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New Zealand doom and gloom thread
- Thread starter Bahnz
- Start date
thundaboult
International Debutant
Accurately captured in this post is what I assume most NZC fans are feeling. Yes we are bad, when the talent is at an all time high level....but the phrases "lack of identity", "boring as s**t", and "devoid of ideas/energy" come to mind first. Its a book with no context. We don't attack, we have no intent to impose ourselves on the opp and put pressure, letting go of winnable situations like you have said already. Its the same little ol nz punch above our weight syndrome when we have possessed talent that belongs in the top 4 of all countries in the last 10 years. A heavyweight side acting like an underdog ffs. That too with cricket having 1 or 2 major tournaments EACH year those last 10 years. What a time period it was for us to bring home not just 1 trophy but multiple.
The mccullum side from 14 to 16....I had no idea I would miss it AS MUCH as i do today. The catchy phrases and buzzwords were rejuvenating and cheesy, but they made me feel something positive about the side. Whether it was to get excited about them coming out guns blazing or having a laugh. Don't really feel any of that attachment to this side currently.
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The lack of accountability is the thing that gets me.
Not enough guys in this side give enough of a ****.
Stead just wants to keep his job. The **** he said about not being able to win every game, that was him to a tee. Not a winner, happy to live off the WTC and T20 finals 3 years ago.
Southee wants Sir Richard's 431 and cricket is all he knows. Another turgid, BS presser from him after the second test.
Daryl Mitchell's comment about it not being about the results gives an apt insight into how this side feels. It doesn't care that much about being what it was, so long as we win the odd one with a style that feels cool and we don't have to work too hard. 350 in the second dig following on 500 behind? Good for us! Sri Lanka is hard, that's a positive for us.
The guys who are performing are the guys who give the most of a **** - O'Rourke, Phillips, Ajaz, Ravindra. The rest are coasting along on reputation, in the knowledge they won't be dropped. Any interest in getting to India early and working so hard to do something an NZ team has never (?) done? Nah. Some of us are tired from playing for the Calgary Canucks and need a break.
The worst thing as a fan is when you know your beloved team really doesn't give much of a ****. Then you know there's nothing good ahead
Not enough guys in this side give enough of a ****.
Stead just wants to keep his job. The **** he said about not being able to win every game, that was him to a tee. Not a winner, happy to live off the WTC and T20 finals 3 years ago.
Southee wants Sir Richard's 431 and cricket is all he knows. Another turgid, BS presser from him after the second test.
Daryl Mitchell's comment about it not being about the results gives an apt insight into how this side feels. It doesn't care that much about being what it was, so long as we win the odd one with a style that feels cool and we don't have to work too hard. 350 in the second dig following on 500 behind? Good for us! Sri Lanka is hard, that's a positive for us.
The guys who are performing are the guys who give the most of a **** - O'Rourke, Phillips, Ajaz, Ravindra. The rest are coasting along on reputation, in the knowledge they won't be dropped. Any interest in getting to India early and working so hard to do something an NZ team has never (?) done? Nah. Some of us are tired from playing for the Calgary Canucks and need a break.
The worst thing as a fan is when you know your beloved team really doesn't give much of a ****. Then you know there's nothing good ahead
The next step from here is getting people into this environment that care. Yeah they need to have ability and skill, whether they coach or play, but it's meaningless unless they're people who want playing for NZ to mean something.
Andre Adams is a great name people are throwing up. He gives a ****. Disillusioned by NZC over the years and could probably just as happily not do it, and you've got to be prepared to have hard conversations to have him involved...but you get a guy who is there every day to win.
I've copped **** over the years (overseas posters) about my admiration for Baz but what you always got was a guy who gave a **** about every moment contributing to something. That fans are owed a team they can be proud of. Players should want to be the best version of themselves. Everyone in the environment should be held accountable for giving their best to the cause
Andre Adams is a great name people are throwing up. He gives a ****. Disillusioned by NZC over the years and could probably just as happily not do it, and you've got to be prepared to have hard conversations to have him involved...but you get a guy who is there every day to win.
I've copped **** over the years (overseas posters) about my admiration for Baz but what you always got was a guy who gave a **** about every moment contributing to something. That fans are owed a team they can be proud of. Players should want to be the best version of themselves. Everyone in the environment should be held accountable for giving their best to the cause
Last part of my diatribe...the 2026-27 Australian Test tour really looks like it is coming at the worst time, for so many reasons.
Guys like Southee, and the other 32 year plus guys (Conway Blundell Latham etc) very likely will hold on for dear life to get there. Then, that may hold back guys like Hay, Sears, Mariu/Heaphy, when moving onto the next generation is our best bet.
Then we get there with aging guys who are already losing form now, and come out the other side with them gone, and the next wave not sufficiently exposed and ready.
Again, be very aware that Gary Stead gives no ****s about this. N
Guys like Southee, and the other 32 year plus guys (Conway Blundell Latham etc) very likely will hold on for dear life to get there. Then, that may hold back guys like Hay, Sears, Mariu/Heaphy, when moving onto the next generation is our best bet.
Then we get there with aging guys who are already losing form now, and come out the other side with them gone, and the next wave not sufficiently exposed and ready.
Again, be very aware that Gary Stead gives no ****s about this. N
NZTailender
I can't believe I ate the whole thing
Smithy’s Sermon: Time for Stead to make the big call and drop Southee as Blackcaps Test captain
After an unchanged XI was embarrassed by Sri Lanka, the Blackcaps face India next.
www.sen.com.au
RossTaylorsBox
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Lol, the "big call" isn't even dropping him completely, it's just not making him captain.
Fuller Pilch
Hall of Fame Member
Fine if he is in the squad as the 4th seamer option to give advice.
jcas0167
International Regular
Is there some alternative version of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory where Augustus Gloop is a hero?
NZ's little shop of horrors prompts uncomfortable questions
When you've had it as good as New Zealand have had it for so long, letting go is hard. But things change, and the world moves onwww.espncricinfo.com
RossTaylorsBox
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Lmao
thierry henry
International Coach
Vettori was also a consistent non-succeeder as a player and a captain, the epitome of the "I'm Punching Above My Weight as an individual so please don't look closely at whether I'm helping my team win anything" NZ cricketer. Last guy we need.
Moss
International Captain
This one line is exactly it. Somehow the stability that Hesson-McCullum brought in, giving players a long run before taking calls on changes, has morphed into a refusal to deviate even slightly from script. Even in the earlier era they were not averse to making tactical changes depending on the conditions (McCullum opening in the UAE, Ronchi as specialist bat in India, playing three spinners and shocking India in the 2016 T20 WC). But it’s not just the players or selections, when batsmen get out in the same ways and fielders /bowlers arent making strides, got to ask questions of coaching as well.
I don't agree with this as a player at all, but he is an awful head coach. That's why he hasn't got cushy IPL jobs and is doing a bowling coach role with Australia. Far too aloof and 'im with the cool kids only' vibe to be in charge
Absolutely. Honestly, we're being run like a Last Man Standing team at the minute. Same couple of guys contributing (unless we're playing a dud team), no accountability on selection, accentuate the positives even in huge losses, bosh a few sixes, and....
We have no coach.
Until we get people in positions of power with true professionalism, desire to get better, willingness to have hard conversations and do the work in the dirt to improve our outcomes, this thread will remain on the front page. We're not a nation that has the resources to coast along on talent.
What's Justin Langer up to? Id have that guy tomorrow. He gives a ****. Won't do much for fragile egos, but he brings the sort of culture we desperately need. And I bet he'd be keen to put one back on his former side in 2026-27?
Silver Silva
International Regular
What about Fleming
He doesn't want the main job. He can earn plenty by working a few weeks a year, and good luck to him. Id definitely welcome him as T20 coach if the ICC can ever get their international v franchise windows rights
thundaboult
International Debutant
You either die a hero or live long enough to become a villain. Please retire now Tim.
centurymaker
Cricketer Of The Year
He will be dropped from the playing XI soon. Another 1 or 2 bad performances and yeah.
It's just a weird, poorly managed situation. I would actually argue nothing has been solved, and potentially even more problems are faced with this decision.
Southee is actually a better captain than Latham.
Latham isn't exactly holding his spot tightly either - no arguments that he's more ensconced in the side than Southee, but only through lack of competition.
If Southee doesn't play the first Test in India, it is a clear, too late admission that he only played in Sri Lanka over Henry because of the c. But Stead gave himself the opportunity to not play Southee before this tour by saying he wouldn't play every game.
And what has led to this? Did Southee say to Stead I'm no good as captain, I want to focus on being a player? Did Stead take it off him (and what reasons did he give?) Does Stead want to drop him? Does he think Latham is a better captain?
I don't think anything has moved forward with this decision. It feels PR based more than anything
Southee is actually a better captain than Latham.
Latham isn't exactly holding his spot tightly either - no arguments that he's more ensconced in the side than Southee, but only through lack of competition.
If Southee doesn't play the first Test in India, it is a clear, too late admission that he only played in Sri Lanka over Henry because of the c. But Stead gave himself the opportunity to not play Southee before this tour by saying he wouldn't play every game.
And what has led to this? Did Southee say to Stead I'm no good as captain, I want to focus on being a player? Did Stead take it off him (and what reasons did he give?) Does Stead want to drop him? Does he think Latham is a better captain?
I don't think anything has moved forward with this decision. It feels PR based more than anything