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New Zealand doom and gloom thread

thundaboult

thundaboult

International Debutant
Moss said:
I dont think I’ve ever been so disappointed with New Zealand cricket. There have been some low phases before - the centenary season in 1995 was bleak, in 2008-11 we put out some pretty bad sides, but I never felt less than completely invested. Here, the current team is a capable side playing very badly. We’ve been served some real horse manure this year, whether its misreading spin-friendly conditions at home (Dane Peidt and South Africa’s B team gave NZ a real scare, then the Lyon ambush at the Basin), surrendering good positions in winnable tests vs Aus and SL, and the WT20 first round exit after putting a lot of eggs in the T20 basket. Guys like Ravindra and O’Rourke have shown that newer players can make the step-up, the T20 series against Pakistan showed that the cupboard isn’t that bare.

I get that there are a number of good reasons for these results, but it does feel as if everyone in the setup was completely satisfied after that WTC win in 2021 and as long as the home results and WC semifinal appearances came along all was well. Now we’re at a stage where there’s a rare window before the tour to India, and no effort made to have warm ups etc (this after it clear prep was an issue for the T20 WC.). The same mistakes are being made with regard to planning and on the field.

But more to the point, watching the side now feels like a chore, everything from the selection to the lack of preparation to the eventual outcomes is getting too predictable.
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Accurately captured in this post is what I assume most NZC fans are feeling. Yes we are bad, when the talent is at an all time high level....but the phrases "lack of identity", "boring as s**t", and "devoid of ideas/energy" come to mind first. Its a book with no context. We don't attack, we have no intent to impose ourselves on the opp and put pressure, letting go of winnable situations like you have said already. Its the same little ol nz punch above our weight syndrome when we have possessed talent that belongs in the top 4 of all countries in the last 10 years. A heavyweight side acting like an underdog ffs. That too with cricket having 1 or 2 major tournaments EACH year those last 10 years. What a time period it was for us to bring home not just 1 trophy but multiple.

The mccullum side from 14 to 16....I had no idea I would miss it AS MUCH as i do today. The catchy phrases and buzzwords were rejuvenating and cheesy, but they made me feel something positive about the side. Whether it was to get excited about them coming out guns blazing or having a laugh. Don't really feel any of that attachment to this side currently.
 
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S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
The lack of accountability is the thing that gets me.

Not enough guys in this side give enough of a ****.

Stead just wants to keep his job. The **** he said about not being able to win every game, that was him to a tee. Not a winner, happy to live off the WTC and T20 finals 3 years ago.

Southee wants Sir Richard's 431 and cricket is all he knows. Another turgid, BS presser from him after the second test.

Daryl Mitchell's comment about it not being about the results gives an apt insight into how this side feels. It doesn't care that much about being what it was, so long as we win the odd one with a style that feels cool and we don't have to work too hard. 350 in the second dig following on 500 behind? Good for us! Sri Lanka is hard, that's a positive for us.

The guys who are performing are the guys who give the most of a **** - O'Rourke, Phillips, Ajaz, Ravindra. The rest are coasting along on reputation, in the knowledge they won't be dropped. Any interest in getting to India early and working so hard to do something an NZ team has never (?) done? Nah. Some of us are tired from playing for the Calgary Canucks and need a break.

The worst thing as a fan is when you know your beloved team really doesn't give much of a ****. Then you know there's nothing good ahead
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
The next step from here is getting people into this environment that care. Yeah they need to have ability and skill, whether they coach or play, but it's meaningless unless they're people who want playing for NZ to mean something.

Andre Adams is a great name people are throwing up. He gives a ****. Disillusioned by NZC over the years and could probably just as happily not do it, and you've got to be prepared to have hard conversations to have him involved...but you get a guy who is there every day to win.

I've copped **** over the years (overseas posters) about my admiration for Baz but what you always got was a guy who gave a **** about every moment contributing to something. That fans are owed a team they can be proud of. Players should want to be the best version of themselves. Everyone in the environment should be held accountable for giving their best to the cause
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Last part of my diatribe...the 2026-27 Australian Test tour really looks like it is coming at the worst time, for so many reasons.

Guys like Southee, and the other 32 year plus guys (Conway Blundell Latham etc) very likely will hold on for dear life to get there. Then, that may hold back guys like Hay, Sears, Mariu/Heaphy, when moving onto the next generation is our best bet.

Then we get there with aging guys who are already losing form now, and come out the other side with them gone, and the next wave not sufficiently exposed and ready.

Again, be very aware that Gary Stead gives no ****s about this. N
 
jcas0167

jcas0167

International Debutant
FBU said:
www.espncricinfo.com

NZ's little shop of horrors prompts uncomfortable questions

When you've had it as good as New Zealand have had it for so long, letting go is hard. But things change, and the world moves on
www.espncricinfo.com www.espncricinfo.com
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Is there some alternative version of Charlie and the Chocolate Factory where Augustus Gloop is a hero?

You wonder if this New Zealand team are that heroic character about to meet their end after years of triumph. Jedi Obi-Wan Kenobi facing down Darth Vader in the Death Star. Warrior Boromir falling from many arrow wounds while cutting down dozens of orcs. Augustus Gloop getting sucked into the Wonka factory pipe while drinking from the chocolate river.
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Moss

Moss

International Vice-Captain
SteveNZ said:
The lack of accountability is the thing that gets me.

Not enough guys in this side give enough of a ****.

Stead just wants to keep his job. The **** he said about not being able to win every game, that was him to a tee. Not a winner, happy to live off the WTC and T20 finals 3 years ago.

Southee wants Sir Richard's 431 and cricket is all he knows. Another turgid, BS presser from him after the second test.

Daryl Mitchell's comment about it not being about the results gives an apt insight into how this side feels. It doesn't care that much about being what it was, so long as we win the odd one with a style that feels cool and we don't have to work too hard. 350 in the second dig following on 500 behind? Good for us! Sri Lanka is hard, that's a positive for us.

The guys who are performing are the guys who give the most of a **** - O'Rourke, Phillips, Ajaz, Ravindra. The rest are coasting along on reputation, in the knowledge they won't be dropped. Any interest in getting to India early and working so hard to do something an NZ team has never (?) done? Nah. Some of us are tired from playing for the Calgary Canucks and need a break.

The worst thing as a fan is when you know your beloved team really doesn't give much of a ****. Then you know there's nothing good ahead
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This one line is exactly it. Somehow the stability that Hesson-McCullum brought in, giving players a long run before taking calls on changes, has morphed into a refusal to deviate even slightly from script. Even in the earlier era they were not averse to making tactical changes depending on the conditions (McCullum opening in the UAE, Ronchi as specialist bat in India, playing three spinners and shocking India in the 2016 T20 WC). But it’s not just the players or selections, when batsmen get out in the same ways and fielders /bowlers arent making strides, got to ask questions of coaching as well.
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
thierry henry said:
Vettori was also a consistent non-succeeder as a player and a captain, the epitome of the "I'm Punching Above My Weight as an individual so please don't look closely at whether I'm helping my team win anything" NZ cricketer. Last guy we need.
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I don't agree with this as a player at all, but he is an awful head coach. That's why he hasn't got cushy IPL jobs and is doing a bowling coach role with Australia. Far too aloof and 'im with the cool kids only' vibe to be in charge
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
Moss said:
This one line is exactly it. Somehow the stability that Hesson-McCullum brought in, giving players a long run before taking calls on changes, has morphed into a refusal to deviate even slightly from script. Even in the earlier era they were not averse to making tactical changes depending on the conditions (McCullum opening in the UAE, Ronchi as specialist bat in India, playing three spinners and shocking India in the 2016 T20 WC). But it’s not just the players or selections, when batsmen get out in the same ways and fielders /bowlers arent making strides, got to ask questions of coaching as well.
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Absolutely. Honestly, we're being run like a Last Man Standing team at the minute. Same couple of guys contributing (unless we're playing a dud team), no accountability on selection, accentuate the positives even in huge losses, bosh a few sixes, and....

We have no coach.

Until we get people in positions of power with true professionalism, desire to get better, willingness to have hard conversations and do the work in the dirt to improve our outcomes, this thread will remain on the front page. We're not a nation that has the resources to coast along on talent.

What's Justin Langer up to? Id have that guy tomorrow. He gives a ****. Won't do much for fragile egos, but he brings the sort of culture we desperately need. And I bet he'd be keen to put one back on his former side in 2026-27?
 
Silver Silva

Silver Silva

International Regular
SteveNZ said:
Absolutely. Honestly, we're being run like a Last Man Standing team at the minute. Same couple of guys contributing (unless we're playing a dud team), no accountability on selection, accentuate the positives even in huge losses, bosh a few sixes, and....

We have no coach.

Until we get people in positions of power with true professionalism, desire to get better, willingness to have hard conversations and do the work in the dirt to improve our outcomes, this thread will remain on the front page. We're not a nation that has the resources to coast along on talent.

What's Justin Langer up to? Id have that guy tomorrow. He gives a ****. Won't do much for fragile egos, but he brings the sort of culture we desperately need. And I bet he'd be keen to put one back on his former side in 2026-27?
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What about Fleming
 
S

SteveNZ

Cricketer Of The Year
It's just a weird, poorly managed situation. I would actually argue nothing has been solved, and potentially even more problems are faced with this decision.

Southee is actually a better captain than Latham.

Latham isn't exactly holding his spot tightly either - no arguments that he's more ensconced in the side than Southee, but only through lack of competition.

If Southee doesn't play the first Test in India, it is a clear, too late admission that he only played in Sri Lanka over Henry because of the c. But Stead gave himself the opportunity to not play Southee before this tour by saying he wouldn't play every game.

And what has led to this? Did Southee say to Stead I'm no good as captain, I want to focus on being a player? Did Stead take it off him (and what reasons did he give?) Does Stead want to drop him? Does he think Latham is a better captain?

I don't think anything has moved forward with this decision. It feels PR based more than anything
 
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