Slifer
International Captain
WI went ten years between test losses at home: 1978 to 1988. Not as dominant as India but most impressive nevertheless.
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How would 80s WI and 2000s Australia fare in unbeatable current India?
- Thread starter subshakerz
- Start date
Sunil1z
International Regular
You are being too modest. WI didn’t lose a series to anyone anywhere for 14 years . Doubt this record will be broken anytime .
Patience and Accuracy+Gut
State Vice-Captain
That West Indies team is the best cricket team in history imho.
Slifer
International Captain
Fair.
Gob
International Coach
How are we supposed to play this? If your idea is to bring the 80s windies via a time machine, give them few days to prepare and play them, they'll get massacred. They have not faced spin of this quality. Also back in those days, batsmen used to take a big strikes and keep the bat next to pad and that's no good with DRS.
Australia would probably do better since they have done well against bowlers with variations before plus good spinners they have but first two tests will almost certainly be defeats as they'll try and sweep their way out of trouble and that's a big no no against these two.
Australia would probably do better since they have done well against bowlers with variations before plus good spinners they have but first two tests will almost certainly be defeats as they'll try and sweep their way out of trouble and that's a big no no against these two.
Slifer
International Captain
WI in India '74: Chandra, Bedi and Prasana
WI in India '78: Chandra, Bedi (2nd WI team)
WI in Pakistan '80: Qadir, Qasim
WI in pakistan 86: Tauseef and Qadir
England '76: Underwood
To say WI would get massacred would be to imply that either of Australia or England that recently toured india were better than WI (inference). They weren't. Yes we assume that the WI are given enough prep time, the likes of Lloyd and Kalli and Greenidge would find a way. Again, WI would not win but they won't get steam rolled.
Now imagine the reverse, transporting India now back to the 70s /80s without DRS and no bouncer rules....
Oz would also be worst off in India because pretty much all of their (major) wins in India have come batting first in the last 2+ decades - in fact before Indore they last won a test (in India) batting second in 2001 Wankhede. You're also forgetting how Hayden/Langer/Clarke/Gilly/Martyn heck Gillespie used to take a big stride & would rarely be given lbw even by neutral umpires. That changed massively post DRS, case in point 2013 series, without DRS, but umpires were giving more of those calls in India's favor. Would've been fun watching peak Hayden or Gilly against peak Jadeja/Ashwin with DRS, I'd back our bowlers to come out on top 9/10 times in post DRS era assuming the pitches weren't all flat roads!
Fielding first -
Overall figures
Overall figures
Batting first -
Overall figures
Overall figures
Fielding first -
| Opposition team India |
| Home or away away (home of opposition) |
| Start of match date between 1 Jan 2010 and 1 Jan 2019 |
| Batting or fielding first fielding first |
| Team | Players | Span | Mat | Inns | NO | Runs | HS | Ave | BF | SR | 100 | 50 | 0 | 4s | 6s | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Afghanistan | 11 | 2018-2018 | 1 | 22 | 2 | 207 | 36* | 10.35 | 399 | 51.87 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 32 | 2 |  |
| South Africa | 16 | 2015-2015 | 3 | 66 | 6 | 757 | 63 | 12.61 | 2547 | 29.72 | 0 | 1 | 7 | 78 | 5 | |
| Australia | 11 | 2017-2017 | 1 | 22 | 2 | 355 | 66 | 17.75 | 954 | 37.21 | 0 | 2 | 3 | 30 | 2 | |
| New Zealand | 26 | 2010-2016 | 5 | 102 | 11 | 2045 | 131 | 22.47 | 4628 | 44.18 | 2 | 11 | 18 | 240 | 16 | |
| Opposition team India |
| Home or away away (home of opposition) |
| Start of match date between 1 Jan 2000 and 1 Jan 2010 |
| Batting or fielding first fielding first |
| Grouped by team |
Overall figures
| Team | Players | Span | Mat | Inns | NO | Runs | HS | Ave | BF | SR | 100 | 50 | 0 | 4s | 6s | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| West Indies | 14 | 2002-2002 | 2 | 33 | 3 | 794 | 140 | 26.46 | 1898 | 41.83 | 3 | 2 | 8 | 111 | 3 | |
| Australia | 25 | 2001-2008 | 5 | 92 | 12 | 2161 | 122 | 27.01 | 4302 | 50.23 | 4 | 10 | 11 | 260 | 22 | |
| England | 11 | 2008-2008 | 1 | 14 | 3 | 342 | 144 | 31.09 | 680 | 50.29 | 1 | 2 | 1 | 36 | 2 | |
| Sri Lanka | 21 | 2005-2009 | 5 | 80 | 9 | 2218 | 275 | 31.23 | 4417 | 50.21 | 3 | 10 | 7 | 273 | 11 | |
Batting first -
| Opposition team India |
| Home or away away (home of opposition) |
| Start of match date between 1 Jan 2000 and 1 Jan 2010 |
| Batting or fielding first batting first |
| Grouped by team |
| Team | Players | Span | Mat | Inns | NO | Runs | HS | Ave | BF | SR | 100 | 50 | 0 | 4s | 6s | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| West Indies | 11 | 2002-2002 | 1 | 22 | 2 | 367 | 78 | 18.35 | 959 | 38.26 | 0 | 2 | 3 | 39 | 5 | |
| Zimbabwe | 17 | 2000-2002 | 3 | 66 | 7 | 1489 | 183* | 25.23 | 3731 | 39.90 | 1 | 9 | 11 | 199 | 10 | |
| England | 28 | 2001-2008 | 7 | 138 | 16 | 3631 | 134* | 29.76 | 8273 | 43.88 | 7 | 21 | 9 | 420 | 25 | |
| Australia | 23 | 2001-2008 | 6 | 124 | 13 | 3705 | 203 | 33.37 | 7553 | 49.05 | 8 | 15 | 16 | 424 | 35 | |
| Opposition team India |
| Home or away away (home of opposition) |
| Start of match date between 1 Jan 2010 and 1 Jan 2019 |
| Batting or fielding first batting first |
Overall figures
kyear2
International Coach
Just play them today on any pitch giving assistance. Plus let's not forget what Marshall and Holding did in India in '83
kyear2
International Coach
I understand the premise of the thread, and I love the future of this team.
But the hyperbole is crazy.
To suggest that this poor to average English team is even comparable to the two decades long ATG dominant squats is a bit insulting.
And not to say that it was referenced, but great teams are great home and away and not as pitch reliant as this team is.
But the hyperbole is crazy.
To suggest that this poor to average English team is even comparable to the two decades long ATG dominant squats is a bit insulting.
And not to say that it was referenced, but great teams are great home and away and not as pitch reliant as this team is.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
This team necessarily doesn't mean the team playing currently; it means the team from around 2018-20 when we actually had a good batting line-up in Virat, Pujara, Rahane, Rohit, Rishabh and co. Also, isn't it fascinating how Subs jumped on that Australia only lost a series in India when India wasn't so good just because of an ATG knock from VVS, so it somehow doesn't accounts for, but he clearly had no issues punching down on India for the loss in 1st Test despite a similar ATG innings from Pope, and that too in the absence of India's best batsman. And yeah, I won't disagree this team is really only dominant on home unlike Australia or WI (hence, no one compares them on neutral conditions); but this team really hasn't lost or even drew any home series and actually have won 2 BGTs in Australia...... We even played 2 WTC Finals back to back and could probably play once again. Not saying they're equal to what Aus and WI have done, but it's not really like you could dismiss this team away really.
Anyone who says it would be a bloodbath is taking this too literally. Obviously you have to adjust the talent for modern considerations.
I think if the series was played out a thousand times, India would win 600-650 times but in any given series, the Windies could win easily.
any team with Viv, Malcolm, Greenidge, Lloyd, Holding, Garner etc etc can win any match against any team at any time
I think if the series was played out a thousand times, India would win 600-650 times but in any given series, the Windies could win easily.
any team with Viv, Malcolm, Greenidge, Lloyd, Holding, Garner etc etc can win any match against any team at any time
kyear2
International Coach
I haven't or wouldn't dismiss them, but the bloodbath talk is hyperbole on another level.
capt_Luffy
International Captain
Yeah, have to agree Marshall and Roberts are probably the two most dangerous pacers on Indian soil; there's no bloodbath in sight, but comparing this Indian team to the BGT 2018 winners is also not right.
kyear2
International Coach
Ok, I wasn't comparing them
subshakerz
International Coach
For the sake of this exercise, we should remove DRS.
The idea that WI with Lloyd, Viv, Kalicharan, etc. are duffers against spin is just a myth. India also haven't played a pace quartet like WIs. I don't know why anyone thinks either side is just going to cakewalk to victory.
So this India side can lose first tests against recent Aus and Eng yet the 2000s Aus will definitely lose. Again doesn't make sense.
subshakerz
International Coach
It's palpable nonsense. I started this thread thinking all would concede it would be a tightly fought contest, wasn't expecting this level of delusion.
Socerer 01
International Captain
great the best strawmanning exercise on this forum is back again for round 2
subshakerz
International Coach
Assuming a 4-test match series with two rank turners, one flat pitch and one conventional wicket that breaks down later:
WI 2-2, with both teams sharing one win on rank turners, India winning on the conventional wicket and WI winning on the flat pitch.
Australia 2-1, with India and Australia sharing a victory each on rank turners, Australia winning on the conventional wicket and the flat pitch being a draw.
Rank turners are 50/50 games and effectively equalise the sides strengths. WI pace can conquer on flat wicket if series is on the line. Aus prefer a conventional turning wicket.
WI 2-2, with both teams sharing one win on rank turners, India winning on the conventional wicket and WI winning on the flat pitch.
Australia 2-1, with India and Australia sharing a victory each on rank turners, Australia winning on the conventional wicket and the flat pitch being a draw.
Rank turners are 50/50 games and effectively equalise the sides strengths. WI pace can conquer on flat wicket if series is on the line. Aus prefer a conventional turning wicket.