Simon Jones or James Anderson?

[tooextracool]

Anderson averaged 85 mph and bowled outswing in the last test - that is enough to trouble anyone.

from what i saw he was bowling at 81-82. of course if he was clocked faster i wouldnt be surprised either considering that most bowlers are generally clocked faster in SA and australia than anywhere else in the world.

To be totally fair to Jones, I have only really seen him bowl on this tour. However, according to the commentators (we get Gower, Botham, Lloyd, etc. on our coverage) he is totally useless in the first innings but quite useful when the ball starts to reverse at about the 60 over mark of the second innings. Whooppeee!

i dont think anyone mentioned that he was totally useless in the first innings. he did bowl extremely well in the first inning at lords against NZ. but yes so far in his career hes shown that when it doesnt reverse he isnt exactly the best of bowlers, but really compare that to anderson who seems rubbish in any conditions that arent seamer friendly(and even when he gets those he usually wastes them like he did in the previous test) and i really dont think there is much doubt as to who should be picked.

 

[tooextracool]

I don't think Bell is in the 13 for the fifth. If cricinfo is to be believed it's the team for the 4th minus Anderson & plus S Jones, Lewis & Collingwood.

really?
the cricinfo scorecard says that the team will be chosen from :

England team: (from)
ME Trescothick, AJ Strauss, RWT Key, *MP Vaughan, GP Thorpe,
A Flintoff, +GO Jones, AF Giles, SP Jones, MJ Hoggard,
SJ Harmison, GJ Batty, CMW Read, JM Anderson, PD Collingwood,
IR Bell, J Lewis.

 

[BoyBrumby]

really?
the cricinfo scorecard says that the team will be chosen from :

England team: (from)
ME Trescothick, AJ Strauss, RWT Key, *MP Vaughan, GP Thorpe,
A Flintoff, +GO Jones, AF Giles, SP Jones, MJ Hoggard,
SJ Harmison, GJ Batty, CMW Read, JM Anderson, PD Collingwood,
IR Bell, J Lewis.

Here's the link I followed:

http://uk.cricinfo.com/link_to_data.../2005/JAN/162828_RSAENG2004-05_21JAN2005.html

 

[tooextracool]

well personally i would pick bell ahead of collingwood, but if he isnt in the 13, then i would still pick collingwood, simply to see how good he is at the test match level against a decent attack before the ashes. id give thorpe a rest.

 

[SpeedKing]

i'll go to the other extreme, i think jones has more potential than anderson does. personally anderson doesnt have the pace or the accuracy to trouble any test class player, unless he plays in seamer friendly conditions.

i seem to remember that 10-6-12-1 against AUSTRALIA and although it was an ODI, there were Test class players like Gilchrist and Martyn. Clarke to a certain extent bacause he is a quality player. Beavan was in that team as well palying for AUSTRALIA.

This probably has nothing to do with it but these 10 overs are the ones that made me fall in love with cricket, so they are all the more memorable.

 

[tooextracool]

i seem to remember that 10-6-12-1 against AUSTRALIA and although it was an ODI, there were Test class players like Gilchrist and Martyn. Clarke to a certain extent bacause he is a quality player. Beavan was in that team as well palying for AUSTRALIA.

This probably has nothing to do with it but these 10 overs are the ones that made me fall in love with cricket, so they are all the more memorable.

a) he got 1 wicket, well done to him for that
b) it was an ODI
c) it was in seamer friendly conditions(as ive mentioned above he cant trouble batsmen unless he plays in seamer friendly conditions.

 

[SpeedKing]

a) he got 1 wicket, well done to him for that
b) it was an ODI
c) it was in seamer friendly conditions(as ive mentioned above he cant trouble batsmen unless he plays in seamer friendly conditions.

1]As i said earlier, it was against AUSTRALIA

2]i already admitted it was an ODI but the again it was against AUSTRALIA with Martyn, Gilchrist etc

3]Yes it was seamer friendly conditions, but he had to show a certain level of control to be able bowl 10 overs to AUSTRALIA at an ER of 1.2 regardless of conditions

 

[thirdman05]

Jones over Anderson any time! he is more economical more aggressive and is an effective foil for hoggard and harmison.Also he does take wickets!!! Anderson is not a test match bowler now or ever in my opinion.

 

[tooextracool]

1]As i said earlier, it was against AUSTRALIA

yes and it was 1 wicket, hardly anything that cen be used to show that he is a wicket taking bowler.

2]i already admitted it was an ODI but the again it was against AUSTRALIA with Martyn, Gilchrist etc

which changes the fact that he isnt good enough to succeed at the test level how?

3]Yes it was seamer friendly conditions, but he had to show a certain level of control to be able bowl 10 overs to AUSTRALIA at an ER of 1.2 regardless of conditions

and if you read, i clearly stated that anderson will not trouble test class batsmen unless he plays in seamer friendly conditions.

 

[SpeedKing]

and if you read, i clearly stated that anderson will not trouble test class batsmen unless he plays in seamer friendly conditions.

as Social said, Anderson bowls outswing naturally at about 85 mph and whether or not it is seamer friendly conditions, swing at that pace can trouble any batsman.

 

[tooextracool]

anderson bowls at 81-82 mph, and the fact is that thes never troubled anyone outside of seamer friendly conditions only shows how dire the claim really is.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

anderson bowls at 81-82 mph, and the fact is that thes never troubled anyone outside of seamer friendly conditions only shows how dire the claim really is.

He's not that slow.

 

[dudeurfriend]

Personally i think Jones is a much better and an Intelligent bowler when compared with James anderson.......

 

[tooextracool]

He's not that slow.

hes not that quick either. if he were bowling at 85, then why in the world were all the commentators on sky wondering how he lost all that pace in 03(compared to the world cup & australia), and also saying that he was completely burnt out?

 

[Right arm fast]

i think anderson has the bigger future because hes younger but at the moment id kep jones in

 

[SpaceMonkey]

hes not that quick either. if he were bowling at 85, then why in the world were all the commentators on sky wondering how he lost all that pace in 03(compared to the world cup & australia), and also saying that he was completely burnt out?

Cos he was bowling at 88-91mph regularly when he first broke into the team.

 

[tooextracool]

no he wasnt, which is precisely the point, he was bowling at 85ish, which wasnt surprising considering that both those series came in australia and SA where most bowlers are clocked faster anyways. since then hes always been bowling at 81-82. if he was bowling at 85+ then there would be no problems with regard to his pace, which has always come up in discussion particularly amongst the sky commentators.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Cos he was bowling at 88-91mph regularly when he first broke into the team.

I don't recall him being mentioned as being that fast. He's always been around 85mph when I've seen him in home series on TV - maybe it was more the heat, humidity etc. that increased the speed.

 

[LongHopCassidy]

Hindsight's 20/20, right?

 

[Richard]

Still don't think Jones was anything particularly special until 2005.