Persisting with Failure : Good captaincy or Stupid Obstinacy ??

[Jono]

The thing is, Patel has shown he can score runs in Tests - and that means more than domestic runs.

Why do you never comment on his keeping?

Just answer this, would you want Patel in your side at the moment? If yes, as a wicket keeper?

 

[Jono]

^ Is he really that good a batsman though ? Rarely does he play an innings where the ball does not travel through the slips cordon atleast 3 times.

Yes, I believe he is.

Oh Btw, I want him to play in our side as a PURE batsman, I have watched him bat and he does have the potential to be a good batsman, at least better than Chopra, Yuvraj, Kaif, Sehwag, Ganguly and Laxman.

Are you serious? I think Patel is good with the bat too, but there is no way he is better than Sehwag and Laxman, and If I needed 70 runs to win with 7 wickets down in a test match, I'd rather Kaif be out there than Patel.

 

[Sanz]

Why do you never comment on his keeping?

Just answer this, would you want Patel in your side at the moment? If yes, as a wicket keeper?

Well, I would like to see the alternatives. If Dinesh Karthik comes and keeps like him (or a litle better) but cant contribute with the bat then I would like to go back to Parthiv at least for the overseas tours where our top order appears to be afraid of fast bowlers and Parthiv isn't.

Keeping to Kumble/Harbhajan on Indian pitches requires lot of skills and I dont think there is a young wicketkeeper in India who can handle it. Anyways I am keeping my fingers crossed. I dont want any new kid to go through what PP went through.

 

[SJS]

If Dinesh Karthik comes and keeps like him (or a litle better) but cant contribute with the bat then I would like to go back to Parthiv at least for the overseas tours where our top order appears to be afraid of fast bowlers and Parthiv isn't.

You win Sanz. I concede defeat

 

[SJS]

Decline and fall
Dileep Premachandran
http://usa.cricinfo.com/link_to_dat.../2004/OCT/089773_INDAUS2004-05_29OCT2004.html

Excerpts :

The muddled thinking over who would open with Sehwag didn't help, and neither did the management's Parthiv Patel fetish, which surely cost them victory on the fourth afternoon in Chennai. At the very highest level, there is a thin line between a settled side and an unhealthy clique, as Sir Alex Ferguson proved when he kicked the likes of Paul Ince, Lee Sharpe and Andrei Kanchelskis out of Old Trafford.

As for India, whose best batsmen tarnished their reputations, morale was yet another casualty. The zest and commitment that characterised the Australian and Pakistani campaigns was conspicuously absent except in the case of men like Harbhajan, who tapped into his own rage to try to alter the balance of power. Imaginative tactics and innovations were also invisible, and a sense of torpor was the overwhelming impression you got from a team that had all passion spent.

Dravid goes defensive, and Kartik's favourite captain
S Rajesh
http://usa.cricinfo.com/link_to_dat...NEWS/2004/OCT/088959_COL-STATS_29OCT2004.html

Excerpts :

Dravid v Aus Innings Runs Balls Ave Strike rate
in 1999-2000 6 93 368 15.50 25.27
in 2000-01 6 338 795 56.33 42.51
in 2003-04 8 619 1203 123.79 51.45
in 2004-05 4 107 428 26.75 25.00

Kartik in Tests Matches Wickets Ave Strike rate
Under Ganguly 3 4 79.75 158.2
Under others 3* 11 28.09 69.82

 

[Arjun]

Murali Karthik shot to fame in the 2003 TVS Cup with an impressive bowling performance, but in most of the matches, Dravid was captain, and he did well there. But since he travelled to Autralia, when Ganguly took over, he got hammered by every batting side without taking too many wickets.

This is what spinners of yeateryears may be talking about, when they highlight the importance of a captain in a spinner's performance- bowling changes, field placings and what line to take. Hirwani said he couldn't develop into a better spinner because his captains did not use him well.

 

[honestbharani]

That is rubbish, IMO. A spinner has to talk to his captain about the fields he wants and explain his reasons. If his reasoning is right, any right-thinking captain would give him the field he wants. Hirwani seems to be passing the buck here from his own non-performance.

 

[Jono]

I'll tell you what, I may sympathise for Kartik regarding Ganguly's lack of faith in him, however any spinner who belongs in international cricket should be able to bowl well whomever is captain. Dravid, Ganguly or Patel, he should be able to bowl well.

Those figures IMO are due to the vast difference in matches played, but if its not, I don't blame Ganguly, I blame Kartik. And I like the guy too.

 

[SJS]

I'll tell you what, I may sympathise for Kartik regarding Ganguly's lack of faith in him, however any spinner who belongs in international cricket should be able to bowl well whomever is captain. Dravid, Ganguly or Patel, he should be able to bowl well.

Those figures IMO are due to the vast difference in matches played, but if its not, I don't blame Ganguly, I blame Kartik. And I like the guy too.

Hmm. Its not always a question of bowling well or the field placing. Another very important factor is when you are brought on to bowl and when you are taken off. This can make or mar a bowlers career.

 

[Sanz]

Murali Karthik shot to fame in the 2003 TVS Cup with an impressive bowling performance, but in most of the matches, Dravid was captain, and he did well there. But since he travelled to Autralia, when Ganguly took over, he got hammered by every batting side without taking too many wickets.

Anyone here has watched the Dhaka test where Karthik first played under Ganguly. I advise you to watch it, you will know why Ganguly has no faith in Murali Karthik's bowling. And then ofcourse there is Sydeny first innings, we all saw how effective he was in the first inning 120 runs in 20 overs in a test match innings, I was surprise he still got to bowl in the second innings ??

So far he has played on one test under Dravid, so let's wait before jumping the gun and blaming Ganguly. May be he is not a good enough to play at international level.