***Official*** Australia in England (The Ashes)

[SpaceMonkey]

Amount of catches is irrelevent, it could mean he's the best, or it could mean he played in a team with bowlers who created more chances in slip than other teams.

Best way to say who was or is the best slip catcher is to go by percentage caught to percentage dropped. Even that wont be 100% accurate but would be alot better way of measuring it.

 

[Scallywag]

Amount of catches is irrelevent, it could mean he's the best, or it could mean he played in a team with bowlers who created more chances in slip than other teams.

Best way to say who was or is the best slip catcher is to go by percentage caught to percentage dropped. Even that wont be 100% accurate but would be alot better way of measuring it.

Agreed, and you only have to look at the respect given to the Australian team when Mark was playing. The team was known for dropping very few catches. They didnt get that reputation by having Mark hang around the slips taking the odd easy catch.

 

[aussie]

http://content.cricinfo.com/columns/content/story/146254.html

Go right ahead and argue, but your arguement is with S Rajesh who produced the stats, you show me something other than " I think Dravid is not the luckiest cricketer" and I will compare that to his assesment.

And the most dropped batsman since 2003 is Sehwag, Ponting, Trescothic and Bashar.

But its Dravid that cashes in on the dropped catches.
Since the start of 2003, Dravid has been given let-offs six times, and has made the opposition pay to the tune of 378 runs - that's 63 per dropped chance. Include the fact that he's remained unbeaten on two of those occasions, and the average shoots up to nearly 95.

So dont let the facts get in the way, even though Langer has less let-offs than most batsmen people just cant get past their biases and accept the quality of this batsman.

So you go right ahead and put up your arguement.

well mate, after reading this article their is no need for much of an arguement, mr.rajesh is saying dravid is lucky according to his very odd study , because he has gotten away with the most edges & plays and misses than any other batsman since 2001.

I wont say that luck, thats part of the game i dont see how that makes him lucky

 

[aussie]

Because that's why he'd argue against me several times when I've said MacGill is rubbish?

but he was right to argue because it is nonsense to say MacGill is rubbish, but we have been through this argument before dont lets go back to it

 

[marc71178]

Best way to say who was or is the best slip catcher is to go by percentage caught to percentage dropped. Even that wont be 100% accurate but would be alot better way of measuring it.

Problem with that is it then becomes a matter of opinion on some chances.

Still, in a way picking the best fielder will always be more opinion driven than numbers-driven.

 

[Mister Wright]

Four men have taken 10 or more catches in four separate series: Botham, Ian Chappell, Bobby Simpson and Mark Waugh. If Mark Waugh is such rubbish, why is he joint holder of a number of catches record with three definite greats in the slips area?

Cheers,

Mike

When did I say Mark Waugh was a rubbish catcher. He was a great fielder and catcher yes, no doubt, his record speaks for itself. But to be considered 'one of the greats' he would have had to have taken more of the simple chances. IMO (and it is my opinion quite obviously lol) he dropped far too many simple chances when guys like Taylor, Simpson, Hooper et al may not have been as brilliant in taking the spekies, but were very solid and took the simpler chances more than 90% of the time. I guess it just depends on what criteria you use to determine your greats. Flair and freakishness does not equal greatness.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Yet another dumb Aussie shoots his mouth off...


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/cricket/4598845.stm


"I just don't think they have the attack to bowl Australia out twice,"

"It may be a bit harsh but they rely too much on Steve Harmison and the spinner's a bit of a worry."


The picture BBC used of Lehmann looking like a fat version of Phil Tufnell says it all I think.

 

[archie mac]

Yet another dumb Aussie shoots his mouth off...
.

Why Can't he have an opinion? He has played a lot of county Cricket, so I am sure he has faced most of the English attack. I thought his comments fair enough.

 

[Scaly piscine]

Why Can't he have an opinion? He has played a lot of county Cricket, so I am sure he has faced most of the English attack. I thought his comments fair enough.

The same England attack that without much contribution from Harmison consistently did well against SA - with consistent batting from England it would have been 3-0 or 4-0. England comfortably have the best bowling attack when excluding Australia, to say they don't have the attack to bowl Australia out twice (without any context given, so he must mean on any pitch England could produce) is utterly stupid.

 

[archie mac]

The same England attack that without much contribution from Harmison consistently did well against SA - with consistent batting from England it would have been 3-0 or 4-0. England comfortably have the best bowling attack when excluding Australia, to say they don't have the attack to bowl Australia out twice (without any context given, so he must mean on any pitch England could produce) is utterly stupid.

"If the weather's fine and the wickets are flat, I can't see England winning."

I would imagine Lehmann's comments were just 'grabs' and the line above suggests he may have had certain conditions in mind.
I have read his bio and he seems to have a fair understanding of tactics. He was also used a lot by Ponting for advice on the field.

 

[superkingdave]

Lehmann, whose autobiography Worth The Wait is released this week

most important line in that article

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Inclined to agree with Lehmann, actually. On flat wickets, England won't be able to bowl Australia out for chasable totals. They need to either prepare wickets which have something in them for bowlers, or put in simply phenomenal batting performances. England's bowling attack is good, but Harmison has looked poor of late, Giles is nothing particularly special, particularly on flat pitches, and Jones hasn't done all that much in his test career to date, and if they don't fire that leaves far too much work for Hoggard and Flintoff against what is by far the best batting lineup in the world. If it becomes a battle of the 500+ scores, England will get thrashed. Their best hope is to present conditions where it is as difficult as possible for the Australian batsman to dominate proceedings.

 

[marc71178]

Why Can't he have an opinion? He has played a lot of county Cricket, so I am sure he has faced most of the English attack. I thought his comments fair enough.

He won't have faced most of them since they became Test regulars.

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

Agreed, and you only have to look at the respect given to the Australian team when Mark was playing. The team was known for dropping very few catches. They didnt get that reputation by having Mark hang around the slips taking the odd easy catch.

Exactly. The Waugh/Taylor/Warne slip trio barely dropped a thing. Taylor and Waugh were absolutely fantastic slip fielders, and Warne is certainly good enough to be third slip after those two. After Taylor left, Waugh/Warne/Ponting was very good as well. After the loss of Mark Waugh however, things went downhill for the Australia slip cordon to a noticable degree, and if you consider how noticable this was despite the fact that they still had to high quality slip fielders in Warne and Ponting, you realise exactly how much Mark Waugh was worth.

 

[aussie]

The same England attack that without much contribution from Harmison consistently did well against SA - with consistent batting from England it would have been 3-0 or 4-0. England comfortably have the best bowling attack when excluding Australia, to say they don't have the attack to bowl Australia out twice (without any context given, so he must mean on any pitch England could produce) is utterly stupid.

its not a totally robust comment from Boofa mate, if they wickets are flat(Like last season) i will be extremely difficult to bowl australia out twice.Especially with the form of our trump card Harmison

 

[aussie]

He won't have faced most of them since they became Test regulars.

well he faced enough, so its a fair comment to make

 

[marc71178]

well he faced enough, so its a fair comment to make

Facing them 2 or 3 years ago is irrelevant though.

 

[archie mac]

Facing them 2 or 3 years ago is irrelevant though.

I imagine there is nothing like facing a bowler. Lehmann would I think, have had the chance to watch the English bowlers on Tele, (not as good) and that does not stop most people giving a view.

 

[Macka]

Lehmann, whose autobiography Worth The Wait is released this week

I'm sure everyone thought this, but wouldn't 'Worth the Weight' be a more apt title?

 

[age_master]

lol, i reakon the book could be worth the wait though, Lehmanns a pretty funny bloke.