*Official* Second Test (Lord's, London) 28 June–2 July

[Ashes81]

Just listening to Jarrod Kimber and he bought up an interesting point about England's lack of planning for usman compared to smudge and marnus. I remember people bringing this up when broad and Anderson kept going around the wicket to him in the 2nd dig despite usman averaging a lot less when RHB go over the wicket.

Stokes did eventually work some stuff out to slow usman down, like the umbrella field and having a fielder just behind the bowler like Dhoni use to do to pollard, but I can't help but think that if they'de had a more immediate plan for usman and executed it straight away rather than when he'de already made a ton of runs in the first dig England could have cut back his scoring a bit.

I didn't realise Jarrod Kimber was present at England's planning meetings.

He is of course talking out of his backside. To suggest that any international team didn't have detailed plans and analysis of the opposition, nevermind a key player like Khawaja, is nonsense.

Now the plans we had may not have been successful but that doesn't mean the plans weren't there or that they were incorrect.

It's like saying the Aussies mustn't have had plans for Joe Root as he scored an unbeaten century and 40 odd.

 

[Spark]

Wait that article isn't satire?

Re: Robinson's verbal and England's constant talk that being aggressive was a moral victory, it feels like England seem to think they're playing Australia of 20 years ago.

It doesn't seem to have clicked that they're playing a different style of Australian team which isn't attacking all the time and can play attritional cricket when need be. And that also goes for the wish that Australia were more verbally aggressive, hence Robinson referencing someone who retired a decade ago to justify himself.

It's all rather bizarre.

Yeah this is spot on I think. The whole thing seems to be trying to gin up the ghost of 2005, where the psychological hold of that Australian team as the ultimate alpha dogs of the cricketing world was so entrenched - not least in the minds of the team itself - that shattering that self-perception had a significant detrimental effect on the mentality of that team, and it showed. But this team under Cummins is far too self-effacing and frankly cautious in its approach to cricket to hold any such pretensions, and Cummins just isn't that sort of man. They're tilting at windmills if they genuinely believe this rubbish.

Maybe they could have had a case had they actually won the game, and Australia went away from Edgbaston full of what ifs. But they didn't. So they don't.

 

[chunksafc]

Ollie Robinson: We were surprised by how unwilling Australia were to go toe-to-toe with us

Ollie Robinson, in his first Wisden.com column, shares his views on the Edgbaston Test, Australia’s approach, becoming public enemy number one Down Under and tells us about England’s mindset going into Lord’s.You can bet on the 2023 Ashes with our Match Centre partners, bet365.

wisden.com

Well thats just a bizarre article. Reeks of Arrogance and not a great read.

I will just have a quick look at the record books, but im fairly certain it says Australia won the test match to take a 1-0 lead. I cant seem to find the column in the record books that says "but England played all the cricket and entertained the crowd, so its really their victory"

 

[Socerer 01]

its up there with KL Rahul saying they won the ipl in their heads before bottling it in 2016 or all the times Barcelona and Spain said they won because they made more passes and entertained people

 

[CartyDurham]

There's some astonishing stuff in there, probably McCullum's quote being the peak.

The thing that irks me about all this talk from the English camp is that their implicitly saying that without Bazball Test cricket is heading the way of the dodo.

To imply that Test cricket can only reach it's full potential when it's played ultra-aggressive all the time is laughable.

In England it’s on its way out

how many times do I have to post this. There is zero uptake in the youth for cricket in the uk outside private fee paying schools

this style England play is for home nation consumption and not for overseas fans to get their knickers in a twist


ITS NOT FOR ANY OTHER COUNTRY TO PLAY AND EVERY OTHER COUNTRY CAN CHOOSE WHATEVER METHOD THEY WANT


ITS ALL FOR THE YOUTH IN THE UK

WHY CAN PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTAND THIS POINT ?

 

[Anil]

"If it wasn’t for a lot of us, the Australians wouldn’t have even had a chance to win" That's true McCullum, just not the way you think it is...

 

[CartyDurham]

Well thats just a bizarre article. Reeks of Arrogance and not a great read.

I will just have a quick look at the record books, but im fairly certain it says Australia won the test match to take a 1-0 lead. I cant seem to find the column in the record books that says "but England played all the cricket and entertained the crowd, so its really their victory"

It’s all spin for the youngs uns chunks

that’s what this country is all about. Bull **** central

 

[CartyDurham]

"If it wasn’t for a lot of us, the Australians wouldn’t have even had a chance to win" That's true McCullum, just not the way you think it is...

And another bites

 

[Daemon]

Incredible article lol. Peak entertainment but kinda in a McGregor way where it’s both funny (and sometimes cringe) to see him talk smack and then get owned.

 

[CartyDurham]

Wait that article isn't satire?



Yeah this is spot on I think. The whole thing seems to be trying to gin up the ghost of 2005, where the psychological hold of that Australian team as the ultimate alpha dogs of the cricketing world was so entrenched - not least in the minds of the team itself - that shattering that self-perception had a significant detrimental effect on the mentality of that team, and it showed. But this team under Cummins is far too self-effacing and frankly cautious in its approach to cricket to hold any such pretensions, and Cummins just isn't that sort of man. They're tilting at windmills if they genuinely believe this rubbish.

Maybe they could have had a case had they actually won the game, and Australia went away from Edgbaston full of what ifs. But they didn't. So they don't.

Can you accept the point that all this hot air is aimed at the home country youth who get excited by this crap?

because that is what it is crap and not at all aimed at Australia or any other country

 

[CartyDurham]

What’s funny Anil. ?

it’s the truth and you need to educate yourself on the fact that no kids in England play cricket

test cricket in England will cease in ten years

that maybe good news

 

[chunksafc]

It’s all spin for the youngs uns chunks

that’s what this country is all about. Bull **** central

Possibly mate, but all the buzzwords in the world won't keep their attention as much as winning the series will.

The ECB would be better off getting some cricket on free to air, promoting the T20, one day cup and championship rather that that mess that's due on screen in the school holidays.

Then look at the schedule, the series is pretty much done by the start of the school holidays, so even less exposure for school age kids

 

[CartyDurham]

"If it wasn’t for a lot of us, the Australians wouldn’t have even had a chance to win" That's true McCullum, just not the way you think it is...

You bite though

 

[CartyDurham]

Possibly mate, but all the buzzwords in the world won't keep their attention as much as winning the series will.

The ECB would be better off getting some cricket on free to air, promoting the T20, one day cup and championship rather that that mess that's due on screen in the school holidays.

Then look at the schedule, the series is pretty much done by the start of the school holidays, so even less exposure for school age kids

We all agree there but these overseas fans leap on anything as a slight on how they play the game

it’s not , trying to get youth in England interested as the only schools playing are fee paying ones

the ecb wants the 100 and t20 to take over as they believe tests matches don’t have an appeal to the young people today

 

[Spark]

No one is writing for The Youth in Wisden of all places. This is a publication for core looking standing English Test cricket fans and this so is this article.

 

[CartyDurham]

I’m off back to the garden

I can’t believe how many posters are being pulled in by crap as gospel

If only they knew the absolute filth of the English media and shouting rubbish

 

[CartyDurham]

No one is writing for The Youth in Wisden of all places. This is a publication for core looking standing English Test cricket fans and this so is this article.

Well if core England fans fall for that crap they deserve a 5-0 beating

honestly cricket is in serious bother in the uk which I don’t think many realise

the ecb are actively looking to get rid of a lot of counties to centralise the game in test match grounds

ten years time , England will struggle to find 20 red ball specialists

it’s happening

 

[CartyDurham]

No one is writing for The Youth in Wisden of all places. This is a publication for core looking standing English Test cricket fans and this so is this article.

Nobody buys the Wisden apart from people like me nearly 60

It’s complete rubbish

overseas people seem to be very serious without understanding the bother Cricket is in within the uk

I’m off as I can’t be bothered reading the same negativity constantly on anything England do, say in print or on tv media

it was the same in the test. England didn’t bowl a good ball or hit a good shot on all five days

it’s not aimed at overseas

Enjoy your smilies and ridicule of this.

 

[chunksafc]

We all agree there but these overseas fans leap on anything as a slight on how they play the game

it’s not , trying to get youth in England interested as the only schools playing are fee paying ones

the ecb wants the 100 and t20 to take over as they believe tests matches don’t have an appeal to the young people today

They appear to have gone all in on the 100, even the T20 is pretty much being ignored.

My lad has cricket in his comprehensive school as part of PE, he enjoys it but the ECB do nothing to promote any form of cricket apart from the 100 and we know the issues with that stupid format.

As I've said mate, they may be soundbites but I don't like the arrogant way it's coming across, inonow my lad will watch more if we are winning rather than if we are losing but smashing the ball about a bit

 

[CartyDurham]

They appear to have gone all in on the 100, even the T20 is pretty much being ignored.

My lad has cricket in his comprehensive school as part of PE, he enjoys it but the ECB do nothing to promote any form of cricket apart from the 100 and we know the issues with that stupid format.

As I've said mate, they may be soundbites but I don't like the arrogant way it's coming across, inonow my lad will watch more if we are winning rather than if we are losing but smashing the ball about a bit

Totally agree but it’s classic ashes crap which both sides have employed over decades

it’s nothing new imo

people just need to ignore it imo