subshakerz
International Coach
He is. Better in SA, Aus and Eng as far as match impact is concerned. Can't really compare in NZ.
Ashwin only exceeds Kumble in spin conditions or WI.
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Ashwin vs Kumble
- Thread starter ma1978
- Start date
Ashwin only exceeds Kumble in spin conditions or WI.
He isn't. Context suggests otherwise given that Ashwin doesn't have to carry the load as much post 2015, and Kumble for the large part was essentially overbowled and so statpadded. I don't think Kumble would've a much better record in SENA Tests that Ashwin has played in. As usual, you don't have anything to add here.
subshakerz
International Coach
In Aus, Kumble took 44 wickets in 7 tests against an ATG side in the 2000s, which exceeds anything Ashwin has done in the past two tours
In Eng, Kumble had an important contributing hand in two test victories in 2002 and 2007. Ashwin had minimal impact overall.
In SA, Ashwin has been a complete flop whereas Kumble has a few penetrative spells.
OverratedSanity
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Christ alive you never get tired do you
Calm_profit
State Vice-Captain
Kumble as a bowler,even if Ashwin retires with better average and more wickets.
As a player Ashwin.
As a player Ashwin.
Arachnodouche
International Captain
*Christ crucified
OverratedSanity
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Hmm interesting. Where is this "impact" and "contribution to winning" argument when it comes to their performance in Australia .
Suspicious change of criteria there.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
I almost want to give Subz credit, because yes, Kumble is better in SENA; but the idea that Ashwin hasn't done enough at home to be better is pretty baffling.
subshakerz
International Coach
In England, neither Kumble or Ashwin have spectacular returns, Kumbles role in the victories just gives him in the edge.Hmm interesting. Where is this "impact" and "contribution to winning" argument when it comes to their performance in Australia .
Suspicious change of criteria there.
Whereas in Aus, Kumble has two straight series of high volume of wickets against a top quality side which exceeds the contribution role of Ashwin in a couple of test wins.
subshakerz
International Coach
Because I think with DRS and the same wickets, Kumble would nearly match Ashwins returns. I do consider Ashwin a better home bowler but not by that margin. I can't accept someone as a better bowler with this level of away drop off.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
It's honesty like saying, "had Venkatpaty Raju got stickies like Laker, he could had been better". Not saying it isn't a possibility, but too much of a hyperbole in place of real performance.
Again, none of this is proof of anything. Posting this while basically ignoring the past couple of pages of discussion on pitches is incredibly useless. It shows you aren't here for a discussion, just personal validation because you're subshakerz, not because you have anything worthwhile to share.
subshakerz
International Coach
Both Kumble and Ashwin are mediocre overall in SENA but judging touring spinners by just averages there is insufficient.
Calm_profit
State Vice-Captain
Neither Ashwin away average gives an advantage over Kumble despite the fact Kumble bowled in flat pitches.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
To Kumble's credit, irrespective of average, his last two tours of Australia were pretty good. I will actually call the 2005 one ATG as well, given how flat and high scoring it was. Pretty equal in England with slight advantage to Ashwin and slight advantage in SA to Kumble for having a few moments.
subshakerz
International Coach
Well Kumble in the 90s when wickets were sporting took 5 wickets a game at a similar average. I think adding a touch better wickets, batsmen with poor T20 techniques and DRS would put him in Ashwin range. I saw Kumble and once on a roll, he was incredibly hard to face at home.
subshakerz
International Coach
Why slight advantage to Ashwin in Eng if Kumble actually helped in wins there?
OverratedSanity
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Honestly I think this flat pitch BS is really overplayed. Kumble got a ****ton of real turners at home (especially in the 90s) until the early 2000s. It's only in the last 4-5 years where he bowled on consistently flat decks.
Also the pitches Ashwin has bowled on overseas these days have overall been waaaaaayyy worse for spin than in kumbles time where there were occasional dry pitches everywhere and test matches went the full 5 days much more often which allowed spinners to come into the game. Pretty ridiculous that this gets ignored and the focus is only on their respective home pitches.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
Because for plenty of times, he was useless. Ashwin was good at keeping things tight. Those few contributions in wins is the reason the advantage is slight.