*Official* New Zealand in Sri Lanka

[honestbharani]

Do you pronouce that as Kum-ble-esque or Kum-blesque?

*Kumble-chaleesa

 

[Big_Gun]

Ravindra has to farm the strike 2mrw, cant expose number 10 to the first 4 balls, Nz still a chance, but he is gunna have to play excelent and probably hit some 6s.

 

[LangleyburyCCPlayer]

Ravindra has to farm the strike 2mrw, cant expose number 10 to the first 4 balls, Nz still a chance, but he is gunna have to play excelent and probably hit some 6s.

How long until Stokes can re-naturalise?

 

[SteveNZ]

If only we had culture of batting for established batsmen in our lower order... Instead, guys like Santner think they can be the hero, Southee has zero defensive technique or willingness to bat out dot balls etc. Good on Patel for at least showing it can be done at the end.

 

[Skyliner]

Santner and Southee have contributed a couple of wickets and a couple of runs between them. Not good enough. A second seamer bowling in tandem with O’Rourke could have been very handy on that deck, as O’Rourke showed he could get appreciable bounce and be a potent weapon….another bloke with some decent pace and willing to bend his back could have equally dangerous. NZ currently carrying too many passengers, particularly with Devon Conway having had a piece of kryptonite hidden somewhere in his kit. GP has been more rocks than diamonds, including muffing a crucial catch.

 

[Bahnz]

I remember watching Santner on Test debut and getting a 70 vs India (in India?). How has his batting fallen off this much? Or were the initial scores just going against the grain of his actual FC batting trend?

He's just never been a very good batsman except in the most friendly of conditions. Good attacking array of shots which makes him a handy guy to have in the last 5 overs of a white ball game (or when the team is 400/6 on a day 3 Bay Oval featherbed), but very easily worked over by quality bowling in challenging conditions.

 

[thierry henry]

I can't believe I'm about to say this, but...as much as I hated the selection of Macewell at the time, I don't think (subject to someone pulling up an old post and proving me wrong) it was because Santner was waiting in the wings. Actually, I thought Santner had pretty much been justifiably perma-dropped from tests. I'm not sure that he has earned this further run in the side over *gulp* Macewell because he took a few wickets and made some handy runs on a minefield in Bangladesh.

 

[Flem274*]

Spin bowling allrounders are nice in theory but we don't really have any good ones. Ravindra and Phillips are the pick of the crop to me.

Missing a Cairns/Oram/CdG as much as a Vettori. We got a lot of value out of the Ajaz/Somerville combo on tour before Somerville fell off in age and confidence after Stead thought the Sydney test was in 1981.

 

[Bahnz]

Spin bowling allrounders are nice in theory but we don't really have any good ones. Ravindra and Phillips are the pick of the crop to me.

Missing a Cairns/Oram/CdG as much as a Vettori. We got a lot of value out of the Ajaz/Somerville combo on tour before Somerville fell off in age and confidence after Stead thought the Sydney test was in 1981.

Yeah, and given how meh our long-term batting prospects are, Ravindra should really take a page out of KW's book and focus on his batting imo. Just read today that Severin has been in England in the off-season and is toying with the idea of taking the Will Williams route.

 

[HeathDavisSpeed]

Yeah, and given how meh our long-term batting prospects are, Ravindra should really take a page out of KW's book and focus on his batting imo. Just read today that Severin has been in England in the off-season and is toying with the idea of taking the Will Williams route.

Yeah, he's been with Kent 2nd XI for the first part of the Northern Summer. Not sure if that's as good an idea for Severin as for Williams. I kinda think Severin has a decent chance of playing international cricket, whereas Williams likely didn't. I'm not sure there's the solid financial future in county cricket that there was in the past - if you have a chance for international honours.

 

[Bahnz]

The calculus would be interesting. A county pro definitely earns a lot more than an NZ domestic stalwart (like probably twice as much on average). Of course an NZ international would earn more still, but you never know how that's going to turn out. He could get the chance when KW retires 18 months from now, or he could be stuck in the queue for another 5 or 6 years. And even if he does get his chance, you never know whether he'll turn out to be a Mitchell or a Young. It's a gamble either way.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Smith would be a great option at 8, but he would need more bowling tools to be a threat in Asia.

Re spinners, Sodhi can bat time and has a great record in Asia but his bowling seems to have regressed and accurate finger spinners seem a better option than expensive leg spinners. Talking of wrist spinners, Rippon would be a great option at 8 and seems quite a gritty bat but seems to have had the yips and bowled much less recently.

 

[straw man]

Santner vs Macewell is neither here nor there imo as we have lots of bowlers capable of holding up an end like that, given Rachin, Phillips and even Mitchell are in the side. Oh yeah and stock bowler Southee. It's wicket-taking that we need more of, only O'Rourke and latterly Ajaz have looked like providing that this match. And one ball from Phillips. We are missing a second quality spinner.

OTOH there are no other spinners worth picking in NZ and Ajaz is 35, if we are lucky has 3 more years at this level. I think they're hoping maybe Santner turns into a genuine test spinner to succeed him, this time around, and I think he'll get more chances on this tour regardless. I'm fairly sceptical, but we don't have many other options.

Eh, still pick Henry in place of one of Southee or Santner next test. Need more threat.

Fingers crossed for Rachin and Ajaz to pull off a miracle chase today.

 

[SteveNZ]

I can't believe I'm about to say this, but...as much as I hated the selection of Macewell at the time, I don't think (subject to someone pulling up an old post and proving me wrong) it was because Santner was waiting in the wings. Actually, I thought Santner had pretty much been justifiably perma-dropped from tests. I'm not sure that he has earned this further run in the side over *gulp* Macewell because he took a few wickets and made some handy runs on a minefield in Bangladesh.

If I go back on my posts throughout the years, I've always backed Santner to become Test quality and to be a world class limited overs player. I just felt he was one of those sportspeople, who would make it happen. Has all the skills, intelligent guy, plays off a +2 handicap in golf, I was just certain he'd find a way. But he hasn't.

Now, he seems like he's ensconced in the side because he's in the Southee ND clique. But the reality is he averages 24 with the bat, had that one crowning glory v a disinterested England side in 2019 but has vastly underdelivered otherwise (Bangladesh winning knock, I will grant). Someone posted above here and they are dead right, he's incapable of scoring runs against good bowling when his weaknesses are targeted (short balls with some pace).

 

[SteveNZ]

Ajaz probably has 3 years or so left in him, debuted late and doesn't have the miles on the clock that others do. Spinners can go on later, without any issue. Herath, for example, played until he was 40. There's your frontline spinner, for all conditions unless it's wet and green as hell. Then you have Phillips who turns it the other way, and Ravindra as another option if it's ragging.

We don't need anyone else.

And then we have 3-4 years to sufficiently develop the next spinner, whether it's Ashok or whoever it is. Identify who it is (could be more than one) and pump a lot of cricket into those guys, on A tours, against touring teams in NZ XIs, take them to India on off-season camps, expose them to the right coaches, and generally right the wrongs of the inconsistent, confidence-sapping approach we've taken over the last long while.

 

[thundaboult]

Time to face facts and invest in Addy Ashok for tests. Ajaz will guide that kid well no doubt. Bracewell and santner is more of that same old bits n pieces nz trope.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

One thing about Baz is that he's prepared to gamble on young players (including spinners). Hopefully Ashok gets a decent crack in the next 12 months

Re spin bowling allrounders it will be interesting to see how young Zak Cumming goes for Otago and which of his batting or bowling kicks on the most.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

If I go back on my posts throughout the years, I've always backed Santner to become Test quality and to be a world class limited overs player. I just felt he was one of those sportspeople, who would make it happen. Has all the skills, intelligent guy, plays off a +2 handicap in golf, I was just certain he'd find a way. But he hasn't.

Now, he seems like he's ensconced in the side because he's in the Southee ND clique. But the reality is he averages 24 with the bat,

Has dropped to 23.08 after this latest test.
Here's a comparison with others who could bat 8:

Henry 22.22 (admittedly with a few not outs & lucky slogs)
Sodhi 21.84
M Bracewell 19.92
Jamieson 19.63


Meanwhile Cummins averages 17, yet is a safer bet than all of them with the bat.

 

[straw man]

That didn't last long

 

[Bahnz]

Gutted Rachin couldn't at least get his century. Very good bit of bowling to finally get him.