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*Official** New Zealand in England

SpaceMonkey

International Debutant
badgerhair said:
There aren't any Test places available at the moment, judging by Fletcher's comments in an interview I read yesterday.

However, the obvious person for Bell to displace in the ODI XI is good old Rikki, and I don't imagine there'll be too many tears shed here if that happens.

I also agree with the comments elsewhere that Mahmood is likely to get a call-up. Harmison might play an ODI or two, but it's fairly unlikely. Jones will be unstressing his fracture, Hoggard is out of the ODI picture anyway because he can't bat amongst other things, so that just leaves Anderson and Flintoff, plus chucker Kirtley and Ol' Man Goughie.

Cheers,

Mike
Also the selectors know Harmison and Jones will get injured a fair bit over the years, so the faster they get Mahmood into the One day squad the better incase they need him to fill eithers Test place as he is the only young bowler like them in style really.
 

Kent

State 12th Man
I recommend this exercise to other NZ fans. I felt so much better afterwards!

My 6 biggest disappointments (NZ's tour so far, May 3 - June 10):

6) Chris Cairns

Wasn't your palm greased just to go on this tour, chiefly as a bowler! You got into some good form with the ball against SA but it made you feel sore, and now the others are too hapless to let you chime in with a spell here and there.

Let's just say your farewell test won't be quite as sad as I thought, because ODIs are clearly where your head-space and body now belongs. Considering what lesser talents like Twose, Harris etc. have managed as specialists, who knows? Perhaps blazing partnerships between you and Ross Taylor will be the key to us winning the 2007 World Cup.

5) Scott Styris

I've often thought you get the best view of a batsman's culture in English conditions.

I actually had high hopes for Styris (or Scott Stylish, as one of the West Indian commentators took to calling him), but I'm starting to think he and McMillan would rather be back at Eden Park, slugging a few homers.

"I'm really unlucky that I'm nicking everything" he said in his column recently. Well, actually that's because bowlers over there get swing even when the middle-order are batting, and following it with your hands is kind of a no-no....

4) Chris Martin

Left for England as NZ's Winsor Cup winner and mentioning aspirations of a county cricket contract. Was called a gentle trundler by several UK scribes, and then proceeded to bowl like one, which sadly will do nothing to quell the wags at my club who always insisted he's too delicate to last as a professional sportsman. "Look at those pat-a-cake celebrations!".

Personally, I wouldn't have minded a lot more of those pat-a-cake celebrations. Martin admits to having trouble with the Duke brand of ball, but he really needs a McGrath or a Pollock to add weight to that excuse.

3) Black Caps management

Have copped the most flak of anyone in the NZ media, a lot of it unjustly. Those claiming Butler should've been there from the start shows how poorly informed the rug...sorry, sports media are in NZ, given Butler was having surgery at roughly the time the plane was departing. Others claiming NZ shot themselves in the foot by not taking more than 14 players should also note that the 14th member of the squad (Kyle Mills) has bowled just 25 f/c overs in the last 5 weeks. If James Franklin had been in the intial squad, he'd be heading into the test at Trent Bridge with even less than that, and is probably glad he's spent each weekend bowling in club cricket rather than the nets every day.

Despite all this, there is some scope for questioning here. Like why was a spinner not one of the players stationed at a club in the UK? Is Vettori that much of a talent these days that he'll either play or we'll go in with no spinner at all?

2) Daryl Tuffey

It's hard to have a go at a trier. It's easy to have a go at a liar!

That basically sums up my dilemma here. There shouldn't be anything macho about representing your country IMO - regardless of the coach saying you're going to be his spearhead, or the fact every kid dreams of doing it. If you're not fit and you know it, it's ultimately up to you to stand down. It's not soft, it's not pessimistic, it's just smart.

1) Shane Bond

The real heartbreaker obviously. Damn Ashley Ross for saying he's new and improved! Damn Bracewell for saying he was on course for the second test, then on course for the tri-series, now on course for.....
 
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MoxPearl

State Vice-Captain
Dougie Rydal said:
NZ Team named this morning...

1. Mark Richardson
2. Stephen Fleming
3. Nathan Astle
4. Scott Styris
5. Craig McMillan
6. Jake Oram
7. Brendon McCullum
8. Chris Cairns
9. Jimmy Franklin
10. Kyle Mills
11. Chris Martin
well.. i woulda picked sinclar over mcmillan for sure
good to see franklin and mills in there ..

Martin is only in there obviously cause we have no one to replace him... i REALLY hope he fires..

Strong batting side as usual.. batters all the way down to number 10 :D

If we play to our potential... we will win.. but when on this tour have we done that ? lol
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
Mr Mxyzptlk said:
Enough to force a Test place? I can see the headlines now "Bell knocks Flintoff from England XI".
If he carries on in the vein he's in, he might force himself in, but no way would he replace Flintoff - more complement him.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
badgerhair said:
However, the obvious person for Bell to displace in the ODI XI is good old Rikki, and I don't imagine there'll be too many tears shed here if that happens.

I'm not so sure - the batting in the West Indies was clearly a man light, so I could see him coming as an addition to the squad.

On another note, Jim Troughton (him of the ODI call-up last year) has actually batted at 9 in Warwickshire's One Day side this season!
 

superkingdave

Hall of Fame Member
Batting where? Unless we are extending the batting line up (with Flintoff 7 etc) then his bowling wont come into the equation too much, not much call for a fifth seamer these days

That's not too say he wouldn't get in the team as a batter, just saying if he's to bat 5 or higher, then he should be considered purely on his batting ability
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
marc71178 said:
I'm not so sure - the batting in the West Indies was clearly a man light, so I could see him coming as an addition to the squad
Shoe-in, in that case.

Rikki's batting is clearly a man light too. :D
 

MoxPearl

State Vice-Captain
marc71178 said:
That's a very strong statement to make, especially when you consider the winning roll England are on at the moment.
winning roll ?

beating a west indies team who almost got rolled over by bangladesh ?
beating a new zealand team with about 75% of the team injured and poor selection decisions..

I agree england has a strong team at the moment.. but i just dont think u guys have been tested yet

We were on a "Roll" too .. we rolled over south africa.. after pakistan and india

Also how do u guys think u will do in the ODIS ?
 

MoxPearl

State Vice-Captain
luckyeddie said:
Not nice weather this morning - heavy cloud, a little light drizzle, humid.
Too dark to play at the moment
Damn..

what time is it over there when u posted that ?
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
MoxPearl said:
Damn..

what time is it over there when u posted that ?
8.15 am - just 2 and 3/4 hours before the thrashing er sorry match is due to start.

The sun's high in the sky but <insert Pink Floyd album title here>
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
MoxPearl said:
I agree england has a strong team at the moment.. but i just dont think u guys have been tested yet

We were on a "Roll" too .. we rolled over south africa.. after pakistan and india

Also how do u guys think u will do in the ODIS ?
1. Me neither, although from where we were 5 years ago, we most certainly HAVE been tested. Not by typical WI or NZ standards perhaps, but by typical England standards, most definitely.

2. On paper, and given the frailty of the opposition (well, their bones anyway), it should be a breeze. Personally, I don't care (much).
 

badgerhair

U19 Vice-Captain
marc71178 said:
I'm not so sure - the batting in the West Indies was clearly a man light, so I could see him coming as an addition to the squad.

On another note, Jim Troughton (him of the ODI call-up last year) has actually batted at 9 in Warwickshire's One Day side this season!
I'm not talking about the squad - I'm talking about the playing XI. Whom else would Bell, a batsman who bowls a bit, replace in the ODI XI?

Saying the XI was "a batsman light" was always equivalent to saying "Why oh why don't we pick a proper batsman rather than Rikki?", and Bell is the obvious choice.

Cheers,

Mike
 

tooextracool

International Coach
well saggers has been selected ahead of anderson for the 3rd test....i dont understand what the selectors see in saggers who is really another conditions affected bowler, at 32 he doesnt have much of a future anyways. anderson might not be any better but hes younger and has more of a future in the english side.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
superkingdave said:
Why don't you think Anderson is good enough to play for England?
Having watched both of them play for Lancs quite a bit, I've seen more potential and ability from Anderson than Mahmood (not saying Mahmood hasn't got a lot of ability) and yet Mahmood gets all these people bummin him all the time.
look anderson doesnt have pace or accuracy....not good enough at the test match level. outside the tests against zimbabwe hes been poor to say the least. i dont rate him highly as an ODI bowler either...i expect that record to fall dramatically as he plays on flatter wickets to the ones hes come across so far. i havent seen mahmood bowl yet.... so i'll reserve my comments about him for later.
 

luckyeddie

Cricket Web Staff Member
Too early to write Anderson off just yet - he's still not yet 22 and is learning (I hope). Many fast bowlers in the past were still plying their trade in county seconds at 21.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Kent said:
6) Chris Cairns

Wasn't your palm greased just to go on this tour, chiefly as a bowler! You got into some good form with the ball against SA but it made you feel sore, and now the others are too hapless to let you chime in with a spell here and there.
well i said at the start of the series that cairns was past his prime with the ball......there were many people saying he's improving and others saying that he is still the best all rounder in the world.
just looking at some of NZ's bowlers over the last 10 years it seems that almost everyone has had an injury plagued career.cairns,nash,doull,vettori,o'connor,allott,drum.....pity though some of them had real talent and couldnt quite showcase that. maybe theres something wrong with their nutrition that makes their bones weaker?
 

Craig

World Traveller
Neil Pickup said:
"Uncapped seamer Kyle Mills could also come into contention with Daryl Tuffey below his best in the two Tests so far."

3-0 it is, then.

I'd go with Anderson over Sagggers - don't think Saggers ever will be Test Class. Anderson isn't either at present, but at least he has the potential to be. Well done England for not playing Jones through the injury and making sure he's fit for the West Indies.
How bad is his injury?
 

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