The Test match batting of Yuvraj Singh

[GotSpin]

Limited batsman, but at least he's got some steel and puts a price on his wicket.

Yeah exactly. He's not a great looking batsmen but he's fairly reliable to do the job needed

 

[vcs]

Have a closer look. He's only scored against Pakistan on dead subcontinental pitches. That Pakistan team didn't even have the benefit of having Their world class bowling attack to call on. The fact that he scores more in the second innings shows that on the pitches he's been playing on (predominantly subcontinental) have been lively in the first innings and flatten out in the second, typically. 70's against Sri Lanka ? Please don't make that an innings of note to compare with North's debut hundred against South Africa. North averages more away than at home. and has made runs against all the major test nations he's played against bar Pakistan, who at the time had Asif and Aamer.

The fact of North's overall record and his inconsistentsies is a different story alltogether. But in comparison with Yuvraj he's way way superior.

If you had watched any cricket in the subcontinent, you'd know that batting in the 2nd team innings/4th match innings is way tougher than elsewhere in the world. Asif and Akhtar were owning the rest of our lineup in Karachi where he scored a hundred and England had Flintoff, Harmison, Anderson, Swann and Panesar when India chased down 387 in Chennai.

 

[Rant0r]

I actually watched the game when he made 169, that was a road. And doesn't the fact that India chased down 387 in the 4th innings spell it out enough ?

Lets get serious, subcontinental pitches are the flattest in the world

 

[Rant0r]

In a team that consists of a an extremely flashy opener in gayle, two young bats and a weak no.6 in Bravo Senior, Nash provides some great stability following the decline of Chanderpaul.

Decline of Chanderpaul ?

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/player/51469.html?class=1;spanmax1=19+Dec+2010;spanmin1=19+Dec+2006;spanval1=span;template=results;type=allround

 

[vcs]

I actually watched the game when he made 169, that was a road. And doesn't the fact that India chased down 387 in the 4th innings spell it out enough ?

Lets get serious, subcontinental pitches are the flattest in the world

Of course it doesn't, there was big turn for Swann throughout and Flintoff bowled superbly in that game.

Anyway, not getting into another boring subcontinental wicket stereotype-based argument. Clearly, what Test cricket needs is more sporting wickets like Brisbane.

 

[Rant0r]

You're clearly just biased. I'm by no means talking up North, As a whole he's failed as a test batsman. But he's failed on a far less level than Yuvraj. Making runs against a crap Pakistan team on a road when Akthar was half fit and the rest was crap inflates his image. Judging him on one innings against England at home too is hardly basis for a career judgement.

Most Australian pitches have sadly developed a pretty simlar flatness. Which is probably why India perform much better here now.

 

[vcs]

Haha, I'm the biased one when you're the one making generalisations about subcontinent pitches. There are huge variations between what you get in SL and India, and so many different venues in India FFS. I don't even understand how people can lump them all into one category.

Anyway, leaving all that aside, apart from the one innings in S. Africa, against what great bowlers and tough situations has North succeeded in? Calling him "way way superior" than Tim McIntosh is a stretch, leave alone Yuvraj Singh.

 

[Rant0r]

I used to generalise. But since having Foxtel, I can clearly see that subcontinental pitches are all slow low roads. Some more so than others, some spin a little and break up. Luckily they use the SG ball.

At least North has made hundreds outside of his comfort zone. He's made hundreds in India, England, South Africa and New Zealand. Yuvraj's biggest success against quality opposition in foreign conditions was the 12 he made against Australia in Australia. If you don't count the 54 not out he made against the mighty New Zealand in New Zealand. Which still counts as his highest score outside of the subcontinent.

 

[chicane]

You're clearly just biased. I'm by no means talking up North, As a whole he's failed as a test batsman. But he's failed on a far less level than Yuvraj. Making runs against a crap Pakistan team on a road when Akthar was half fit and the rest was crap inflates his image. Judging him on one innings against England at home too is hardly basis for a career judgement.

Most Australian pitches have sadly developed a pretty simlar flatness. Which is probably why India perform much better here now.

No, Asif, Akhtar, and Gul are not crap, and the pitches weren't belters. Both his tons in Pakistan were outstanding and the only reason I'd rate North above is he hasn't yet managed to look as utterly clueless as Waterboy has sometimes.

 

[Rant0r]

No, Asif, Akhtar, and Gul are not crap, and the pitches weren't belters. Both his tons in Pakistan were outstanding and the only reason I'd rate North above is he hasn't yet managed to look as utterly clueless as Waterboy has sometimes.

The 169 he made against Pakistan Akhtar bowled 10 overs before going off because he's fat. Yasir was playing his first test. And then there was Sami and Kaneria. The match was a boring draw.The 112 could almost be considered an innings of class if Sami and Gul were world class bowlers, they are not. Although Gul bowled well in that particular game, they somehow managed to lose making his innings really pointless. Akhtar was still... in his twilight. The 122 was a swashbuckling one day type Innings (clearly his forte) in a game they lost by 400 runs, which makes it kind of pointless really. Runs in situations like that are really null and void. It's like taking the last 5 wickets of an innings.

Not sure that i'd rate an attack of a fat Akhtar, Gul and Asif above Steyn, Ntini and Morkel, or even Anderson, Flintoff, Broad

 

[centurymaker]

I used to generalise. But since having Foxtel, I can clearly see that subcontinental pitches are all slow low roads. Some more so than others, some spin a little and break up. Luckily they use the SG ball.

At least North has made hundreds outside of his comfort zone. He's made hundreds in India, England, South Africa and New Zealand. Yuvraj's biggest success against quality opposition in foreign conditions was the 12 he made against Australia in Australia. If you don't count the 54 not out he made against the mighty New Zealand in New Zealand. Which still counts as his highest score outside of the subcontinent.

No wonder the srilankan batsmen do so well in India, vice versa.

 

[chicane]

The 169 he made against Pakistan Akhtar bowled 10 overs before going off because he's fat. Yasir was playing his first test. And then there was Sami and Kaneria. The match was a boring draw.The 112 could almost be considered an innings of class if Sami and Gul were world class bowlers, they are not. Although Gul bowled well in that particular game, they somehow managed to lose making his innings really pointless. Akhtar was still... in his twilight. The 122 was a swashbuckling one day type Innings (clearly his forte) in a game they lost by 400 runs, which makes it kind of pointless really. Runs in situations like that are really null and void. It's like taking the last 5 wickets of an innings.

Not sure that i'd rate an attack of a fat Akhtar, Gul and Asif above Steyn, Ntini and Morkel, or even Anderson, Flintoff, Broad

No, the 112 and 122 were quality knocks and coming in a losing cause only added value to them. No idea how you equated something like that to taking tail-end wickets?

Anyway, Akhtar wasn't fat in those two games, Asif was lethal in one while Gul and Sami benefited from a green top in the other.

 

[Rant0r]

Chasing 600, Yuvraj makes 100, they lose by 340, does anyone really care apart from Yuvraj ?.

There's no such thing as a greentop in the subcontinent. The outfield barely has grass

 

[Shri]

Badrinath got a chance and blew it by batting like **** in warm-up matches. He better seize his next opportunity (soon IMO, as he's still at the top of the queue for reserve middle-order batsmen) because Pujara isn't far behind and you never know when the selectors might take a punt on Raina despite his merely decent first-class record.

Amazing prediction really.

 

[vcs]

Chasing 600, Yuvraj makes 100, they lose by 340, does anyone really care apart from Yuvraj ?.

There's no such thing as a greentop in the subcontinent. The outfield barely has grass

Clearly they should, because if the rest had contributed, the team would have won. What does the outfield have to do with the pitch? The subcontinent has reverse swing BTW, which isn't there elsewhere.

 

[vcs]

Weakness against top-quality spin? Top-quality spinners play ODIs too. He may or may not be weak against it but that doesn't answer the question.

I reckon it's because he's vulnerable early in his innings but in ODIs everyone gives him defensive fields and dibbly-dobblers to get his eye in.

Mark Waugh had a ridiculously good Shield record though; Yuvraj doesn't even stand out in Indian First Class domestic cricket. I think his ability to play the longer form of the game is just a little bit over-rated given the way he defends with an angled bat outside his body and plays with such hard hands all the time; I don't think he's actually underachieved as such.

Yuvraj is not rubbish but he does have a problem which is exposed more in the longer format. He almost never goes onto the backfoot.

He has no backfoot defence.

This is a problem you find increasingly rampant in the sub-continent, much more in Pakistan as I have mentioned before. Hence the problem with openers in Pakistan.

Yuvraj has great strokes off the frontfoot and with his fabulous timing and hand eye co-ordination, he is still able to manage the medium pacers and bowling with no sideways movement from the quicker bowlers. But the moment the speed goes up, its not pitched up and the ball starts deviating , Yuvraj is in strife.

I dont see how that will ever change for I have not seen him make any effort to rectify this. Whats even more amazing is that no one, at least in public, has mentioned that he has a defect and a grave one for backfoot play is what really differentiates a good player from a world class one.

Pretty much spot on, all these posts.

 

[chicane]

Chasing 600, Yuvraj makes 100, they lose by 340, does anyone really care apart from Yuvraj ?.

There's no such thing as a greentop in the subcontinent. The outfield barely has grass

Yes, it was a quality knock and deserves recognition. Yes, green tops do happen in the sub-continent.

 

[GotSpin]

Sub-continent wickets aren't always flat. In saying that though, they generally aren't my favourite type of wickets because there's typically very little bounce or seam for the pace bowlers, but it doesn't mean every single SC wicket is a batting paradise.

 

[G.I.Joe]

He is a wholey ordinary player, with an ordinary record, who has done little of note in foreign conditions or against quality opposition. North on the other hand has (occassionally) made runs in various situations and venues.

IMO you can't state that as a fact. Yuvraj has second innings hundreds against Pakistan on greentops, he had that unbeaten 85 in the chase against England. His problem is that these performances are diluted far too much by abject failures for them to characterise him.

 

[Himannv]

Why is there a topic about the waterboy? :s