*Official* New Zealand vs Pakistan 2022/23

[TheBrand]

With the WC approaching I wouldn't actually mind seeing Latham at 4, Phillips at 5 and Mitchell at 6. Phillips speed through the middle overs could be desirable and pretty sure he bats 4/5 for Auckland (now Otago) right?

 

[jcas0167]

Tim Southee in the last 5 years has become NZ's version of Glenn McGrath. His bowling IQ is next level.

Denis Lillee apparently said Southee was the closest thing he'd seen to a young Glenn McGrath. It's interesting reading this early profile on him and the high hopes for his batting. His ND captain Marshall saying he could be like Cairns and Southee even quoted saying he doesn't want to just be seen as someone who slogs like he did in that debut innings.

He aspires to become a genuine allrounder: "I definitely don't want to be known as a nine or 10 that just sort of slogs it like the other day.

Stuff

i.stuff.co.nz

 

[Mike5181]

Southee's definitely moved up the ODI pecking order since Boult left and Ferguson fell off.

 

[Athlai]

Never doubted him

 

[Flem274*]

Haha, Southee and Franklin's batting careers is why I literally don't care about talented bowlers focusing too much on becoming Chris Cairns (note - this is distinct from trying to bat to the match situation, which everyone should do).

It's wasted time that could go into their bowling, and in Franklin's case literally killed his ability to be a test standard cricketer.

We're probably going to make the same mistake with KJ, who is a perfectly fine #8 as he is as long as he bats to the match situation. Literally could not give a **** about his batting when he is a generational talent with the ball in hand, one we seem to be trying hard to turn into Jacob Oram's bowling based on the past 18 months of him losing his outswinger. Shipley will be the next bloke. Save being an allrounder for the guys who have always been allrounders.

The Fawad Alam ball was God tier. **** his batting average.

 

[Athlai]

Franklin's bowling was hampered by injuries and only after that did he focus on his batting.

And RTB I know you're reading this. Say. His. Name.

 

[Hurricane2]

Another warm comment I wish to give is that Conway;s and Kane's partnership would have been incredible for Conway's development as an international player. To have no one other than Kane Williamson to talk to each over giving coaching advice on how to pace and sustain a long inning will be an experience Devon will benefit from immensely. After the match Conway in his post match interview was very complementary about the words of advice Kane gave. Kane with the absence of Ross is now undisputably the batting Kaumatua in the team and he will be our greatest asset in the quest for three back to back World Cup final appearances.

 

[Flem274*]

Franklin's bowling was hampered by injuries and only after that did he focus on his batting.

And RTB I know you're reading this. Say. His. Name.

he's not the first quick bowler to get injured.

whoever convinced our first good left arm swing bowler since collinge to take up batting full time should be shot. then run over. then forced to watch the harbhajan tons on repeat in hell.

 

[Mike5181]

Another warm comment I wish to give is that Conway;s and Kane's partnership would have been incredible for Conway's development as an international player. To have no one other than Kane Williamson to talk to each over giving coaching advice on how to pace and sustain a long inning will be an experience Devon will benefit from immensely. After the match Conway in his post match interview was very complementary about the words of advice Kane gave. Kane with the absence of Ross is now undisputably the batting Kaumatua in the team and he will be our greatest asset in the quest for three back to back World Cup final appearances.

I noticed Conway was visibly frustrated at one point and Williamson basically had to talk him down from doing something stupid, so that tracks.

 

[Zinzan]

Southee still probably wouldn't make my Top ODI XI except when we're playing in the SC where he's always bowled well.

Our best WC XI have the following locks for me;

Allen
Conway
KW *
Latham +
_______
Phillips
Bracewell
Santner
_______
Ferguson
_______

Jury is still out on my number 5, whether Mitchell, Chapman, or a bolter. I do rate Young, but not sure he's a good fit in the middle order in SC conditions. Numbers 9 and 11 out of Southee, Sodhi, Jamieson, Milne or Henry.

I do love our batting depth with Mace at 7 & Santa 8. I've always maintained Santner doesn't make a strong 7 in whiteball cricket, but a very good 8. Similar to Vettori in that respect.

 

[Moss]

he's not the first quick bowler to get injured.

whoever convinced our first good left arm swing bowler since collinge to take up batting full time should be shot. then run over. then forced to watch the harbhajan tons on repeat in hell.

Franklin was always rated as someone with batting ability right from his debut IIRC. Used to bat at around 7 for Wellington even before making the NZ side I think. So was a logical move after the injuries I guess, he was never the same bowler after the 2007 WC. NZ playing barely any tests for a good chunk of 2006-07 when he was at his peak didn’t help either.

There was also Shayne O’Connor just before Franklin. He too was a guy who could’ve really kicked on in tests if he’d stayed fit.

 

[Zinzan]

There was also Shayne O’Connor just before Franklin. He too was a guy who could’ve really kicked on in tests if he’d stayed fit.

Who can forget that delivery....

 

[Flem274*]

Franklin was always rated as someone with batting ability right from his debut IIRC. Used to bat at around 7 for Wellington even before making the NZ side I think. So was a logical move after the injuries I guess, he was never the same bowler after the 2007 WC. NZ playing barely any tests for a good chunk of 2006-07 when he was at his peak didn’t help either.

There was also Shayne O’Connor just before Franklin. He too was a guy who could’ve really kicked on in tests if he’d stayed fit.

nz domestic sides of those times were pure memes tho. the balances were out the gate.

"pitch looks green, better play 5 seamers and a token spinner. one of our quicks can bat 5."

franklin certainly had batting talent and was gonna be a decent fc genuine allrounder but he was a #8 in tests.

 

[jcas0167]

Franklin was always rated as someone with batting ability right from his debut IIRC. Used to bat at around 7 for Wellington even before making the NZ side I think. So was a logical move after the injuries I guess, he was never the same bowler after the 2007 WC. NZ playing barely any tests for a good chunk of 2006-07 when he was at his peak didn’t help either.

There was also Shayne O’Connor just before Franklin. He too was a guy who could’ve really kicked on in tests if he’d stayed fit.

I had a vague memory of Franklin batting as high as 4 for Wellington early on. In this interview he says he saw himself as an all-rounder but focused more on batting from 2007 because of a knee injury.

Stuff

i.stuff.co.nz

 

[RossTaylorsBox]

Franklin's bowling was hampered by injuries and only after that did he focus on his batting.

And RTB I know you're reading this. Say. His. Name.

Timothy Southee

 

[Athlai]

His shadow towers over everything you say.

 

[wellAlbidarned]

Southee still probably wouldn't make my Top ODI XI except when we're playing in the SC where he's always bowled well.

Southee is rubbish on flat decks but there seems to have been a trend back towards spicier decks in ODIs which he's exploited well

 

[Fuller Pilch]

he's not the first quick bowler to get injured.

whoever convinced our first good left arm swing bowler since collinge to take up batting full time should be shot

Shayne O'Connor says hi.

I can't attach thru my phone but check out youtube clip of O'Connor bowling Steve Waugh. Amazing delivery.

Shame 1999 WC White Duke bowler Geoff Allott wasn't the same with the kookaburra.

Edit: Zinzan has already attached THAT delivery

 

[Bahnz]

He was pretty effective at home the summer before the world cup (18 wickets at 21). It was just a case of a guy who's body struggled with the rigors of fast bowling, and who had the option to quickly move on to another career.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Franklin could definitely bat, but we already had late career Cairns, Oram, McCullum, and Vettori (as well as Astle, McMillan, and Styris bowling a bit) so hardly needed allrounders. We needed strike bowlers.