Pat Cummins

[Prince EWS]

Right but there was a Test that was arguably lost in no small part because of those tactics in both innings with the ball, and yet it only deteriorated at Headingley. I keep repeating it but I seriously question just what the backroom staff are doing.

In general fast bowlers just shouldn't be captains. It's too much on their plate. The only thing that makes me hesitate is that it would delight the literal worst people in the country.

Social and halba?

 

[Prince EWS]

I agree about fast bowlers being captains, it's a massive ask and not surprisingly Cummins has struggled at times.

Looking from afar, it seems he was the captain of last resort. After the Paine debacle, who else was there to turn to.

Presumably CA didn't want to go to either Smith or Warner for obvious reasons.

Even now, who would CA turn to to replace Cummins. Khawaja for a year or 2 maybe.

Head was an awesome Sheffield Shield captain. He's only not been considered before because his spot was never cemented. I think it is now so he'd be a really good candidate IMO.

 

[the big bambino]

The short length tactics have bowled Crawley into form which has given England runs and a foundation to make even more.

They must also be physically taxing as well as wasting the bowlers natural talents. Cummins was always going to be stressed by the short break between matches and the captaincy. I don’t see why he, and the other bowlers, should’ve been saddled with a tactic likely to multiply those stresses.

 

[Starfighter]

The short length tactics have bowled Crawley into form which has given England runs and a foundation to make even more.

They must also be physically taxing as well as wasting the bowlers natural talents. Cummins was always going to be stressed by the short break between matches and the captaincy. I don’t see why he, and the other bowlers, should’ve been saddled with a tactic likely to multiply those stresses.

Cummins is captain. Ultimately it's his decision to use those tactics.

 

[the big bambino]

I realise that. The post was to count the consequences of the tactic rather than apportion responsibility for them.

 

[subshakerz]

If Cummins wins the next test somehow that should silence critics.

 

[the big bambino]

It shouldn't really and i wouldn't credit a victory as an argument in defence of all that has gone wrong in tests 3 & 4.

 

[Socerer 01]

yeah subs is way too reliant on results and numbers without seeing anything else

 

[Starfighter]

I realise that. The post was to count the consequences of the tactic rather than apportion responsibility for them.

If you write that he was 'saddled' with a tactic that he is 100% in charge of on-field, you are apportioning primary responsibility elsewhere.

 

[Starfighter]

If Cummins wins the next test somehow that should silence critics.

Terrible logic.

Just as a bad DRS review doesn't absolve prior poor umpiring, and an unexpected performance doesn't absolve the logic of a poor selection, the possibility of winning the last test doesn't retroactively mean that the tactical mistakes of the previous tests didn't exist.

 

[the big bambino]

If you write that he was 'saddled' with a tactic that he is 100% in charge of on-field, you are apportioning primary responsibility elsewhere.

Dear me. I'll re state for your benefit that was not the intention of the post despite your fixation on that word. But since you raise responsibility you would be naive not to realise the importance of backroom politics and that while captains take responsibility they can still be influenced or even dominated by those behind the scenes.

 

[Starfighter]

Dear me. I'll re state for your benefit that was not the intention of the post despite your fixation on that word. But since you raise responsibility you would be naive not to realise the importance of backroom politics and that while captains take responsibility they can still be influenced or even dominated by those behind the scenes.

And what have we seen of McDonald to suggest that he would be doing that?

 

[the big bambino]

It would seem strange the captain going into a tactics meeting all by himself right?

 

[Qlder]

Is Pat Cummins the only Australian captain to have never captained his State in shield cricket? Easy way to explain his lack of technical judgement or field setting nous

 

[Starfighter]

It would seem strange the captain going into a tactics meeting all by himself right?

There is nothing anywhere to indicate someone is 'dominating' him to impose this tactic against his will.

It's actually consistent with this team's bowling tactics for the past several years, only taken to silly extremes and in ignorance of the opposition.

 

[the big bambino]

There is nothing anywhere to indicate someone is 'dominating' him to impose this tactic against his will.

It's actually consistent with this team's bowling tactics for the past several years, only taken to silly extremes and in ignorance of the opposition.

Influenced or dominated. But who knows. Its speculation. I just suspect its a team decision as things are different now to the old Chappelli days when the captain was totally in charge. But even Chappelli acknowledges the influence of staff when he urges captains to overrule them as the losses go against the captain's name. It would take a captain of extraordinary character and record not to be influenced by staff in the modern era. I don't think Cummins has that confidence at this stage.

 

[Spark]

"Taken to silly extremes and ignorant of the opposition" is the entire problem with the tactics so those caveats are odd

 

[GIMH]

Head seems like a good choice to me

 

[honestbharani]

I have no stake in this game but it does look like some of the Aussie posters here want to absolve Cummins of a lot of blame wherever possible. When it was Paine with these tactics, no one brought up the fact that Cummins, as vice-captain, was very much part of that think-tank and yet suddenly when Cummins is captain, the think-tank is the one that should be blamed.

I get that Cummins is probably the most lovable great Aussie cricketer you have had, perhaps in my lifetime, but this and the mental gymnastics around whether the bowlers would have known about sandpaper-gate etc. indicates Sachin fb level fanboism.

He is an excellent player and a pretty bad captain, from all evidence so far. And there is nothing wrong with that. Captaincy is hard and players greater than Cummins have failed at it.

And yeah, Head for captain for sure. @Prince EWS and @Spikey should be pleased at least.

 

[GIMH]

but this and the mental gymnastics around whether the bowlers would have known about sandpaper-gate etc.

Hb acknowledging that the 17-18 Ashes are as valid as Ben Johnson’s gold at the 1987 World Championships - you love to see it