*Official* England in South Africa Thread

[tooextracool]

vaughan also has to get inside his own head and get himself to bat for longer hours....

and you dont think hes trying?

 

[tooextracool]

The second big problem is Vaughan. Listening to Boycot, it appears Vaughan has changed his batting technique a bit (more precisely; his trigger movement before playing his shots). This might mean he's not in a form slump, but an actual ability slump, which is far more serious of course.

if you mean the little shuffle before he plays his shots, hes been doing that for ages and its certainly not his problem.

 

[DocHead]

out of curiosity, how many people actually thought that england would come close?

Paul Allott did certainly. To clarify, I didn't mean he's a legend due to that not particularly stunning prophecy, his commentary is awesome. Also come close meant both drawing or winning, Boycs recokons the current England side can't bat to save a match, they look very flashy, but grinding it out for a couple of days is well beyond them.

Mike Haysman has become an entertaining commentator too.

Does anyone else miss the end of tour music video? I always thought Ace of Base's The Sign would make a nice one.

 

[tooextracool]

Paul Allott did certainly. To clarify, I didn't mean he's a legend due to that not particularly stunning prophecy, his commentary is awesome. Also come close meant both drawing or winning, Boycs recokons the current England side can't bat to save a match, they look very flashy, but grinding it out for a couple of days is well beyond them.

re paul allott is an idiot, like some other people here who thought that englands last 5 could bat for 90 overs. apparently when they pull off one miracle like they did in durban it is expected that they can pull off absolutely anything no matter how impossible, even if it takes having to achieve 3 miracles at the same time. i believe that was the philosophy of the england batters when they were batting in the 1st inning, whatever possessed them to play such rubbish.
with regard to boycott, yes i quite like the way he doesnt hesistate to criticise anyone, no matter what they've achieved in their career till then and more often than not his opinions and predictions turn out to be true.

 

[Tom Halsey]

like some other people here who thought that englands last 5 could bat for 90 overs.

We never 'thought' it, but we didn't completely dismiss it. I believe I discribed it as 'having as much chance of Exeter in the FA Cup'. That is not actually thinking that it is probable, more like very remotely possible.

 

[Steulen]

if you mean the little shuffle before he plays his shots, hes been doing that for ages and its certainly not his problem.

OK, this is just me being ignorant and passing on what Boycott commented upon when discussing Vaughan's woeful run with the bat: that little shuffle used to be different, and since he's changed it, he hasn't scored runs. Don't know if he's right, just pointing out that IF he's right, Vaughan has a far bigger problem than 'just' a major form slump.

 

[Tom Halsey]

yes play like this in the ashes and we'll lose 5-0.
actually we'll probably salvage a complementary win in the dead rubber game and lose 4-1.

Well, AFAIK it's our first defeat since 2003, so we aren't doing too badly.

We've played badly for one Test, and true to the English, people are jumping on them already.

 

[Tom Halsey]

wow, something quite brilliant. nonetheless its never been achieved in test cricket, which is pretty much what this game was all about.

Well, single pairs have batted right through days in Test cricket before, and considering the 2 in at the start of the day were recognised batsmen, I'd have said it was still remotely possible.

 

[tooextracool]

We never 'thought' it, but we didn't completely dismiss it. I believe I discribed it as 'having as much chance of Exeter in the FA Cup'. That is not actually thinking that it is probable, more like very remotely possible.

anything that relied on a number of miracles is simply impossible. in reality a shot like that is impossible.

 

[tooextracool]

Well, single pairs have batted right through days in Test cricket before, and considering the 2 in at the start of the day were recognised batsmen, I'd have said it was still remotely possible.

really? which single pair batted for 90 overs straight? let alone one being a keeper-batsman.

 

[tooextracool]

Well, AFAIK it's our first defeat since 2003, so we aren't doing too badly.

We've played badly for one Test, and true to the English, people are jumping on them already.

have you even been watching the series? we've been playing poorly for nearly the entire series.
and yes its our first defeat since 03, fascinating isnt it that we finally lost to a team that is actually competitive on home turf compared to our countless victories over the same rubbish WI side. look before the series i said that even if england played the way they had all summer, they would still lose to australia, because there were still improvements that needed to be made(such as the number of spells of consistent short bowling for absolutely no apparent reason). but performances like this mean that we have no chance against australia.

 

[Tom Halsey]

really? which single pair batted for 90 overs straight? let alone one being a keeper-batsman.

It has happened 10 times IIRC, the last was Steve Waugh and Greg Blewett against SA coincidentially in 1997. I don't know if anyone has dont it since, but they were the tenth to do it.

 

[tooextracool]

OK, this is just me being ignorant and passing on what Boycott commented upon when discussing Vaughan's woeful run with the bat: that little shuffle used to be different, and since he's changed it, he hasn't scored runs. Don't know if he's right, just pointing out that IF he's right, Vaughan has a far bigger problem than 'just' a major form slump.

well i wont deny that he maybe right, of course i dont know what boycott said precisely so i wont say anything against it. if it is just the shuffle though, its something that he does to get himself into position for every shot, its also something that michael papps off NZ does. the thing that i've found vaughan struggling with off late is his foot movement and his unnecessary tendency to chase wide delivieries.

 

[Tom Halsey]

anything that relied on a number of miracles is simply impossible. in reality a shot like that is impossible.

If even single pairs can do it, 5 wickets is more than possible.

 

[Tom Halsey]

have you even been watching the series? we've been playing poorly for nearly the entire series.
and yes its our first defeat since 03, fascinating isnt it that we finally lost to a team that is actually competitive on home turf compared to our countless victories over the same rubbish WI side. look before the series i said that even if england played the way they had all summer, they would still lose to australia, because there were still improvements that needed to be made(such as the number of spells of consistent short bowling for absolutely no apparent reason). but performances like this mean that we have no chance against australia.

Were well on top 1st Test (apart from when we collapsed a bit 1st Innings) fought back incredibly well 2nd Test, and naff granted in this Test. Yes as it is the Aussies will beat us but it isn't that bad.

 

[tooextracool]

It has happened 10 times IIRC, the last was Steve Waugh and Greg Blewett against SA coincidentially in 1997. I don't know if anyone has dont it since, but they were the tenth to do it.

interesting, that does change things and i might just admit that england had a 1 in a million chance in winning. but realistically though you and i both know it was never going to happen.

 

[tooextracool]

Were well on top 1st Test (apart from when we collapsed a bit 1st Innings) fought back incredibly well 2nd Test, and naff granted in this Test. Yes as it is the Aussies will beat us but it isn't that bad.

yes hence in every test there has been poor sessions from england, each time in the first 2 tests they escaped luckily, something that wont happen against a team like australia. ive never actually claimed it was that bad, im simply saying that theres a good chance of it being better if vaughan bats like he can( and we all know that not many can match him when he does that) and if someone does even remotely near as good a job as vaughan has captained his side so far.

 

[Anil]

and you dont think hes trying?

if he is, doesn't seem to be succeeding so far...

 

[Tom Halsey]

interesting, that does change things and i might just admit that england had a 1 in a million chance in winning. but realistically though you and i both know it was never going to happen.

I never said we would win and still don't think we had a hope in hell of winning. I think we had a better than one in a million chance of drawing.

 

[tooextracool]

if he is, doesn't seem to be succeeding so far...

yes thats precisely the point, and which is the reason why i recommend that if he doesnt score runs in this series, that he be stripped of the captaincy, simply because he really needs to work on his game. it will be a major tragedy if someone with the talent that vaughan has ends up averaging 35 odd a the end of his career.