Kumar Sangakkara vs Allan Border

[HookShot]

Depends on the context.

If I want a World-class batsman to fill the No.3 spot then I’m going to select Sangakkara every time.

But if I need a ‘thou shall not pass’ middle order batsman then it has to be AB.

Greatness? Border by a smidge I suppose as he resurrected Australian cricket from the dead.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Both excellent batsmen with extended peaks and I understand Sanga’s era was easier for batting but I think the gap between their stats is significant enough for me to still choose him.

Sanga played like 80% of his matches on the subcontinent and got to smash a double against Bangladesh every few weeks. Top 15 batsman ever imo but he has a pretty big advantage when it comes to his surface level stats relative to other ATGs.

 

[HookShot]

Sanga’s double tons….

Date	Versus	Ground	Runs
1	04/02/2014​	Bangladesh​	Zahur Ahmed Chowdhury Stadium​	319​
2	27/07/2006​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	287​
3	14/05/2004​	Zimbabwe​	Queens Sports Club​	270​
4	11/08/2004​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	232​
5	06/03/2002​	Pakistan​	Gaddafi Stadium​	230​
6	11/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	Asgiriya Stadium​	222*​
7	06/08/2014​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	221​
8	26/07/2010​	India​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	219​
9	18/10/2011​	Pakistan​	Sheikh Zayed Stadium​	211​
10	03/01/2015​	New Zealand​	Basin Reserve​	203​
11	03/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	P Sara Oval​	200*​
12	22/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	199*​
13	30/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	192​
14	16/11/2007​	Australia​	Bellerive Oval​	192​

 

[CricAddict]

When I read through the thread, almost all comments favor Border and I thought he will be smashing it in the voting but it is actually Sanga who is almost double the votes of Border.

 

[Victor Ian]

Sanga’s wanker tons….

Date	Versus	Ground	Runs
1	04/02/2014​	Bangladesh​	Zahur Ahmed Chowdhury Stadium​	319​
2	27/07/2006​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	287​
3	14/05/2004​	Zimbabwe​	Queens Sports Club​	270​
4	11/08/2004​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	232​
5	06/03/2002​	Pakistan​	Gaddafi Stadium​	230​
6	11/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	Asgiriya Stadium​	222*​
7	06/08/2014​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	221​
8	26/07/2010​	India​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	219​
9	18/10/2011​	Pakistan​	Sheikh Zayed Stadium​	211​
10	03/01/2015​	New Zealand​	Basin Reserve​	203​
11	03/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	P Sara Oval​	200*​
12	22/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	199*​
13	30/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	192​
14	16/11/2007​	Australia​	Bellerive Oval​	192​

Corrected. Sanga is kind of like Popeye.

 

[HookShot]

AB biggest scores…

Date	Versus	Ground	Runs
1	11/12/1987​	New Zealand​	Adelaide Oval​	205​
2	22/07/1993​	England​	Headingley​	200*​
3	27/06/1985​	England​	Lord's​	196​
4	26/12/1985​	India​	Melbourne Cricket Ground​	163​
5	11/09/1979​	India​	MA Chidambaram Stadium​	162​
6	18/03/1980​	Pakistan​	Gaddafi Stadium​	153​
7	08/11/1985​	New Zealand​	Brisbane Cricket Ground​	152*​
8	18/03/1980​	Pakistan​	Gaddafi Stadium​	150*​
9	01/08/1985​	England​	Old Trafford​	146*​
10	28/02/1986​	New Zealand​	AMI Stadium​	140​
11	30/01/1982​	West Indies​	Adelaide Oval​	126​
12	28/11/1986​	England​	WACA Ground​	125​
13	07/02/1981​	India​	Melbourne Cricket Ground​	124​

 

[TheJediBrah]

Sanga played like 80% of his matches on the subcontinent and got to smash a double against Bangladesh every few weeks. Top 15 batsman ever imo but he has a pretty big advantage when it comes to his surface level stats relative to other ATGs.

This. One of the most overrated players. Sanga was still very good outside Asia compared to a guy like Jayawardene though.

 

[Shady Slim]

Sanga’s double tons….

Date	Versus	Ground	Runs
1	04/02/2014​	Bangladesh​	Zahur Ahmed Chowdhury Stadium​	319​
2	27/07/2006​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	287​
3	14/05/2004​	Zimbabwe​	Queens Sports Club​	270​
4	11/08/2004​	South Africa​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	232​
5	06/03/2002​	Pakistan​	Gaddafi Stadium​	230​
6	11/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	Asgiriya Stadium​	222*​
7	06/08/2014​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	221​
8	26/07/2010​	India​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	219​
9	18/10/2011​	Pakistan​	Sheikh Zayed Stadium​	211​
10	03/01/2015​	New Zealand​	Basin Reserve​	203​
11	03/07/2007​	Bangladesh​	P Sara Oval​	200*​
12	22/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Galle International Stadium​	199*​
13	30/06/2012​	Pakistan​	Sinhalese Sports Club Ground​	192​
14	16/11/2007​	Australia​	Bellerive Oval​	192​

three of those are categorically not double tons i might add

now don't get me wrong people who think a 200 against bangladesh is somehow more valuable than a 199 against pakistan by virtue of beginning with a two are clowns but you described the list as his double tons

 

[OverratedSanity]

This. One of the most overrated players. Sanga was still very good outside Asia compared to a guy like Jayawardene though.

Lol I don't think he's overrated (as I said, clearly top 15 or so), don't try to imply I said that by "agreeing" with me.

I do think his stats overrate him though, if that makes sense.

 

[harsh.ag]

Border. But not easy since Border's batting was ugly af, much like my face and my posts.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Lol I don't think he's overrated (as I said, clearly top 15 or so), don't try to imply I said that by "agreeing" with me.

I do think his stats overrate him though, if that makes sense.

Relax, you're reading into things a bit lol, I know you didn't day that. That's what I'm saying, not you.

He's overrated by people who look at averages and can't see anything beyond that.

 

[jayjay]

As opposed to the bloke who averaged 55 away from home across a 156 test career.

Sanga a gun but TOTAB is the world's greatest post-war cricketer.

I didn't say AB wasn't a good all conditions batsman, just that Sanga is better.

 

[Burgey]

Bold. Very bold.

 

[nightprowler10]

Sanga played like 80% of his matches on the subcontinent and got to smash a double against Bangladesh every few weeks. Top 15 batsman ever imo but he has a pretty big advantage when it comes to his surface level stats relative to other ATGs.

Not disagreeing with your overall point, but by saying "subcontinent" you're undervaluing a double against Pakistan in UAE when SL were bowled out for a sub-200 score in the first innings.

 

[HookShot]

three of those are categorically not double tons i might add

now don't get me wrong people who think a 200 against bangladesh is somehow more valuable than a 199 against pakistan by virtue of beginning with a two are clowns but you described the list as his double tons

I just wanted to cut ‘n paste down to Sangakkara’s 192 in Hobart because it was a great knock. Also, everyone can count.

 

[SillyCowCorner1]

Border. But not easy since Border's batting was ugly af, much like my face and my posts.

Post of the week, by far.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Not disagreeing with your overall point, but by saying "subcontinent" you're undervaluing a double against Pakistan in UAE when SL were bowled out for a sub-200 score in the first innings.

That's why I rank him highly, he played a lot of great innings both in asia and abroad. Was only responding to the post about him having a sizeable gap in his statistics compared to Border... it definitely helps you statistically to play more in familiar conditions.

 

[Coronis]

Jeez is he seriously that overrated? Bloke averaged 54.07 away from Sri Lanka and 49.69 away from the subcontinent. I mean its not his fault he was better at taking advantage in his home games is it?

 

[Prince EWS]

Jeez is he seriously that overrated? Bloke averaged 54.07 away from Sri Lanka and 49.69 away from the subcontinent. I mean its not his fault he was better at taking advantage in his home games is it?

I don't think OS is actually saying he is over-rated - he said he's in the top 15 bats of all time and he's not really rated higher than that by the vast majority of people - he's just saying that his overall Test average is inflated compared to someone like Border. He's definitely not a 7-run beter batsman than Border so his raw average "over-rates" him in that way.

I largely agree too. I think 10th-15th of all time is about right and I voted for him here ahead of Border but it's close, and the reason it can be so close despite his obscene average is the factors OS pointed out.

 

[honestbharani]

Border will get more votes if Burgey posted less tbh.