*Official* 2022 New Zealand Tour of England, Ireland, Scotland & Netherlands

[thierry henry]

3 match series against India….and that’s it.

 

[Flem274*]

12 matches. 3 against the Dutch, 2 against Ireland, 3 against Bangers, 3 against India and 1 against Aus.

ESPNcricinfo.com Statsguru - New Zealand - One-Day Internationals - Team analysis

stats.espncricinfo.com

 

[straw man]

Left hand bat, right arm offspin? Is this... new Chris Gayle?

 

[straw man]

Boult-Henry-Ferguson-Santner-CdG is still our best ODI attack.

CDG would be conditions-dependent, though if pitches are like England last world cup then absolutely. Agree with the other four, though gonna keep banging the 'Santner has underwhelmed over the last couple of seasons' drum at the same time.

 

[thierry henry]

CDG would be conditions-dependent, though if pitches are like England last world cup then absolutely. Agree with the other four, though gonna keep banging the 'Santner has underwhelmed over the last couple of seasons' drum at the same time.

In the last 2 years Santner has played all of 4 ODIs and taken 6 wickets @19 so there’s really nothing to base that on.

I must say though, Santner’s ODI record overall is kinda worse than I thought. I guess he’s played right through a horribly batting dominated ODI era and any NZ spinner who can go at 4.8 RPO in those circumstances is doing ok. I’m probably guilty of looking at Santner and saying “see, he doesn’t look much but he’s deceptively hard to get away” rather than assessing whether he’s actually effective enough as a frontline bowler?

 

[Flem274*]

Santner is very good at going for 5 an over or less, which makes him a valuable banker in ODIs (but not someone to build an attack around like Boult or Ferguson) but a terrible test bowler.

Combined with being a reliable cameo batsman he is a safe selection in the ODI side but never a first 4 selection.

 

[straw man]

In the last 2 years Santner has played all of 4 ODIs and taken 6 wickets @19 so there’s really nothing to base that on.

I must say though, Santner’s ODI record overall is kinda worse than I thought. I guess he’s played right through a horribly batting dominated ODI era and any NZ spinner who can go at 4.8 RPO in those circumstances is doing ok. I’m probably guilty of looking at Santner and saying “see, he doesn’t look much but he’s deceptively hard to get away” rather than assessing whether he’s actually effective enough as a frontline bowler?

I thought he was a bit meh in the last ODI world cup and am also basing this on T20, including the T20 world cup. Not terrible, just not quite as good at containing runs as we hope he would be. IMO he'd performed better than that in prior seasons and looked more accurate too.

 

[thundaboult]

I thought he was a bit meh in the last ODI world cup and am also basing this on T20, including the T20 world cup. Not terrible, just not quite as good at containing runs as we hope he would be. IMO he'd performed better than that in prior seasons and looked more accurate too.

I think he's gone well in tourneys for the most part. Played a starring role in the 2016 t20 wc, honestly can't recall anything we did at the ct17, was phenomenal in the wc19 semi vs india...but yeah definitely a bit indifferent in the t20 wc last year.

Santner, boult, ferg and henry are definely starters for me in ODI. Henry is sooooo reliable for a long new ball spell, if he can find a way to consistently bowl 135+ .... we are golden.

 

[thierry henry]

FWIW (not much) Santner bowled as well as you’ll ever see him bowl last night. Bracewell bowled well too but the figures don’t reflect how much more dangerous Santner looked. Must’ve gone past the outside edge 10+ times with unplayable turn and bounce. But yeah, he won’t always be playing Ireland on a raging turner.

 

[Moss]

Santner is very good at going for 5 an over or less, which makes him a valuable banker in ODIs (but not someone to build an attack around like Boult or Ferguson) but a terrible test bowler.

Combined with being a reliable cameo batsman he is a safe selection in the ODI side but never a first 4 selection.

It's similar with CdG the bowler, goes at 4.8 per over which is excellent in an ODI era which is thought to have made bowlers of his type redundant. Good value at home or England but I guess he's not likely to be as much of a factor in India, especially with the bat. NZ will struggle to find a fifth bowling option as good as him.

Need to somehow get 10 reliable overs out of the top 7. Macewell fits the bill on paper but seems likely that his bowling will get savaged by the top sides.

 

[TheBrand]

Need to somehow get 10 reliable overs out of the top 7. Macewell fits the bill on paper but seems likely that his bowling will get savaged by the top sides.

Phillips, Neesham and Williamson (I wish) is a lot more appealing than Bracewell supporting Santner. Although Bracewell and Santner might be competing for the same spot.

 

[jcas0167]

Finn Allen was very good today, no ugly hoicks, no slogging (maybe barring couple of balls or three ?). Took his time, mostly played merit of the ball and when he got in he really cashed in. Oh left a lot of balls too which is quite unusual for him. Showing good signs

Just watched the replay. It was good to see him leaving the ball well and then lofting through offside while the field was up. He's so powerful some of those went for six and they were relatively low risk shots. The backfoot drive for four was exquisite. Hope he continues in this vein.

 

[nzfan]

Milne is out of the tour without having played a game. Lockie has only had one game to show. They pull up Duffy as Milne's replacement.

The story of our faster bowlers, they are barely ever available for more than a game at a stretch. Hope Sears gets a consistent go now.

 

[NZTailender]

Milne's done. Even if when he's fit is he worth persevering with?

I should say I've always been a fan of Milne but he's definitely been a what if and great in theory bowler.

 

[thundaboult]

Yeah enough with Milne now. Time to move on, he is not lockie, and definitely not bond. There are enough t20 leagues around the world where he can apply his craft. As @nzfan says, its Sears time. I would play him in damn near all the t20is coming up, windies and bd/pak tri-series included. The t20wc being in Aus, him and lockie could be crucial. Lets give the youngin some mileage in the legs...hopefully he doesn't end up injuring one of those legs.

 

[nzfan]

Yeah enough with Milne now. Time to move on, he is not lockie, and definitely not bond. There are enough t20 leagues around the world where he can apply his craft. As @nzfan says, its Sears time. I would play him in damn near all the t20is coming up, windies and bd/pak tri-series included. The t20wc being in Aus, him and lockie could be crucial. Lets give the youngin some mileage in the legs...hopefully he doesn't end up injuring one of those legs.

If Sears can stay on the park he can be all format player for us in the long run. I can't see anyone else in the horizon that can be classified as fast medium or over (other than Lockie of course). Kyle could play 50 overs and be good at it but then the jury is still out on his t20 skills. Tickner can get close to 140 at times but with no radar. Duffy stock standard 130+ bowler. Wags not suited for white ball. It's got to start looking brighter for Sears going forward. They just need to be patient with Sears and not expect miracles from game one.

My guess they'll persist with Boult, Southee, Kyle and Lockie. Conservative selections has been the order of the day since Steady days unfortunately. Super high chances they will bring back Doug Bracewell for CDG if CDG isn't available.

 

[Flem274*]

That's a shame about Milne. 2013-2015 World Cup looked to be a break out era for The Worlds Fastest Gavin Larsen. Despite his length being a work in progress his corridor and control was superb for a young third seamer and he ensured the opposition actually had to have good players in the death overs rather than just pure icing.

I guess that's what happens when you debut guys just out of school at 17. The last bowler we did that to was Vettori, who also suffered a seriously limiting back injury.

Anyway hopefully we start to value bowlers not called Boult and Southee now that the pool is getting smaller and we need to, gasp, blood some depth. Maybe even use other talented bowlers in test cricket without randomly dropping them because Ben Stokes hit a six or debuting them in 40 degree heat. That would be novel.

We're a far cry from 2015 where we had two international standard ODI attacks on hand (Boult, Southee, Milne, Vettori, Mills, Henry, McClenaghan and NcCullum).

 

[jcas0167]

Milne will bounce back, especially now he's signed with Wellington.

 

[straw man]

I do feel for Milne, must be incredibly tough having to bounce back from injury after injury after injury. Credit to him, his peak pace was still pushing 150km/h last I saw (last year).

Aside from the injuries though, he's never worked out how to consistently take wickets in any format, which just seems bizarre for someone of his pace. Mainly down to bowling just short of a length and with minimal movement, I guess.

I've also posted before that one low-RPO-but-doesn't-take-wickets bowler is fine through the middle overs of an ODI, but two is too many - I really dislike Milne and Santner in the same team for this reason. The rest of our ODI game works around taking wickets with good new ball bowlers, trying to prevent opposition having too many wickets in hand and destroying us at the death (because our death bowling isn't good), and reliably making moderate scores with the bat.

Been hoping for years Milne could keep fit and start taking wickets, but it's seeming less and less likely (though at age 30, I wouldn't yet say impossible).

 

[Fuller Pilch]

We're a far cry from 2015 where we had two international standard ODI attacks on hand (Boult, Southee, Milne, Vettori, Mills, Henry, McClenaghan and NcCullum).

Plus the golden arm of Corey Anderson and the Hairy Jav's pretty decent mediums if ever needed.