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***Official*** West Indies in Australia

Mr Mxyzptlk

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greg said:
I think the argument is that he would pick him ahead of another spinner. Which is probably an argument for not picking a spinner.
Which is a specialist bowler. That's what I was referring to. Simply, Breese isn't the best spinner in the region and isn't a good enough batsman to be a Test allrounder.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
aussie said:
sensing a bit of jamaican biasness here mate :p
You think wrong. I'm all for Mohammed ahead of him but not Banks. Just doesn't get it right enough and has less accuracy so more likely to go for runs than Breese.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Which is a specialist bowler. That's what I was referring to. Simply, Breese isn't the best spinner in the region and isn't a good enough batsman to be a Test allrounder.
He clearly isn't the best spinner but he's the most experienced and the least likely to get belted for lots of runs.
 

honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
roseboy64 said:
He clearly isn't the best spinner but he's the most experienced and the least likely to get belted for lots of runs.
Why do the Windies even need to play a spinner? At present, their four best bowlers are all fast or fast medium guys, so they should be picked and the spin support can be obtained from the likes of Gayle and Sarwan, and if picked, Ryan Hinds.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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roseboy64 said:
He clearly isn't the best spinner but he's the most experienced and the least likely to get belted for lots of runs.
To even compete against Australia, we need to take 20 wickets. For that, we need to pick 4 specialist bowlers. You don't pick a specialist bowler to contain an International batting side. Not in Tests.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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honestbharani said:
Why do the Windies even need to play a spinner? At present, their four best bowlers are all fast or fast medium guys, so they should be picked and the spin support can be obtained from the likes of Gayle and Sarwan, and if picked, Ryan Hinds.
Indeed. Gayle has been our most consistently good bowler this year.
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Indeed. Gayle has been our most consistently good bowler this year.
yea thats why i say an attack of Collins/Edwards/Collymore/bravo plus Gayle is the windies best option...
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
honestbharani said:
Why do the Windies even need to play a spinner? At present, their four best bowlers are all fast or fast medium guys, so they should be picked and the spin support can be obtained from the likes of Gayle and Sarwan, and if picked, Ryan Hinds.
We don't a spinner. Just wondering, if the situation should arise.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
aussie said:
yea thats why i say an attack of Collins/Edwards/Collymore/bravo plus Gayle is the windies best option...
A bowler's missing from that. Say Lawson or Powell.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
To even compete against Australia, we need to take 20 wickets. For that, we need to pick 4 specialist bowlers. You don't pick a specialist bowler to contain an International batting side. Not in Tests.
Fair enough.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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roseboy64 said:
A bowler's missing from that. Say Lawson or Powell.
Agreed. If Collins isn't match fit (and I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't), I'd have Powell in there ahead of him. I don't think they'll leave out one of the genuinely quick bowlers. Granted, the selectors may pleasantly surprise me.

My ideal XI:

CH Gayle
DS Smith
BC Lara - I prefer him here, rather than 4. I'd trust him more than Sarwan against the new ball, should Gayle/Smith fail.
RR Sarwan - right-hander breaks the left-handed monopoly.
S Chanderpaul - I still don't think he's a very good captain, but they can't sack him now.
RO Hinds/N Deonarine - more technically able than Hinds to deal with Warne IMO.
D Ramdin +
DJJ Bravo - I think he's talented enough to play a Flintoff role and bat at 6 in the future, but not quite ready yet.
DB Powell
PT Collins
CD Collymore

There are so many "potentially potent" quicks in the region that it's difficult to choose 3 to accompany Bravo, who I believe must be there. If Collins is fit, he has to be in the team, purely on the basis of what he showed last time around. Collymore is our most accurate bowler and can definitely play a role if he finds the length he's found so far this year.

Daren Powell is a tough call ahead of Lawson or Edwards. He's an exceptional bowler though, IF he gets his fitness and stamina worked out.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
my side would be similar to that, although i cant see the point of collymore in australia, he wont get too much seam and swing and he isnt very quick and collins covers those areas anyways. i'd think the pitches are more suited for someone like lawson or at least edwards.
devon smith has had a fair few chances though and hasnt amounted to anything and i'd prefer that they tried somone different at that spot.
and id have narsingh deonarine as a certainity.
 
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roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
A point of note here. Lawson just recently had ankle surgery so there's no telling what that'll do to him.
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Agreed. If Collins isn't match fit (and I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't), I'd have Powell in there ahead of him. I don't think they'll leave out one of the genuinely quick bowlers. Granted, the selectors may pleasantly surprise me.

My ideal XI:

CH Gayle
DS Smith
BC Lara - I prefer him here, rather than 4. I'd trust him more than Sarwan against the new ball, should Gayle/Smith fail.
RR Sarwan - right-hander breaks the left-handed monopoly.
S Chanderpaul - I still don't think he's a very good captain, but they can't sack him now.
RO Hinds/N Deonarine - more technically able than Hinds to deal with Warne IMO.
D Ramdin +
DJJ Bravo - I think he's talented enough to play a Flintoff role and bat at 6 in the future, but not quite ready yet.
DB Powell
PT Collins
CD Collymore

There are so many "potentially potent" quicks in the region that it's difficult to choose 3 to accompany Bravo, who I believe must be there. If Collins is fit, he has to be in the team, purely on the basis of what he showed last time around. Collymore is our most accurate bowler and can definitely play a role if he finds the length he's found so far this year.

Daren Powell is a tough call ahead of Lawson or Edwards. He's an exceptional bowler though, IF he gets his fitness and stamina worked out.
I would much rather this side, at least in the first Test:

Gayle
Hinds - deserves a chance
Sarwan
Lara
Chanderpaul
Ramdin
Bravo
Powell - concern about Lawson fitness
Edwards
Collins
Collymore
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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roseboy64 said:
I would much rather this side, at least in the first Test:

Gayle
Hinds - deserves a chance
Sarwan
Lara
Chanderpaul
Ramdin
Bravo
Powell - concern about Lawson fitness
Edwards
Collins
Collymore
You'd have a 20-year-old who has played 2 Tests bat at 6 and Dwayne Bravo at 7? You'd afford Edwards batting at 9? Devon Smith has better technique than Wavell Hinds. Hinds never really looks in form. I'd be much more willing to back Smith to score runs as he is better equipped. As for "deserves a chance", Hinds has gotten tons of chances. If he plays, he should bat at 6.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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tooextracool said:
my side would be similar to that, although i cant see the point of collymore in australia, he wont get too much seam and swing and he isnt very quick and collins covers those areas anyways. i'd think the pitches are more suited for someone like lawson or at least edwards.
devon smith has had a fair few chances though and hasnt amounted to anything and i'd prefer that they tried somone different at that spot.
and id have narsingh deonarine as a certainity.
Devon Smith's Test career:

1/ Smith had a quiet but solid debut series against Australia the last time they were in the Caribbean. He was then dropped for the rest of the year.

4 Tests - Average: 23.62

2/ Recalled against England. Scored a ton in the first Test. Scored 35 and 17 in the second Test. Got injured.

6 Tests - Average: 30.08

3/ Returned against Bangladesh. Scores of 0, 40* and 44.

8 Tests - Average: 31.78

4/ Started the England tour. Scored 45 in his first innings of the series - given out - a bad decision. Scores of 6, 4, 11 followed. Dropped again.

10 Tests - Average: 28.38

5/ Recalled against South Africa amidst contract crisis. Scored 11 in the only innings of the first Test. Dropped with the return of Gayle.

11 Tests - Average: 27.47

6/ Recalled against Pakistan. Scores of 19, 10, 25, 49.

13 Tests - Average: 27.17

So all in all, Devon Smith has not played more than 2 Tests in a row since his debut series. Twice he's been dropped for the better part of a year and once he's been injured when in good touch. I really don't see how exactly he's been tried and failed. He hasn't gotten a proper run in the side yet.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
well he should have been given a consistent run but hes still had plenty of chances though, and he hasnt scored a century since the series against england in 04.
nonetheless has he been in good form in the last domestic season, because theres no point in including an unproven player who isnt in the best of form?
 

Don

State Vice-Captain
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Agreed. If Collins isn't match fit (and I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't), I'd have Powell in there ahead of him. I don't think they'll leave out one of the genuinely quick bowlers. Granted, the selectors may pleasantly surprise me.

My ideal XI:

CH Gayle
DS Smith
BC Lara - I prefer him here, rather than 4. I'd trust him more than Sarwan against the new ball, should Gayle/Smith fail.
RR Sarwan - right-hander breaks the left-handed monopoly.
S Chanderpaul - I still don't think he's a very good captain, but they can't sack him now.
RO Hinds/N Deonarine - more technically able than Hinds to deal with Warne IMO.
D Ramdin +
DJJ Bravo - I think he's talented enough to play a Flintoff role and bat at 6 in the future, but not quite ready yet.
DB Powell
PT Collins
CD Collymore

There are so many "potentially potent" quicks in the region that it's difficult to choose 3 to accompany Bravo, who I believe must be there. If Collins is fit, he has to be in the team, purely on the basis of what he showed last time around. Collymore is our most accurate bowler and can definitely play a role if he finds the length he's found so far this year.

Daren Powell is a tough call ahead of Lawson or Edwards. He's an exceptional bowler though, IF he gets his fitness and stamina worked out.
agree with liam here but ive no doubts about hinds and deonarine.i say deonarine gets the place.lara at no.3 is good.wud love to see him smack around lee in the earlies if the openers fail. the bowling is where i cause a prob for myself. id rather see edwards infront of powell but thats only if he can get it right.collins in there as long as he is fit if not then powell replaces him.collymore there if the pitches suit him if not thats where the problem occurs whu do we use to replace collymore.best? he's not ready yet in my opinion.taylor and lawson out so who else do we have?
 

roseboy64

Cricket Web Content Updater
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Devon Smith's Test career:

1/ Smith had a quiet but solid debut series against Australia the last time they were in the Caribbean. He was then dropped for the rest of the year.

4 Tests - Average: 23.62

2/ Recalled against England. Scored a ton in the first Test. Scored 35 and 17 in the second Test. Got injured.

6 Tests - Average: 30.08

3/ Returned against Bangladesh. Scores of 0, 40* and 44.

8 Tests - Average: 31.78

4/ Started the England tour. Scored 45 in his first innings of the series - given out - a bad decision. Scores of 6, 4, 11 followed. Dropped again.

10 Tests - Average: 28.38

5/ Recalled against South Africa amidst contract crisis. Scored 11 in the only innings of the first Test. Dropped with the return of Gayle.

11 Tests - Average: 27.47

6/ Recalled against Pakistan. Scores of 19, 10, 25, 49.

13 Tests - Average: 27.17

So all in all, Devon Smith has not played more than 2 Tests in a row since his debut series. Twice he's been dropped for the better part of a year and once he's been injured when in good touch. I really don't see how exactly he's been tried and failed. He hasn't gotten a proper run in the side yet.
Apart from the South Africa series that looks a good amount of innings per series to perfrom brilliantly. He hasn't. Hinds hasn't either but he's done better so I would prefer to give him the opening spot over Smith. For me the West Indies need as many good bowlers as possible and so playing an extra batsman won't help especially when it's likely they'll fail.
 

Mr Mxyzptlk

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roseboy64 said:
Apart from the South Africa series that looks a good amount of innings per series to perfrom brilliantly. He hasn't. Hinds hasn't either but he's done better so I would prefer to give him the opening spot over Smith. For me the West Indies need as many good bowlers as possible and so playing an extra batsman won't help especially when it's likely they'll fail.
Are you serious?? He's played one complete series and otherwise gets a couple Tests here and there, yet you're endorsing Hinds over him? That's quite frankly ridiculous. Devon Smith hasn't been given the chance to fail consistently or perform consistently. Hinds has, and has managed to prove very inconsistent.
 

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