Len Hutton vs Viv Richards

[kyear2]

I voted for Viv but "very easy" does a disservice to Hutton. His resume is virtually flawless except the post-war strike rate when in actual fact he did well to adjust to a War-inflicted injury. It made him a more rigid batsman, but he was still very effective.

Hutton was very effective and a batsman I've admired for a very long time and he's in my top tier and opens in my all time XI with Barry.

Also easily doesn't mean a lot, but that Viv"s biggest strength coincides with Hutton's lone weakness.

 

[kyear2]

Wasn’t batting slowly just a norm back then?

No necessarily. Additionally, he was criticized even during his playing days for not dominating attacks that he easily should have been capable of.

But yes, he was effective even if a bit too stoic.

 

[Thala_0710]

God doesn’t play cricket, I read the Bible.

Hayden and I have seen him bat at 4 for India. So the Bible is wrong

 

[kyear2]

Fair enough. I might well have been told a myth. It's not really a big issue in tests though when you're still scoring heavily in tough conditions and against some good attacks.

38 (if I recall correctly) is pretty stoic though.

Still an amazing batsman, but if you lack the ability to adjust or dominate as necessary, that has to be seen as a negative of sorts.

Pretty sure even Luffy said that a few days ago.

 

[Johan]

Been thinking about these two, Viv was indeed more dominant of the two, but was there anyone in history of the great sport more competent when the going got tough? other than the top 2 ofc.

I feel inclined to put Hutton beside Tendulkar/Viv/Sobers, instead of behind them.

 

[kyear2]

Hutton is in general badly rated on CW tbh. There are some who inexplicably place him above Hobbs, and there are others who seemingly don't rate him at all. In my view, there's a big gap between Hutton/Sobers and all "modern" batters aside Tendulkar. They rise above their compatriots in a way that none other than Smith have achieved in the post-war period. To put Viv on that same level requires a big stretch IMO.

I wonder the degree to which opener tax is applicable to him. He did after all face the first great new-ball pairing (with success).

Who was close to Viv?

Even Tendulkar had Lara then Ponting and Kallis, who was close to IVA?

 

[ataraxia]

Who was close to Viv?

Even Tendulkar had Lara then Ponting and Kallis, who was close to IVA?

Chappell then Border.

 

[kyear2]

Been thinking about these two, Viv was indeed more dominant of the two, but was there anyone in history of the great sport more competent when the going got tough? other than the top 2 ofc.

I feel inclined to put Hutton beside Tendulkar/Viv/Sobers, instead of behind them.

I have

Bradman
Tendulkar | Richards | Sobers | Hobbs
Smith | Lara | Hutton

So no real argument from me.

My only complaint is the s/r and the inability to accelerate as required. Don't see how you can be on the top rung without it.

 

[kyear2]

Chappell then Border.

As great as Chappell was, don't think anyone believed he rivalled for Viv for the top spot.

Border was tough as nails, Lara and and Punter were closer to Tendulkar then and overall than Border is to Viv. Not even in the same tier.

 

[ataraxia]

As great as Chappell was, don't think anyone believed he rivalled for Viv for the top spot.

Border was rough as nails, Lara and and Punter were closer to Tendulkar then and overall than Border is to Viv. Not even in the same tier.

That's a big stretch IMO.

 

[kyear2]

That's a big stretch IMO.

Which part of it?

 

[subshakerz]

My only complaint is the s/r and the inability to accelerate as required. Don't see how you can be on the top rung without it.

Hutton should get special allowance for s/r given he was an opener.

 

[kyear2]

Hutton should get special allowance for s/r given he was an opener.

Fair point.

But mid 30's is still a bit low.

At the end of the day not questioning the greatness of the man.

 

[PlayerComparisons]

I think most batsmen generally scored slower in Hutton era anyways. If he played in the modern era, he’d probably score faster.

 

[capt_Luffy]

I think most batsmen generally scored slower in Hutton era anyways. If he played post 1975, he’d probably score faster.

If my English opener in uncovered pitches is scoring 56 runs on average; first of I would be eternally grateful, but also will prefer him to play as many balls as possible.

 

[kyear2]

I think most batsmen generally scored slower in Hutton era anyways. If he played in the modern era, he’d probably score faster.

Again, he also faced criticism even in his own era for his rate of scoring.

I don't recall the exact wording, but there was an article speaking directly to that, that he merely "again can't recall the exact phrasing" against attacks that he should have dominated.
He lacked either the ability or desire to put his foot on the accelerator.

But Hain, he overcame and accomplished so much that I still rate him in that top 8 elite tier of guys.

 

[DrWolverine]

I still rate him in that top 8 elite tier of guys.

Barry Richards
Don Bradman
Jack Hobbs
Gary Sobers
Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Sachin Tendulkar
Steven Smith

Is this your top 8?

 

[kyear2]

Barry Richards
Don Bradman
Jack Hobbs
Gary Sobers
Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Sachin Tendulkar
Steven Smith

Is this your top 8?

Bradman
Tendulkar
Richards
Sobers
Hobbs
Smith
Lara
Hutton


Richards is next .

 

[sayon basak]

Barry Richards
Don Bradman
Jack Hobbs
Gary Sobers
Viv Richards
Brian Lara
Sachin Tendulkar
Steven Smith

Is this your top 8?

You really thought he rates Barry ahead of Don? Hilarious!

 

[Johan]

I have

Bradman
Tendulkar | Richards | Sobers | Hobbs
Smith | Lara | Hutton

So no real argument from me.

My only complaint is the s/r and the inability to accelerate as required. Don't see how you can be on the top rung without it.

Imo Hutton is just a class apart on tough wickets, probably the GOAT on them (bar top 2) and a level above the others imo, but then again, Hutton's weakness is Viv's strength. feel like I rate Hutton equals with Tendulkar/Viv/Sobers now.