Great Dhoni

[Precambrian]

I may be completely wrong but I get a feeling that Dhoni is the quintessential "21st century cricketer'. He sees the game for where he thinks it is headed - with limited overs and now T-20 (and the big bucks) being the flavour of the times.

His personal stakes (financially) are huge and knows that its the shorter version that drives and fires the majorities imagination back home in India where it matters where he is concerned.

I think he is smart and shrewd and all his words and actions will show that this is the way he thinks.

He is unlike the Tendulkars, Dravids, Laras and Pontings who consider/considered that the real game was the longer version.

As I said I could be wrong (and I do hope I am) but I have a funny feeling that I am not.

That is harsh to Dhoni who has hardly shown any dip in his commitment in approach to test game so far.

 

[Precambrian]

He shouldn't have been burnt out when the time came, though. If he knew he was going to have problems playing so much cricket, he should have skipped the Kitply Cup.

How'd you know problems before they present themselves? I think he probably realised he needed an extended break only at the end of Asia cup. It's not like you plan for breaks as an Indian player. Not especially when you are Indian captain.

 

[SJS]

That is harsh to Dhoni who has hardly shown any dip in his commitment in approach to test game so far.

As I said its just a 'feeling' I get

 

[Precambrian]

A nice article by Siddharth Vaidyanathan on Dhoni's withdrawal from tests.

Seen in another light, it's a decision that can be hailed as pragmatic and brave. As the captain of a young team, Dhoni is the most important member of the one-day side. He is more dispensable in India's Test team, which has the world's most experienced batting line-up.

Having said that, he needed the rest. He has been running on empty for a few months, though he's shown little sign of it, and it's a wonder he has carried on for as long as he has without buckling. It's been a 18-month streak that's included 14 Tests, 56 ODIs, eight Twenty20 internationals, and a high-voltage IPL.

Everyone acknowledges the threat posed by player burnout but solutions are rarely offered. Players complain of too much cricket, administrators cram the schedules with cricket, players push their bodies to the limit, administrators cram schedules, players break down, and administrators continue to cram schedules. "The only time we get rest is when we get injured," chuckled an Indian fast bowler recently.

Full article here ------> http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/360416.html

 

[NUFAN]

What reduces so many debates to ludicrous levels is people painting themselves in such strong black and white corners.

So either Dhoni is God who cant do any wrong and is the greatest thing India has had since Mahatama Gandhi OR he cant do any good and must be trampled to the pavement stones for the very act of breathing.

If we just removed those thick coats of black and white from ourselves we would be so much better able to appreciate him as a cricketer and as a person.

He is not a great keeper, he is not a great batsman AND he is perfectly entitled to taking a break when HIS body tells him he needs one and he does not have to follow any 'norms' (as if any such existed) set by others as and when they did or did not take THEIR breaks.

I think you are overacting with this post, I don't think of him as either of these two things, I just don't think he should be considered Test Captain at the moment, if he's seen as the quintessential "21st century cricketer' who figures taking a break cause he's tired for an entire Test Series is normal.

I would obviously pick him in India's XI next test, just not as captain.

 

[Precambrian]

Whom will you pick as captain then?

 

[Uppercut]

Whom will you pick as captain then?

^ A question I was about to bring up. Kumble's about to retire and was a poor captain anyway. Who else would you pick?


Sehwag
Gambhir
Dravid
Tendulkar
Ganguly
Laxman
Dhoni
Kumble
Harbajahan
Zaheer
Sharma

Surely, for all his faults, Dhoni is the option?

 

[pasag]

As I said last time, the real question is on the BCCI and the cricket calendar set up as to why a player is put in that situation. It's no secret these players have been playing non-stop for ages now so it was only a matter of time before this happened.

 

[Precambrian]

DITA. Dhoni is the only Alternative at the moment.

Maybe Sehwag has a point. But as I mentioned in my earlier post, that can lead to creation of two power centres and utter confusion.

 

[Uppercut]

DITA. Dhoni is the only Alternative at the moment.

Maybe Sehwag has a point. But as I mentioned in my earlier post, that can lead to creation of two power centres and utter confusion.

Sehwag in the IPL was one of the worst captains i have ever seen.

 

[Precambrian]

As I said last time, the real question is on the BCCI and the cricket calendar set up as to why a player is put in that situation. It's no secret these players have been playing non-stop for ages now so it was only a matter of time before this happened.

I think that's where the discussion should head, rather than Dhoni being pilloried (quite unnecessarily) for taking a break from the Test series.

No. of tests played had never been a problem, as India hardly ever play more than 3 tests a series (4 tests only vs Aus). The problem has been :

1. Incessant touring since WC 07 - Dhoni for example has travelled from West Indies, to Bangladesh, from there to England, back to India and then to SA for twenty t20 cup, again back to india for Aus ODIs and Pak series, then to Australia, back to Ind for SA series followed by IPL, followed by the pointless ODI tournament in Ban and Asia cup in Pakistan. Phew. Unbelievable add Sri Lanka, he toured all the test playing nations in a matter of just 18 months!!!(except NZ)
2. Huge number of ODIs India's been playing these days. Dhoni's played in 51 ODIs since WC. The highest by anyone, and he's been involved in some pointless games for Asia XI also. Such no. of games in a post WC season is way abnormal.
3. Captaincy of ODI side and vice captaincy of test side has meant that his presence is now mandatory in the team. Esp in the ODIs. This coupled with the lack of sufficient backup, has led him to strain himself unduly
4. Revamped new Indian ODI team and failure of Yuvraj Singh has meant that Dhoni as a batsman has to take up additional batting responsibilities. He has to soak in all the pressure, as he is the captain, and has also led to his stress levels being quite high.

 

[Precambrian]

Sehwag in the IPL was one of the worst captains i have ever seen.

Even I'd agree. Sehwag imho does not possess the nous to become the Indian test captain.So that leaves only Dhoni. And he's not done a bad job either so far.

 

[SJS]

I think you are overacting with this post, I don't think of him as either of these two things, I just don't think he should be considered Test Captain at the moment, if he's seen as the quintessential "21st century cricketer' who figures taking a break cause he's tired for an entire Test Series is normal.

I would obviously pick him in India's XI next test, just not as captain.

I did not say I was referring to you. Nor did I say it was true for EVERYONE

 

[pup11]

DITA. Dhoni is the only Alternative at the moment.

Maybe Sehwag has a point. But as I mentioned in my earlier post, that can lead to creation of two power centres and utter confusion.

I'm not at all in favour of Sehwag being made the test captain, but even in case he were to be made the captain, then what is all this talk of power centres and confusion, aren't they all supposed to be playing for the same team.

 

[Precambrian]

I'm not at all in favour of Sehwag being made the test captain, but even in case he were to be made the captain, then what is all this talk of power centres and confusion, aren't they all supposed to be playing for the same team.

Dhoni captains Sehwag in ODI team alongwith the young brigade including Raina, yuvraj, Gambhir, etc all of whom have adapted to his leadership style.

Suddenly, assume Sehwag becomes captain (obv once the fab 4 and Kumble have left). The test team would consist of Sehwag captaining Dhoni, Raina, Gambhir, etc with a different leadership style.

How can there be one core team and two leaders? Even if test and one dayers are different? It is RIDICULOUS. Plus the obvious irony of reverse captaincy.

 

[honestbharani]

I don understand what the big fuss is here..


You pick the best side, and the best player from that side to be captain..


As long as Dhoni is deserving of a place in the XI, I have no qualms if he is appointed captain. He is obviously the best choice in our first choice XI as of today, leaving out the big 4 and Kumble...


And him taking a break from the test series was a very practical move. The ODI side needs him more than the test side currently... So he put the ODI team above the test team for this one instance.. Doesn't mean he doesn't give tests the same weightage he gives to ODIs...

 

[pup11]

Dhoni captains Sehwag in ODI team alongwith the young brigade including Raina, yuvraj, Gambhir, etc all of whom have adapted to his leadership style.

Suddenly, assume Sehwag becomes captain (obv once the fab 4 and Kumble have left). The test team would consist of Sehwag captaining Dhoni, Raina, Gambhir, etc with a different leadership style.

How can there be one core team and two leaders? Even if test and one dayers are different? It is RIDICULOUS. Plus the obvious irony of reverse captaincy.

As long as ego maniacs (who keep their self-interest ahead of their team' interest) are not leading any of the two sides, things can go pretty smoothly, for eg: S.Waugh was captain of the Australian test team for sometime, while Ponting was leading the Odi side, no problems crept up there.

 

[Precambrian]

As long as ego maniacs (who keep their self-interest ahead of their team' interest) are not leading any of the two sides, things can go pretty smoothly, for eg: S.Waugh was captain of the Australian test team for sometime, while Ponting was leading the Odi side, no problems crept up there.

Duh. However, Steve never had to be under the captaincy of Ponting. In case of Dhoni there is a possibility of that.

 

[pup11]

Duh. However, Steve never had to be under the captaincy of Ponting. In case of Dhoni there is a possibility of that.

I was not talking only about the Indian situation, i was generalising such a situation where there maybe two different captains, playing under each other in different formats, then there shouldn't any real problems as long as they both are willing to work together in the interest of their team.

 

[Richard]

As long as Dhoni is deserving of a place in the XI, I have no qualms if he is appointed captain.

The only doubts are whether he will continue to do such a thing. Dhoni may currently have a case for being in the XI, but it's a different matter to having ever proven himself conclusively a Test-class wicketkeeper-batsman.

If Karthik has indeed been as poor as he apparently has (and if the third-in-line continues to be Parthiv Patel) then there's no real likelihood of there ever being a better option. But if some wicketkeeper-batsman appears in a year's time and starts tearing-up like Karthik did early in his First-Class career, then the problems start to come-up again, if Dhoni is averaging in the mid-20s in Tests.