*Official* England in India 2023/24 #CryMoreTour

[Burgey]

Don't qualify because they don't win enough proportion of matches. In the last round, only Aus (11) won more than England (10).

Yeah, they didn't win enough matches...

 

[mackembhoy]

That and they won a bunch of Test series home (unbeaten) and away (Pak, SL, Eng). Anyone who doesn't think that was well deserved can suck it.

Nope that didn't happen. This is their series that helped them get to the final.

Basically rubbish away and dominated against sides you'd expect them to beat at home.

Ind H W (2-0)
Pak H W (2-0)
WI H W (2-0)
Sri A D (1-1)
Aus A L (3-0)

 

[Burgey]

Nope that didn't happen. This is their series that helped them get to the final.

Basically rubbish away and dominated against sides you'd expect them to beat at home.

Ind H W(2-0)
Pak H W (2-0)
WI H W (2-0)
Sri A D (1-1)
Aus A L (3-0)

Most teams are ordinary away from home these days tbf.

Some do well at neutral venues though.

 

[R!TTER]

Mate I didn't think you're very bright and you've confirmed it for me.

As compared to someone who's pretending to ignore why England is not neutral? How about you come back with actual logic instead trying to blow off your fuse on why your last win over there was glorious & all.

should just accept you're being ridiculous because your side was beaten twice.

What's there not to accept - we were beaten, that's the end! But it's funny Aussies (or Kiwis) trying to undermine the huge advantage Eng gave NZ or Oz against an Asian side. Talk about living in ****oo land.

Home or away away (home of opposition) or neutral venue

On continent Asia

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2010

Totals in terms of batting team

Ordered by win/loss ratio (descending)

Overall figures

New Zealand	2010-2023	26	6	12	0	8	0.500	29.55	3.01	49	690	62
Australia	2010-2023	31	6	18	0	7	0.333	28.30	2.97	60	556	91

 

[Starfighter]

All England need to do to have a shot at the WTC final is:

a) win more matches
and
b) in 6 1/2 hours bowl 90 overs, minus allowances for DRS etc.

Simples.

 

[mackembhoy]

All England need to do to have a shot at the WTC final is:

a) win more matches
and
b) in 6 1/2 hours bowl 90 overs, minus allowances for DRS etc.

Simples.

Not play at Lords/Oval our worst grounds this century as generally suit opposition sides.

 

[Molehill]

Most teams are ordinary away from home these days tbf.

Some do well at neutral venues though.

True, but some teams don't play away from home as often as others.

Lord's isn't neutral - everyone knows there's more Aussies living in London than Indi........oh!!

 

[Burgey]

Not play at Lords/Oval our worst grounds this century as generally suit opposition sides.

Even when England was dire in the late 80s and early 90s they often jagged a win at The Oval. And they've won there the last two Ashes series as well. Mostly because Australia was out celebrating up to and all through those tests because they'd already kept the Ashes, but still. It's nice for them to have a win now and then.

 

[Starfighter]

As compared to someone who's pretending to ignore why England is not neutral? How about you come back with actual logic instead trying to blow off your fuse on why your last win over there was glorious & all.
What's there not to accept - we were beaten, that's the end! But it's funny Aussies trying to undermine the huge advantage Eng gave NZ or Oz against an Asian side. Talk about living in ****oo land.

Your definition of neutral, looking at your venue-based complaints, seems to be a venue that favours your side. A for last years' final while I'd concede the usually grassy pitch favoured Australia more than normal, it doesn't mean it was't a neutral venue in the normally understood sense.

The Oval pitch last year was dry underneath and took sharp turn - no one forced India to drop Ashwin. And even given it was grassier than usual, India don't have a bad pace attack - contrarily, it's a pretty good one. Just wasn't good on day 1.

At ground ENG: Kennington Oval, London

Start of match date between 27 Feb 2013 and 27 Feb 2024

Ordered by wickets taken (descending)

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Overall figures

Player	Span	Mat	Inns	Overs	Mdns	Runs	Wkts	BBI	BBM	Ave	Econ	SR	5	10
SCJ Broad (ENG)	2013-2023	9	16	271.1	53	866	28	4/41	7/86	30.92	3.19	58.1	0	0
JM Anderson (ENG)	2013-2023	8	15	269.4	81	710	24	4/95	5/99	29.58	2.63	67.4	0	0
CR Woakes (ENG)	2013-2023	6	11	187.0	51	562	23	4/50	7/111	24.43	3.00	48.7	0	0
MM Ali (ENG)	2014-2023	7	10	152.0	15	627	17	4/45	4/54	36.88	4.12	53.6	0	0
RA Jadeja (IND)	2018-2023	3	6	165.0	21	458	15	4/79	7/258	30.53	2.77	66.0	0	0
MA Starc (AUS)	2013-2023	4	8	126.2	16	528	15	4/82	8/182	35.20	4.17	50.5	0	0
NM Lyon (AUS)	2013-2023	4	8	124.0	24	337	14	4/41	5/60	24.07	2.71	53.1	0	0
MR Marsh (AUS)	2015-2023	3	6	70.2	11	250	13	5/46	7/86	19.23	3.55	32.4	1	0
OE Robinson (ENG)	2021-2022	2	4	78.3	24	232	12	5/49	7/89	19.33	2.95	39.2	1	0
BA Stokes (ENG)	2015-2023	6	6	92.0	13	365	12	3/39	3/39	30.41	3.96	46.0	0	0
PJ Cummins (AUS)	2019-2023	3	6	108.5	16	434	11	3/83	5/151	39.45	3.98	59.3	0	0

Do note the presence of 'Nathan Lyon' and 'Ravindra Jadeja' at comparable averages to most of the fast bowlers.

 

[Burgey]

As compared to someone who's pretending to ignore why England is not neutral? How about you come back with actual logic instead trying to blow off your fuse on why your last win over there was glorious & all.
What's there not to accept - we were beaten, that's the end! But it's funny Aussies (or Kiwis) trying to undermine the huge advantage Eng gave NZ or Oz against an Asian side. Talk about living in ****oo land.

Home or away away (home of opposition) or neutral venue

On continent Asia

Start of match date greater than or equal to 1 Jan 2010

Totals in terms of batting team

Ordered by win/loss ratio (descending)

Overall figures

New Zealand	2010-2023	26	6	12	0	8	0.500	29.55	3.01	49	690	62
Australia	2010-2023	31	6	18	0	7	0.333	28.30	2.97	60	556	91

What advantage though? All I hear about on here is Aus hasn't won a series in England since 2001, but it's suddenly a massive advantage for them? Spare me this crap. The venues were neutral. Are you saying "neutral" means "equally favours quicks and spin heavy attacks"? Because those pitches don't exist.

 

[Starfighter]

If we want venue which is neutral from a bowling attack perspective, then I vote the SCG with its pitches up til last year, which didn't favour any type of bowling at all.

 

[Molehill]

What advantage though? All I hear about on here is Aus hasn't won a series in England since 2001, but it's suddenly a massive advantage for them? Spare me this crap. The venues were neutral. Are you saying "neutral" means "equally favours quicks and spin heavy attacks"? Because those pitches don't exist.

I think the answer might be to play it in Australia. If we use Lyon as an example, his average there is almost identical to all other venues combined.

PS If England qualify, would rather it wasn't in Aus!!

 

[Sunil1z]

IMO more than neutral venue, it should be a 3 Match Test series. And if you want only 1 Test for finals , then give both sides a proper warm up game .

 

[Burgey]

IMO more than neutral venue, it should be a 3 Match Test series. And if you want only 1 Test for finals , then give both sides a proper warm up game .

Yeah this is a reasonable point. Guess the problem is finding the time for the extra games in the schedule.

 

[R!TTER]

Your definition of neutral, looking at your venue-based complaints, seems to be a venue that favours your side.

The Oval pitch last year was dry underneath and took sharp turn - no one forced India to drop Ashwin. And even given it was grassier than usual, India don't have a bad pace attack - contrarily, it's a pretty good one. Just wasn't good on day 1.

I said conditions overall - not just the pitch. Why do you think India is so hard to bowl in for pacers from SA/NZ/Oz or Eng? Just the pitches or something else as well? It's because it's hot - you don't see 8 or 10 over spells except in cooler seasons. Likewise our spinners don't always bowl longer spells away from Asia because the pacers can bowl longer spells. The fundamental makeup of the attack is different & their roles are different - implicitly pacers in general are at a disadvantage in Asia, that's just a fact. Same goes for spinners outside Asia, not talking about the odd track which can turn square but S.E.N.A. countries in general. I also have an issue with Eng hosting every WTC final in 2 years - first of all the cycle should be 4 years. More importantly finals should have at least one home & away test between the finalists - why is that not more fair?

 

[OverratedSanity]

India and Australia both suck in England, think this latest WTC final was close to neutral conditions.

The first one was a bit BS though. English conditions for NZ, plus NZ got ideal preparation with a 2 match series right before the WTC Final. Come on. They deserved to win but we got dealt a really rough hand.

 

[BazBall21]

England are the 3rd best team. They're low down because they've just played 9 tests against the best two.

 

[BazBall21]

India and Australia both suck in England, think this latest WTC final was close to neutral conditions.

The first one was a bit BS though. English conditions for NZ, plus NZ got ideal preparation with a 2 match series right before the WTC Final. Come on. They deserved to win but we got dealt a really rough hand.

Totally agree OS. India were extremely unlucky with the conditions contextually.

 

[Molehill]

Yeah this is a reasonable point. Guess the problem is finding the time for the extra games in the schedule.

I think it's the schedule which kills India more than the venue anyway. Having it straight after the IPL when the players would seemingly rather be on holiday seems to be a far bigger issue for them.

 

[BazBall21]

I became BazBall23 today.

Don't know why BazBall is my name on here :|