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*OFFICIAL* England in Pakistan 2024

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Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Worked out okay for England

Pakistan might regret dawdling along in the last session
 
Nintendo

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
PaulLennon said:
Favourable scheduling where he played either at home in flat conditions or weaker teams away.

4 matches you are quoting is a very small sample size. And England his highest was a 60-something odd. And in those 4 matches others scored way more runs than him.

Prior to that was poor in SA. And then was poor again once they started touring abroad again.

And I'm not talking about just Pak batsman but batsmen from all sides.

Eng 2022 Harry Brook was better. Aus 2022 Khawaja was better. Might be some other guys. Aus 2019 Warner was better as well. Eng 2020 Crawley was better.

He has never had a series against a good test team where he was the best batsman on display.

His runs are either against
1) weak teams
2) strong teams on flat wickets where other batsmen outscored him

He has nothing like Smith in Ind 2017, Eng 2019
Kohli in SA 2018, Eng 2018
Williamson in Aus 2015
Root at home vs Ind 2021
Even Pujara in Aus 2018

Basically dominate a series against a very good bowling attack.
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He didnt have 4 good away tests. He averaged 48 away for 15 straight tests over a 5 year span. In that period he's got the 3rd most runs of anyone (root and marnus) while averaging more then those two with a better away average.

You can't just stat by check-list away that run of form. He also didn't play "weak away sides due to scheduling." Australia where full strength in 2019, pretty sure broad and Anderson both played when he toured ENG. SL attack was pretty good aswell from memory (could be wrong on that).
 
PaulLennon

PaulLennon

U19 Vice-Captain
Nintendo said:
He didnt have 4 good away tests. He averaged 48 away for 15 straight tests over a 5 year span. In that period he's got the 3rd most runs of anyone (root and marnus) while averaging more then those two with a better away average.

You can't just stat by check-list away that run of form. He also didn't play "weak away sides due to scheduling." Australia where full strength in 2019, pretty sure broad and Anderson both played when he toured ENG. SL attack was pretty good aswell from memory (could be wrong on that).
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Like I said. 4 away tests against "good" sides.

Aus/Eng away and SL/WI/Bang away are not the same thing, especially for an Asian player.

I had specifically mentioned

1. weak teams

2. strong teams on flatter pitches where he was not the best batsman on show

2019 Aus and 2020 Eng fall in category 2.

In that 2019 series Warner had 489 runs @ 489, Labu had 347 @ 173.5.

Babar had 210 @ 52.5 which is not far off from Yasir Shah's 194 @ 48.5.

In the 2020 series against Eng, Crawley had 320 @ 160, Buttler had 265 @ 88.3, Azhar Ali had 210 @ 52.5, Babar had 195 @ 48.75

Babar is a good batsman, mind you but he's not ATG level.

He is a decent batsman who had a good run of form and now he is declining.

I mean, from 2013-19 Rahane had a run of 36 away tests where he averaged 46.76 with 7 centuries (3 in SENA)

2015-19 Pujara had a run of 20 away tests where he averaged 47.58 with 7 centuries (4 in SENA)

Pakistan's own Azhar Ali averaged 48.5 with 4 centuries in 12 away tests from 2016-18.

Babar is on that level or below.
 
Nintendo

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
PaulLennon said:
Like I said. 4 away tests against "good" sides.

Aus/Eng away and SL/WI/Bang away are not the same thing, especially for an Asian player.

I had specifically mentioned

1. weak teams

2. strong teams on flatter pitches where he was not the best batsman on show

2019 Aus and 2020 Eng fall in category 2.

In that 2019 series Warner had 489 runs @ 489, Labu had 347 @ 173.5.

Babar had 210 @ 52.5 which is not far off from Yasir Shah's 194 @ 48.5.

In the 2020 series against Eng, Crawley had 320 @ 160, Buttler had 265 @ 88.3, Azhar Ali had 210 @ 52.5, Babar had 195 @ 48.75

Babar is a good batsman, mind you but he's not ATG level.

He is a decent batsman who had a good run of form and now he is declining.

I mean, from 2013-19 Rahane had a run of 36 away tests where he averaged 46.76 with 7 centuries (3 in SENA)

2015-19 Pujara had a run of 20 away tests where he averaged 47.58 with 7 centuries (4 in SENA)

Pakistan's own Azhar Ali averaged 48.5 with 4 centuries in 12 away tests from 2016-18.

Babar is on that level or below.
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What point are you trying to prove here? My argument is really simple. Between 2018 and 2023 babar was right up there for the best test batsmen in the world. I'm not saying he's better than kohli. I'm not trying to compare him to pujara in a different time period. I'm not comparing him to Crawley, who outside that pak series averaged like 25 before. Babar had a sustained 5 year peak where he was phenomenal, home and away. Bringing up yasir shah slogging his way to a 100 where he got dropped a million times doesnt discredit babar averaging 50 against full strength AUS, or making runs against broad and Anderson in England.
 
PaulLennon

PaulLennon

U19 Vice-Captain
Nintendo said:
What point are you trying to prove here? My argument is really simple. Between 2018 and 2023 babar was right up there for the best test batsmen in the world. I'm not saying he's better than kohli. I'm not trying to compare him to pujara in a different time period. I'm not comparing him to Crawley, who outside that pak series averaged like 25 before. Babar had a sustained 5 year peak where he was phenomenal, home and away. Bringing up yasir shah slogging his way to a 100 where he got dropped a million times doesnt discredit babar averaging 50 against full strength AUS, or making runs against broad and Anderson in England.
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The point I'm saying is goodish players like Rahane, Pujara, Azhar Ali have these 4-5 year phases where they are real good before falling away. Rizwan right now is in the middle of such a phase.

Babar Azam too had that phase and now is falling away.

Even players like Ganguly, Ian Bell etc had that. At their peak they average late 40s, nearly touching 50 and then end up with a 41-42 average. Same thing is happening with Babar.

He is not in that A-tier list who have dominance for more than decade.

The assumption that he is an A-tier player going through a bad patch (like say Root did or Sachin did between 03-07) is wrong. He is a goodish player whose purple patch is done. Even in that 5 year peak he never really dominated an attack in a series and was more of a consistent dependable player.
 
Spark

Spark

Global Moderator
Naseem Shah must have seriously worked on his batting because when he first came to Tests he looked like he'd barely picked up a bat before in his life.
 
Nintendo

Nintendo

Cricketer Of The Year
Spark said:
Naseem Shah must have seriously worked on his batting because when he first came to Tests he looked like he'd barely picked up a bat before in his life.
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Been at this level for a while, think he may have worked on his batting while injured around 2020. He faced like 70 balls with babar in Sri Lanka a few years back and there's been a few times where he's boshed a few 6's in t20 games. Ruined AFG fans hopes with the bat a few times.
 
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