How would you Pick Englands ODI team After the world cup

[NZTailender]

Well, first open365 said this:

...then:
... without ever stating exactly what he was taking back. Thus me making this gag in typical deadpan fashion...

Oh Jack, you kidder. When will you ever learn!


Aaaanyway. 2007 English season at home? Who are England playing in their ODI series?

My XI, based on what I've seen and guys who perhaps look the goods for the future.


1. M Trescothick - England's best ever ODI opener, IMO. Depends on how he's feeling then I guess
2. I Bell - Seems to be solid opening, and for my mind doesn't fit to well coming in later when strike needs to be constantly rotated before the slog. Seems like he'll get tied up too much then, and would be much better to free the arms opening.
3. K Pietersen - Batting at 3 might give him time to build big innings. Or he may get out for 30 off 15 before fielding restrictions are over, trying to go too fast. But I think he's matured a bit now, and won't throw his wicket away as easily.
4. R Bopara - Despite a fairly poor List A average, I think England will need to blood a new batsman in this series (he could possibly play in the CB games) and Bopara seems to be the front runner.
5. A Flintoff - Seems about right. Not too high, not too low. Just right.
6. P Collingwood - Probably one of England's best finishers in ODI's. Seems to have lost the plot lately. I'm predicting he'll regain whatever he's lost once he gets home from Australia. Could probably rotate the strike well in this position with power hitters like Flintoff and KP at the other end. He can also go a bit bezerk, and end up with a run a ball score.
7. J Dalrymple - Seems to be able to biff it a bit and spins the ball decently (ODI standards). I think England need to play two spinners in ODI's fairly regularly to choke and innings and take the pressure off guys like Flintoff and Anderson.
8. P Nixon/C Read/G Jones - Take your pick. I'm not up with England's keeping stocks. Read is clearly the best glove man, Jones is neither here nor there but a better ODI batter than Read and I haven't seen much of Nixon, but he seems to be better than both Read and Jones with the bat. I'm guessing it's his experience, but I can see him doing more inventive shots and whatnot in the final overs to rotate the strike and hit into the gaps.
9. J Lewis - Could have been lucky when he bowled in England but I'm guessing the conditions will suit him more. Can swing it and be very accurate and has experience.
10. M Panesar - An attacking spinner, as everyone says. Could perhaps go for too many runs but I think he'll be able to tie it up just as well, and take wickets when he steps up a gear, so to speak.
11. C Tremlett - I'm not sure of his situation but he seems to have a very fine record in the shorter form for List A and the few ODI's he's played. Is he injury prone?

12. E Joyce - hasn't done much so far but he seems to have an alright technique. Could be mistaken, need to see more. Would replace Tresco if he's still out of consideration.
13. J Anderson - Has an alright ODI record and I liked the way he bowled at times in tests and ODI's. Seems to be in a bit of bad form, but he's just come back from injury IIRC. Swap him in for Tremlett if Tremlett's unfit.
14. L Plunkett - Reminds me of James Franklin, slightly. Has potential with both bat and ball but will need to do a lot of work with confidence and bowling accurate, especially in death overs.
15. S Broad - The future of Englands fast bowling?


My knowledge of English cricketers outside of the test team isn't that good, as you can see.

 

[PhoenixFire]

Martin-Jenkins?

I know his dad can commentate but that's no reason to pick him, we might as well pick David Leatherdale if we pick him.

Lol @ David Leatherdale

 

[Neil Pickup]

Geg - Tremlett has an injury record reminiscent of Bruce Reid.

 

[Neil Pickup]

How would I pick the England team after the World Cup? Out of a bloody hat.

I was going to suggest getting a list of names, an epileptic child, a set of strobe lights and a drawing pin, but your method would also suit - and it has the added bonus of not getting those NSPCC people up in arms.

 

[Bob Bamber]

1. M Trescothick - England's best ever ODI opener, IMO. Depends on how he's feeling then I guess
2. I Bell - Seems to be solid opening, and for my mind doesn't fit to well coming in later when strike needs to be constantly rotated before the slog. Seems like he'll get tied up too much then, and would be much better to free the arms opening.
3. K Pietersen - Batting at 3 might give him time to build big innings. Or he may get out for 30 off 15 before fielding restrictions are over, trying to go too fast. But I think he's matured a bit now, and won't throw his wicket away as easily.
4. R Bopara - Despite a fairly poor List A average, I think England will need to blood a new batsman in this series (he could possibly play in the CB games) and Bopara seems to be the front runner.
5. A Flintoff - Seems about right. Not too high, not too low. Just right.
6. P Collingwood - Probably one of England's best finishers in ODI's. Seems to have lost the plot lately. I'm predicting he'll regain whatever he's lost once he gets home from Australia. Could probably rotate the strike well in this position with power hitters like Flintoff and KP at the other end. He can also go a bit bezerk, and end up with a run a ball score.
7. J Dalrymple - Seems to be able to biff it a bit and spins the ball decently (ODI standards). I think England need to play two spinners in ODI's fairly regularly to choke and innings and take the pressure off guys like Flintoff and Anderson.
8. P Nixon/C Read/G Jones - Take your pick. I'm not up with England's keeping stocks. Read is clearly the best glove man, Jones is neither here nor there but a better ODI batter than Read and I haven't seen much of Nixon, but he seems to be better than both Read and Jones with the bat. I'm guessing it's his experience, but I can see him doing more inventive shots and whatnot in the final overs to rotate the strike and hit into the gaps.
9. J Lewis - Could have been lucky when he bowled in England but I'm guessing the conditions will suit him more. Can swing it and be very accurate and has experience.
10. M Panesar - An attacking spinner, as everyone says. Could perhaps go for too many runs but I think he'll be able to tie it up just as well, and take wickets when he steps up a gear, so to speak.
11. C Tremlett - I'm not sure of his situation but he seems to have a very fine record in the shorter form for List A and the few ODI's he's played. Is he injury prone?

12. E Joyce - hasn't done much so far but he seems to have an alright technique. Could be mistaken, need to see more. Would replace Tresco if he's still out of consideration.
13. J Anderson - Has an alright ODI record and I liked the way he bowled at times in tests and ODI's. Seems to be in a bit of bad form, but he's just come back from injury IIRC. Swap him in for Tremlett if Tremlett's unfit.
14. L Plunkett - Reminds me of James Franklin, slightly. Has potential with both bat and ball but will need to do a lot of work with confidence and bowling accurate, especially in death overs.
15. S Broad - The future of Englands fast bowling?


My knowledge of English cricketers outside of the test team isn't that good, as you can see.

I don't think your evaluation is that bad actually. I think If Trescothick is 'fit' then he should be playing.

I was thinking today. I don't see a England middle/lower order with Bell , Collingwood and Darlymple working. There all to defensive. Out of the three I personally would Drop Colly because he just doesn't seem to fit in the side. My problem with Bell at the top is that England want to take advantage of the powerplays at the start. And the likes of Loye would be able to do that.

I agree with you about the three bowlers. Tremlett isn't that Injury prone its just that he was out for a couple of months last summer. I think Broad would replace Lewis perfectly.

I've had some proper time to think about this now (I was bored at the end of a maths exam , and I have changed my opinions about some of my original line ups:

1) Marcus Trescothick - Sort of forgot about him when I made my first selection. If he is in the mental wellness to play then he should be in there. Providing that he will tour with the squad when they go away , otherwise no. He is a good opener capeable of getting England off to a good start.

2) Mal Loye - From what I've seen of him hes a really good batsmen. Capeable of , like Trescothick taking advantage of the powerplays of scoring quickly at the top.

3) Ian Bell - I'm a great believer in having someone who bats through in a ODI innings. And I think that Bell is the man for the job. He can accumulate runs while the other bat through.

4) Kevin Pietersen - I don't feel that Pietersen is a number four and I agree with you NZ that he might get a bit carried away. He is Englands best batsman , and needs to learn to convert 50's into bit 100's. But he is perfect for number 4.

5) Jamie Darlymple - Definatly one for the future. He's the sort of player who could dig England out of 40/3 and get them to a respectable total. He is a very good bowler too.

6) Andrew Flintoff - Not much to say really. Great player , who needs to be at number 6 to finish the innings off.

7) Dimitri Mascarenhas/Ravi Bopara - England have needed a lower order batsman who can score quickly. I'm not saying that Mascarenhas is the answer but he can bowl decent overs and he can bat. Same thing with Bopara , but would he be able to bat this low down.

8) Chris Read - Ok I did say Batty earlier. But on reflection I think that Read could do the job for England. I'm open to suggestions like number 7. But hes a great keeper aswell.

9) Chris Tremlett - For me this should be a no contest. Hes such a tall bowler he should be given a decent run in the side. Can bat too.

10) Jon Lewis ... Stuart Broad - Lewis has got some years in him yet. And I think that Broad maybe needs one more year. Both very good bolwers. And Broad can always play along with Lewis if the selectors choose not to play Panesar in a particular match.

11) Monty Panesar - Best spinner in England , has the ability to take wickets in one day cricket. No contest really.

 

[Richard]

No, because Richard likes them, so they automatically become world beaters.

Haven't you learned that yet?

And you know that I don't "like" Loye how exactly?

Have I ever mentioned his name?

And, for that matter, have you even noticed the fact that the post you quoted from was only written as the result of a misread?

 

[Richard]

Well, first open365 said this:

...then:
... without ever stating exactly what he was taking back. Thus me making this gag in typical deadpan fashion...

Sorry, the O...K... was aimed at o365 not you.

 

[Richard]

No, they're all bits and pieces players (with the exception of Gough who doesn't even get to be rated *that* good)

They're nothing of the sort, you just don't like them.

 

[Richard]

P Collingwood - Probably one of England's best finishers in ODI's. Seems to have lost the plot lately.

The same Collingwood who averaged 27.5 in his first 66 innings and has averaged 41.53 in his most recent 15?

P Nixon/C Read/G Jones - Take your pick. I'm not up with England's keeping stocks. Read is clearly the best glove man, Jones is neither here nor there but a better ODI batter than Read and I haven't seen much of Nixon, but he seems to be better than both Read and Jones with the bat. I'm guessing it's his experience, but I can see him doing more inventive shots and whatnot in the final overs to rotate the strike and hit into the gaps.

Jones is a better ODI batsman than Read?

What have you been watching?

J Lewis - Could have been lucky when he bowled in England but I'm guessing the conditions will suit him more. Can swing it and be very accurate and has experience.

And can also be very wayward and not swing it a millimetre - in about equal measure.

 

[Richard]

I was going to suggest getting a list of names, an epileptic child, a set of strobe lights and a drawing pin, but your method would also suit - and it has the added bonus of not getting those NSPCC people up in arms.

Given that one of my mates died recently from epilepsy (swallowed tongue) that's hardly the most compassionate comment in history.

 

[Richard]

Mal Loye - From what I've seen of him hes a really good batsmen. Capeable of , like Trescothick taking advantage of the powerplays of scoring quickly at the top.

But he's 34, and will be 38 in 2011.

If he's gonna play, it has to be now!

Dimitri Mascarenhas/Ravi Bopara - England have needed a lower order batsman who can score quickly. I'm not saying that Mascarenhas is the answer but he can bowl decent overs and he can bat. Same thing with Bopara , but would he be able to bat this low down.

How on Earth can you compare Bopara and Mascarenhas? Mascarenhas is a fine bowler who can bat a little bit, Bopara's a top-order batsman who can supposedly bowl (in reality he's utterly hopeless with the ball).

Monty Panesar - Best spinner in England , has the ability to take wickets in one day cricket. No contest really.

Despite the fact that virtually no fingerspinner has ever had the ability to consistently take wickets in ODIs?

 

[marc71178]

They're nothing of the sort, you just don't like them.

No, they are precisely that - mediocre players who bat a bit and bowl a bit - as with many a player over the years who've not been good enough with either bat or ball - the likes of Irani, Clarke, ...

 

[Benny2k1]

1) Loye
2) Pothas (qualifaction pending?)
3) Bell
4) Pietersen
5) Flintoff
6) Collingwood
7) Dalrymple
8) Cork
9) Tremlett
10) Broad
11) Anderson

 

[NZTailender]

The same Collingwood who averaged 27.5 in his first 66 innings and has averaged 41.53 in his most recent 15?

So far in Australia, I mean. He began to wane in the tests and in the first ODI I just got the impression that he didn't know whether he was here not there. But I have to say, it looked as though he was batting himself in and I think he's back on the way up.

Jones is a better ODI batsman than Read?

What have you been watching?

Read - 24 ODI innings, 300 runs @ 17.64 HS 30*
Jones - 41 ODI Innings, 815 runs @ 24.69 HS 80*

But Read has the better List A record, so I'm prepared to concede that point.

And can also be very wayward and not swing it a millimetre - in about equal measure.

Haven't seen him bowl domestically so I wouldn't know, but he's been fairly woeful in this Eng vs NZ match.

 

[Richard]

No, they are precisely that - mediocre players who bat a bit and bowl a bit - as with many a player over the years who've not been good enough with either bat or ball - the likes of Irani, Clarke, ...

Bull****, RMJ and Mascarenhas bowl far more than a bit, bowling is clearly their strongest suit, you just don't like bowlers of their type, because you have the misplaced idea that wicket-taking is more important than economy in the limited-overs game.

So therefore, because of the fact that they can also bat, a bit, you classify them "bits-and-pieces players".

If Alan Mullally could bat you'd have called him something similar. And probably Adam Dale, too.

 

[Richard]

So far in Australia, I mean. He began to wane in the tests and in the first ODI I just got the impression that he didn't know whether he was here not there. But I have to say, it looked as though he was batting himself in and I think he's back on the way up.

Oh, OK - I don't generally take any notice of what happens in Tests when looking at ODIs, because I've seen countless indications of them being polar-opposites.

Read - 24 ODI innings, 300 runs @ 17.64 HS 30*
Jones - 41 ODI Innings, 815 runs @ 24.69 HS 80*

But Read has the better List A record, so I'm prepared to concede that point.

Try knocking-out substandard sides, dude...
Jones averages 20 or so (and it was 17 for a long while) when you take only ODI-standard sides.
Read has played more match-influencing innings than Jones in his career, despite a lower average.

Haven't seen him bowl domestically so I wouldn't know, but he's been fairly woeful in this Eng vs NZ match.

He's been like that all career - good game, bad game, you never know what's coming - and most people have the mis-formed impression that this depends on the pitch when I've seen him bowl a heap of rubbish in tailor-made conditions for the stereotype of his bowling.

 

[karolkarol]

Right my tuppence worth now.

Marcus Trescothick - Dependant on whether he will be back at all. If he is going to make a return to the England fold then he is a shoe in for the opening slot. If not then James Benning. He needs to iron out a few technical flaws which will be exposed badly at International level and if he can do this he could be an excellent inclusion.

Michael Vaughan - Fitness depending. If fit he should open and captain. From here he can accumulate (fingers crossed). If not fit then Andrew Strauss. Again I do not see a problem with England having an accumulator at the top of the innings complimented by the more forceful strokeplay of the other opener

Ian Bell - Dont need to say much, justs gets better.

KP - His best position in my opinion

Paul Collingwood - Not really been turning it on in the one day game recently even though his test form has been better. Now isnt that an irony for the one day specialist. If Colly doesn't fire I would replace him with Jamie Dalrymple. He is the same type of accumulative player as Colly and splits up KP and Freddie nicely.

Freddie - Again, for me his best position.

Ravi Bopara - Aggressive batsman who bowls. A bit of a golden arm this boy and he hits the ball in odd areas. Very wristy and at the moment more of a ODI man than test batsman. If it was a particularly turning track Dalrymple could potentially come in here.

Matt Prior - Right, now we get controversial. This guy impresses me. He seems to me to have a better range of scoring shots than Read (and yes Read would be his only competition in my eyes) and is a handy enough keeper. In his ODIs so far he has tended to do the Gilly role and get undone by the moving white ball up front. I think he was dumped a little unfairly without being given sufficient chance down at the normal WK position batting against the dirty soft ball at the death where Read and moreso Jones have had plenty of opportunity. I think he could do a decent job here!

Stuart Broad - The potential is oozing out of this kid. He needs exposure to International cricket ASAP and with our horrendously weak ODI team I think this the best way to get it for him. Dependant on form and pitch type Jon Lewis could also come in here, If it is a swinger of a day/pitch there is no better one day bowler in England to exploit it.

James Anderson - The enigma. Convinced that with miles under his belt and no injuries this guy can be a key bowler for England in both forms of the game.

Monty - Best English spinner bar none.

So four bowlers with Vaughan, Bopara and Colly filling in the last ten.

 

[Complicated]

I remember reading some where that there was a talented 25 year old South African batsmen who was playing in England and would qualify for them soon.

Does anyone know what his name is? And if this person would be in contention for a place?

 

[Complicated]

I think it was Jonathan Trott??...

 

[Barney Rubble]

I think it was Jonathan Trott??...

Yeah, I think that's who you have in mind. Not sure if he actually wants to play for England, that's the issue.