*Official* Third Test (Headingley, Leeds) 6–10 July

[the big bambino]

Congratulations to England for their win. The 250 odd needed always seemed to be in their grasp in the bazball era. Great effort by Wood but I think Woakes almost matched it. Congrats also to Mitch Marsh and it was funny reading the comments greeting his selection. Not that I'd gloat as I was thinking much the same. He has to stay for the 4th test now particularly as his bowling seems to be more likely in jagging a top order wicket than Green.

Not sure what the conditions are like in OT but I thought it scuffs up a bit offering reverse but could ne misremembering. Even if true I think Jimmy probably comes in for Robinson (is he injured?) while Neser for Boland for Aus.

 

[social]

Congratulations to England

Only watched until just before lunch because the writing was on the wall

Drop Warner & Boland, pick Green & Neser and for the love of fkn whatever, stop bowling short at the tail

* above won’t happen

They will pick Warner and Haze while continuing their stupid tactics

 

[Shady Slim]

The thing is there wasn't a way of getting Root at 4 and Brook at 5 while not giving Bairstow the gloves. Stokes opening would be the only one I could see and that takes away his superpower.

Again, not saying Bairstow playing as a keeper has been anything other than a disaster so far but do understand how they got there.

moeen opening for zak attak and bairstow three (crawley won't get dropped and, like warner from the first two tests and the wtc final, did better i think than any one would have thought) could do it, and i say that on the basis that moeen opening vs moeen three is really not substantively different if your thinking is "put out your best ten and then throw moeen in whichever top order spot needs a bat in"

 

[Shady Slim]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1678097936201179142

WAFG Moeen. Match winning move

Brook playing the match winning innings at 5 shows the benefit of putting your best players at their best place in the order and filling in the scrubs around them. Cricket consensus seems to be that the best players should move around to accommodate the scrubs.

going on what i said in the above post, i agree with both of you. if you just throw moeen into whichever spot's missing (be it at three or opening the batting or where ever) and take it given he's your prime spinner that whatever runs you get from him are a bonus, and maybe do just give him carte blanche mindset to go on the attack or whatever and try to unsettle the bowlers if it means root can be comfortable in his spot (however weenieesque it is from him to demand four) and brook can slot in where he's really useful rather than supremely useless, and you get woakes in, immensely better for england's chances

 

[G. S. Kohli]

Since the 1936-37 series Down Under, when the Don Bradman-led Australia won the series, no team has won the Ashes after being 2-nil down.

(Ben Stokes wants to win 3/2 Good Luck-
smith/Labu/Khawaja/Head/ Carey will not surrender in next 4 innings for sure

 

[JBMAC]

Well played England. Good all round contest with both bat and ball by both sides. The only thing that would concern me as Skipper of either side is the high amount of sundries in all 3 tests so far by both sides. Any thoughts as to why?

 

[Starfighter]

Congratulations to England

Only watched until just before lunch because the writing was on the wall

Drop Warner & Boland, pick Green & Neser and for the love of fkn whatever, stop bowling short at the tail

* above won’t happen

They will pick Warner and Haze while continuing their stupid tactics

The insistence on continuing to pitch short in situations where it obviously isn't going to work is incredibly frustrating.

I love to characterise fast bowlers as dumb, and here we have a great example. Not just the refusal to try anything normal to the tail, but the insistence on trying to bounce Stokes out when he loves it short. It's like they don't think at all, let alone remember prior innings.

 

[ataraxia]

That Woakes knock was *chef's kiss*

 

[Spark]

The insistence on continuing to pitch short in situations where it obviously isn't going to work is incredibly frustrating.

I love to characterise fast bowlers as dumb, and here we have a great example. Not just the refusal to try anything normal to the tail, but the insistence on trying to bounce Stokes out when he loves it short. It's like they don't think at all, let alone remember prior innings.

It's also the intellectually vacant implementation of it too. Go watch MJohnson highlights from 13/14 and you will never see Clarke setting the fields Cummins has set in this series with a million boundary riders and no one there to catch the top edges that land in the ring. Johnson's main weapon was the short ball but his threat was still the full ball after he'd messed up the batsman's footwork and caused edges into the cordon. Which isn't possible when you have no slips, no gullies, no leg gully, no leg slip.

 

[social]

It's also the intellectually vacant implementation of it too. Go watch MJohnson highlights from 13/14 and you will never see Clarke setting the fields Cummins has set in this series with a million boundary riders and no one there to catch the top edges that land in the ring. Johnson's main weapon was the short ball but his threat was still the full ball after he'd messed up the batsman's footwork and caused edges into the cordon. Which isn't possible when you have no slips, no gullies, no leg gully, no leg slip.

Mentioned this at the time

First ball to Broad in first innings sums it up for me

9 fielders on the fence facing a guy with 5 wickets who will end up being an atg fast bowler

9!!!!!

Naturally he edged it straight through 2nd slip

What’s more, Wood has one shot which is a pull so what do they do?

Truly brain dead stuff

 

[Spark]

Mentioned this at the time

First ball to Broad in first innings sums it up for me

9 fielders on the fence facing a guy with 5 wickets who will end up being an atg fast bowler

9!!!!!

Naturally he edged it straight through 2nd slip

What’s more, Wood has one shot which is a pull so what do they do?

Truly brain dead stuff

I've seen three boundary riders on the hook for James Anderson many times in this series. James Anderson! The bloke would be lucky to get it off the square if he tried that shot, not that he ever does because he doesn't ****ing play it.

 

[SteveNZ]

true genius, that one

Haha, exactly. I'm ok with the Ali one because it had logic in keeping Brook away from the newish ball, but Mills to 3 on the basis that he'd averaged 100 in FC cricket 7 seasons earlier as the most wild of Hail Marys was the worst tactic I've ever seen. It was literally we know we're ****ed against this bowling line up, so we're going to sacrifice Kyle in the hope he might nick 30 odd, get completely and utterly bruised up but ultimately shield our decent batsmen. It was odds of 10000-1 it'd work.

 

[the big bambino]

It's also the intellectually vacant implementation of it too. Go watch MJohnson highlights from 13/14 and you will never see Clarke setting the fields Cummins has set in this series with a million boundary riders and no one there to catch the top edges that land in the ring. Johnson's main weapon was the short ball but his threat was still the full ball after he'd messed up the batsman's footwork and caused edges into the cordon. Which isn't possible when you have no slips, no gullies, no leg gully, no leg slip.

I haven't watched much of this series due to the time differences but this description of what has taken place really makes me cranky. It almost seems our fast bowling captain and coaching staff have no idea of the strategic use of the short ball.

 

[Spark]

I haven't watched much of this series due to the time differences but this description of what has taken place really makes me cranky. It almost seems our fast bowling captain and coaching staff have no idea of the strategic use of the short ball.

It must be a team management plan. We've never seen it before so it's not something that Cummins does instinctively - what fast bowler likes a field like this - and they're too stubborn with it when it's clearly not working for it not to be set in advance.

It's not even necessarily the plan of bowling it predominantly short to the tail, that can definitely work if done properly and Woakes was quite lucky to not dob one up to a fielder at times. But the field is like an anti-wicket taking field.

 

[Spark]

Also this is a minor thing but it's actually crazy to me that on an Australian-style pitch we basically had no conventional gully for the entire Test (as opposed to a sort of 4th slip). Brook could have been out multiple times to conventional gully in his innings, a lot of balls seemed to be going at catchable height the entire game through there.

 

[Burgey]

Hard to say what to do about the top six. Green in for Warner is obviously tempting but no idea who to make open in that situation. They might ask Head to do it but it'd be a brave, brave call.

Green opening is really no different to England promoting Ali so everyone else can keep their spot. I like the left-right combo, and Warner has regressed to the point where Green is really not going to be worse even if he makes single figures. And we avoid the 2nd Victorian curse by omitting the already cursed Marcus Harris.

If Head went up to open then you're weakening a strength in the hope you'll get the same output from him at the top. The only benefit of him opening might be it tempts England into bouncing him with the new ball instead of pitching it up and doing damage with it that way, which is the more dangerous approach.

Honestly, I can't see Cummins missing with a nine day break. If Neser plays for Boland, and he should, moving Green to open provides so much bowling cover it's insane, and it's a crazy #batdeep meme side, with Starc at nine and Cummins 10.

Starc
Cummins
Neser
Green
Marsh
Murphy

as bowlers with a little Head on the side, and who doesn't love that? I mean, if you can't manage your seamers' workload with that many options there's no hope for you.

 

[Shady Slim]

It must be a team management plan. We've never seen it before so it's not something that Cummins does instinctively - what fast bowler likes a field like this - and they're too stubborn with it when it's clearly not working for it not to be set in advance.

It's not even necessarily the plan of bowling it predominantly short to the tail, that can definitely work if done properly and Woakes was quite lucky to not dob one up to a fielder at times. But the field is like an anti-wicket taking field.

was going to reply to some of the above posts with something to this effect but i see you already have and i quite agree really

you can tell from the way this was implemented it wasn't a captain's call on the run that went unfortunately awry but rather a formulated plan

 

[Burgey]

 

[Prince EWS]

Green opening is really no different to England promoting Ali so everyone else can keep their spot.

Yeah I agree but I thought that was kinda dumb so I feel silly suggesting copying it.

 

[Burgey]

Yeah I agree but I thought that was kinda dumb so I feel silly suggesting copying it.

Tbf I was suggesting it before they did it so I don’t quite feel as bad!