*Official* Australia vs South Africa -2022/3

[GoodAreasShane]

If our second spinner is agar and we're not 100% on him being better than a hazlewood in india are we better off just saying **** it and picking 3 seamers+lyon+green? If the deck is ragging square than head-marnus-smith should be fine as a second spinner, otherwise I don't see an aga/murphy outdoing our 3rd pace option (whether it be boland or haze or morris or whoever).

Barring a raging turner like Pune was last tour, there is a strong argument for this imo

As an aside, I tend to believe Morris may be better served by going back to play for WA in the Shield, not sure he's quite a viable option to actually play in such entirely unfamiliar conditions yet so is probably better served by playing as opposed to going to the subcontinent as a net bowler/gatorade mixer

 

[halba]

Barring a raging turner like Pune was last tour, there is a strong argument for this imo

As an aside, I tend to believe Morris may be better served by going back to play for WA in the Shield, not sure he's quite a viable option to actually play in such entirely unfamiliar conditions yet so is probably better served by playing as opposed to going to the subcontinent as a net bowler/gatorade mixer

yep if morris is not playing he should play shield cricket and continue his development. at age 24, he's next in line once the likes of haze/boland retire. boland is 33 and haze is 32. they only have a few more years of cricket left based on historical retirements of aus' pace bowlers(mcgrath retired at 36 ish)

 

[artvandalay]

**** me, Lyon just can't get a wicket. These umpires aren't giving a single lbw in his favour.

 

[morgieb]

If our second spinner is agar and we're not 100% on him being better than a hazlewood in india are we better off just saying **** it and picking 3 seamers+lyon+green? If the deck is ragging square than head-marnus-smith should be fine as a second spinner, otherwise I don't see an aga/murphy outdoing our 3rd pace option (whether it be boland or haze or morris or whoever).

I think this was originally our plan at Rawalpindi, but the attack proved toothless. Not sure whether it would've worked on a less flat surface, though.

 

[GoodAreasShane]

I am not saying that what you propose is not the more ideal circumstance, it is exactly what I was advocating 4 years ago while players I mentioned were still around... unfortunately that time has passed, and that method iof doing things is no really available and for me keeping players on that are more of a detriment to the future, just makes it worse. So this is what I`m advocating in this less than ideal situation.

I simply cannot agree in the slightest. Nothing could possibly be more detrimental to South African cricket than burning through potentially promising players by basically throwing them to the wolves under the guise of "looking to the future" or somesuch

This entire debate really is going in circles, not getting anywhere at all. Just like what would happen to South Africa if they went full youth über alles like you keep proposing

 

[artvandalay]

We should have bowled more short stuff to Elgar in South Africa, instead Bumrah/Siraj were all relying on movement off the pitch.

Targetting the stumps a bit too much. Did it in the last test against England too.

 

[StephenZA]

I simply cannot agree in the slightest. Nothing could possibly be more detrimental to South African cricket than burning through potentially promising players by basically throwing them to the wolves under the guise of "looking to the future" or somesuch

This entire debate really is going in circles, not getting anywhere at all. Just like what would happen to South Africa if they went full youth über alles like you keep proposing

The entire debate at this stage is that having Elgar in the team makes it easier for the needed selection for the other 4 less experienced players that everybody agrees on... I no longer think Elgar is required.

 

[GoodAreasShane]

The entire debate at this stage is that having Elgar in the team makes it easier for the needed selection for the other 4 less experienced players that everybody agrees on... I no longer think Elgar is required.

I know exactly what you think, I think you are absolutely and comprehensively wrong.

Like I said, going in circles

 

[StephenZA]

I know exactly what you think, I think you are absolutely and comprehensively wrong.

Like I said, going in circles

Thanks for your validation...

 

[Prince EWS]

What do you think the current teams entire selection policy is based on?

Yeah, it's based on something no-one in this thread supports.

We can all hang **** of the SA selectors quite easily. I haven't seen anyone here defend those *****. I don't think anyone here even supports Elgar having a say or being in a leadership role. That much is a agreed - they suck. No-one here agrees with them.

You taking it and running to justify Gregchappellism is a whole other thing though.

 

[Shady Slim]

If our second spinner is agar and we're not 100% on him being better than a hazlewood in india are we better off just saying **** it and picking 3 seamers+lyon+green? If the deck is ragging square than head-marnus-smith should be fine as a second spinner, otherwise I don't see an aga/murphy outdoing our 3rd pace option (whether it be boland or haze or morris or whoever).

another convert to Shady Slim Thought, very nice you are welcome among us nintendo

 

[GoodAreasShane]

See Marnus, the leggies are the way to go. Bin the mediums and focus on that

 

[Spark]

Alas I just don't think Haze is trusted any more on slow pitches, and I don't think it's unfair to come to that conclusion either

 

[StephenZA]

You taking it and running to justify Gregchappellism is a whole other thing though.

But I have not done that, mostly I have wanted to select exactly the players that everybody else, that knows SA cricket, agrees needs to be selected. Younger (not young) talented players scoring runs. The only big advocate I have of any player is really van Tonder, who while not doing badly has not done great recently. I have had justifiable concerns regarding Elgar that has been proved true this tour.

Elgar, J Malan, Markram, van Tonder, M. Ackerman, de Zorzi, Rickelton, Verryenne, Mulder, Jansen, Rabada, Maharaj/Harmer, Nortje, Coetzee, Ngidi

That was literally the squad I wanted to see before this tour. Nothing controversial nothing extreme. And if Bavuma had been selected and not van Tonder, it would have been fine. Only difference now is Elgar.

 

[Daemon]

Had to do a double take when I saw Haze has only played 59 Tests. Feel like he's been around forever.

 

[Spikey]

more like Ashton Agone

 

[Shady Slim]

Alas I just don't think Haze is trusted any more on slow pitches, and I don't think it's unfair to come to that conclusion either

i'm not even against picking a second spinner, if they are good, it's just that agar is not that

 

[Spikey]

Had to do a double take when I saw Haze has only played 59 Tests. Feel like he's been around forever.

might be because he was hyped up before Cummins and Starc and Pattinson but debuted after all of them, then injures, not being selected etc etc

 

[Starfighter]

 

[morgieb]

Alas I just don't think Haze is trusted any more on slow pitches, and I don't think it's unfair to come to that conclusion either

Has looked genuinely damaging here. Admittedly has been often innocuous in the subcontinent though.