CricketGuru]

Thats right anzac Pakistan has the most variety with the most talent in their bowling department.

 

[marc71178]

Talent?

Not a hope there.

Australia's attack is better and South Africa's on a par pace wise.

 

[Gotchya]

Talent?

Not a hope there.

Australia's attack is better and South Africa's on a par pace wise.

Alright. flame bait.

Talent wise, Pakistan and South Africa are not at par. Australia can be matched though :

Waqar
Wasim
Shoaib
Saqlain
Razzak

Mcgrath
Gillespie
Bichel
Lee
Warne

where do Australia weigh heavier ? even talent wise.. Warne perhaps ?

 

[Neil Pickup]

McGrath v Waqar 1-0
Gillespie v Wasim 2-0
Lee v Shoaib 2-1
Bichel v Razzaq 3-1
Warne v Saqlain 4-1

That's how...

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Originally posted by BANGered
Bowling attack with most variety!

Have a look at this.

Lft arm fast:Zaheer
Lft arm medium:Nehra
RT arm Fast : Ajit Agarkar
RT arm medium:Srinath
Off Spinner :Harbhajan
Leggie: Kumble
Lft Arm spinner:Kartik.

This must be a unique attack, all kind of bowlers in one team, can u imagine that?

I'm surpised no one commented on it yet but since when is Agarkar a fast bowler???

Don't you have to be quick for that??

 

[howzthat]

Originally posted by Neil Pickup
McGrath v Waqar 1-0
Gillespie v Wasim 2-0
Lee v Shoaib 2-1
Bichel v Razzaq 3-1
Warne v Saqlain 4-1

That's how...

Lee better than Akhter..LOL I would say it should be 1-3 to Akhter.
Also Razzak is an allrounder and should at most be compared to Watson and not Bichel!

Aus have the best TEST attack but as far as onedayers are concerned Pak are better than Aussies.Aus have only 3 established onedayer bowlers in Grath,Warne and Jason!

 

[onemangang]

There is a bit of similarity b/w Brett Lee and ajit Agarkar, both made an impressive start at International level, however since long they have done nothing with the ball to be regarded so highly yet their fans continue to rank them as top bowlers!
Lee cannot be compared even with Bond, leave alone Akhte,and since this post is about ONEDAYERS, i would like to add that Lee simply isn't good for the shorter version of the game and often proves to be destructive for his team.Evan Bichel's performance in onedayers is very ordinary (37 wkts in 32 matches at 34 ave!) neither has he done wonders at test level.

 

[Eclipse]

Brett Lee in form is quite easaly as good as Aktha and Much much better than Bond.

Sure Brett Lee has been in poor form latley but I saw him the other day and beleve me his performance was not luck he was bowling totaly different I mean McGrath line and length at over 150kph. I hope im right but I think hes back now.

 

[onemangang]

I have never seen Lee destroying oponents like Akhter does, and remember Lee doesn't have to bowl to the best batting line up in the world, i.e Australia.

And when was Lee in form the last time???
Bond has been bowling extremely well since quite some time in both version of the game, right now he's certainly better than Lee!

 

[Eclipse]

You must never have seen Lee before his injury then.

I remember on heaps of occasions he would get 2-3 quick wkts in say about 2 or three overs.

In his debute season he was on a hatrick on 5 occasion during the one summer.

 

[Tim]

Brett Lee had a very good first up season when he played for Australia in 1999. He took alot of wickets & bowled with good pace. But since then what has he really done? He's been in the side all the time, so he can't complain about lack of opportunities. His bowling average in tests compared to some of the other quicks is getting higher with every test.

 

[Eclipse]

I know he has not done anything much since his injury but I dont beleve he has lost it. I remember Aktha went though the same thing for a year or so.
Im sure he can become a really good bowler again.

 

[marc71178]

Originally posted by Neil Pickup
McGrath v Waqar 1-0
Gillespie v Wasim 2-0
Lee v Shoaib 2-1
Bichel v Razzaq 3-1
Warne v Saqlain 4-1

That's how...

You just about took the words out of my mouth there Neil.

 

[marc71178]

I'm surpised no one commented on it yet but since when is Agarkar a fast bowler???

Don't you have to be quick for that??

Or a bowler?!

 

[marc71178]

Bond has been bowling extremely well since quite some time in both version of the game, right now he's certainly better than Lee!

Quite some time? He's only been an International for a year!

 

[Tim]

I don't think Bond can be called a World Class bowler yet, he needs another season to prove himself & the Indian Series will certainly test his character when he lines up against Tendulkar & the like.

There's no doubt however that Bond is an incredibly good bowler & I think we're still yet to see the best of him.

 

[Gotchya]

McGrath v Waqar 1-0
Gillespie v Wasim 2-0
Lee v Shoaib 2-1
Bichel v Razzaq 3-1
Warne v Saqlain 4-1

That's how...

Thats convenient. A little elaboration perhaps ? How does Gillespie get the lead over Wasim for God's sake ?


Since its talent we're talking about, considerations about recent performances will not be reflected in the following, comparisons made when the bowlers are performing at their best :

Wasim vs Mcgrath 1-0
Waqar vs Gillespie 2-0
Lee vs Shoaib 3-0
Bichel vs Razzak 3-1
Warne vs Saqlain 3-2

Wasim vs Mcgrath and Waqar vs Gillespie

For all the wickets mcgrath may have taken and for all his line and length, as good a bowler as he is, he is not more talented then Wasim Akram, plain and simple. I think we have been over this in another thread. Waqar Younis takes the lead because of his lethalness with the old bowl, not many bowlers can claim equality to him when it comes to the art of reverse swing and the perfection of the yorker length. Fair enough ?
I find that Gillespie and Waqar comparison a little silly infact.

Simply because of the manner these two take/took wickets is awesome. Get me a count of how many batsmen they got out bowled and how many LB's. Running through the defences of a batsman that requires some talent. Sure Mcgrath and Gillespie have that, but in comparison I dont rate them equally.

Moreover, Waqar and Wasim have been
around far longer then Mcgrath and Gillespie, a comparison based on perfromances in the last few years would invariably bias the result in favour of Mcgrath and Gillespie.

Lee and Akhtar

No ellaboration needed here. Akhtar is the better bowler both talent and performance wise. As for Lee, dont know what all the fuss is about ? he has not been performing for his team as expected. He cannot be rated very highly as a consequence. Let him perform and then we'll see ?

Bichel vs Razzak

Bichel has been unfortunate over the years not to have been given a decent chance. Razzak is the second string bowler for Pakistan as is Bichel for Australia, but Bichel has the clear edge, with his great line and length and a beautiful outswinger he's streets ahead of Razzak in penetration and pace.

Warne vs Saqlain

No contest. Warne is the better bowler, compare as you may.

 

[onemangang]

When in Form!

Originally posted by Eclipse
Brett Lee in form is quite easaly as good as Aktha and Much much better than Bond.

In form even Ajit Agarkar looks dangerous, but that happens rarely! And when Akhter is in form, he comes up with a spell that is said to be the best in test history!!

Lee might have been a good bowler before his injury BUT we are talking about present performance, right now he's no where near the top.Bond has been performing well since a year, Lee has been dissapointing since more than a year!!