***Official New Zealand in India Nov-Dec 2021 Thread***

[Fuller Pilch]

Don't get me wrong he is not bad. I'd put him on par with Shane Watson. Looks good but fails when matters. He is very good though

He averages about 10 runs more than Watson and plays (currently) in a tougher batting era.

 

[Fuller Pilch]

I'd put Taylor slightly below Hashim Amla (both forms).

 

[Hurricane2]

Article in Wisden saying Southee might the best pace bowler in the world (although a few days ago they had a World XI and Anderson, Bumrah, and Cummins were the seamers, so go figure).

Southee is certainly the smartest fast bowler in the world. His strategies and ways he goes about hus work reminds me of Hadlee. Although not quite at that level of bowling intelligence. He has certainly fulfilled his potential and blossomed into all that we hoped he would be. When we first saw him there was a lot to like but sometimes it was one step forward followed by two steps back. At this point his understanding of test match bowling is compelling and mesmerising.

 

[Athlai]

Yeah it's quite a treat to see how Southee plans to get someone out.

 

[Zinzan]

People saying advantage NZ are forgetting what happened the last time these two teams played at kanpur. At the end of day 2, India bowled out for 310 and NZ 150/1 - arguably a better position than NZ are currently in. What happened next? NZ bowled out for 260 and India go on to win at a canter. NZ’s batting is better this time and the pitch is playing a bit more low and slow but NZ still have a big hill to climb to get to a genuine position of strength.

^ This. Even discounting that particular test, that applies to any test in India where the away side has to bat last.

I'd be uncomfortable with us having to chase anything over 180, so based on that still have India as strong favorites. Think we'll need a minimum 80-100 run lead to be on par.

I really do hope we can go big 1st innings, but could easily see us rolled for 250ish.

 

[Zinzan]

Southee the Test bowler has definitely made me eat it. I thought he hit his straps as a test bowler around 2012, then lost form, came back and was fairly ordinary for 3-4 years when I was calling for his head across all 3 forms.

I can't deny it though, he's been absolutely world class the last 2-2.5 years, and a better Test bowler than Boult in that time.

Still have reservations about his 50 over bowling, although the way he keeps learning and reinventing himself, wouldn't put it past him to prove me otherwise in that form too.

 

[vandem]

It is not advantage the the team 220 behind when there are already ground grubbers.

Ground grubbers and trigger happy umpires ( in this innings, but not in the 1st innings …)

 

[thierry henry]

I think Southee has all but been retired in ODI cricket tbh. Statistically he’ll go down as an unusually bad bowler in the format

 

[Bahnz]

Southee the Test bowler has definitely made me eat it. I thought he hit his straps as a test bowler around 2012, then lost form, came back and was fairly ordinary for 3-4 years when I was calling for his head across all 3 forms.

I can't deny it though, he's been absolutely world class the last 2-2.5 years, and a better Test bowler than Boult in that time.

Still have reservations about his 50 over bowling, although the way he keeps learning and reinventing himself, wouldn't put it past him to prove me otherwise in that form too.

Been great for a bit longer than that. Basically been top class ever since he got dropped for that 1st test v SA in 2017. Think that was a bit of a wakeup call for him, reports at the time said he was devastated by it. Since then he’s taken 115 wickets at 21.7. Basically he’s been better for longer than anyone before or since Hadlee.

 

[Bahnz]

I think Southee has all but been retired in ODI cricket tbh. Statistically he’ll go down as an unusually bad bowler in the format

He still plays a fair bit as Nz rarely uses the frontline Henry-Boult-Ferg combo outside of icc tournaments.

 

[hendrix]

Who gaf about jamodis and jamt20s etc

Southee test bowler is superb and also has buckets in the slips. Dude is invaluable, and his batting is hilariously bad and i can't even get angry about it anymore

 

[Red_Ink_Squid]

This is what India deserve for their hubris in fielding their B team against the number one Test side. Needed to select either their first choice XI or their C team to stay competitive.

 

[thierry henry]

At this stage I am gagging for JAMODIs, we basically haven’t played any for 2 years. Taylor has missed out on about 2,000 ODI runs

 

[veganbob]

Southee the Test bowler has definitely made me eat it. I thought he hit his straps as a test bowler around 2012, then lost form, came back and was fairly ordinary for 3-4 years when I was calling for his head across all 3 forms.

I can't deny it though, he's been absolutely world class the last 2-2.5 years, and a better Test bowler than Boult in that time.

Still have reservations about his 50 over bowling, although the way he keeps learning and reinventing himself, wouldn't put it past him to prove me otherwise in that form too.

Same here.
In fact- Now I put him ahead of Boult in my all time NZ test Xi. Didn't think that would have been possible 3-4 years ago.

 

[Howsie]

Southee the Test bowler has definitely made me eat it. I thought he hit his straps as a test bowler around 2012, then lost form, came back and was fairly ordinary for 3-4 years when I was calling for his head across all 3 forms.

I can't deny it though, he's been absolutely world class the last 2-2.5 years, and a better Test bowler than Boult in that time.

Still have reservations about his 50 over bowling, although the way he keeps learning and reinventing himself, wouldn't put it past him to prove me otherwise in that form too.

Nice, now we just need the rest of the Southee haters to fess up. You know who you are.

Are we really going to pretend that Tim Southee...

Boooooooo

www.cricketweb.net

Oooof, some shockers on that last page

 

[Fuller Pilch]

Same here.
In fact- Now I put him ahead of Boult in my all time NZ test Xi. Didn't think that would have been possible 3-4 years ago.

I'd put neither. My bowling attack would be Hadlee, Bond, Cairns, Wagner (might lose out to Jamieson in future), Vettori.

2nd XI attack: Southee, Boult, Cowie, Oram, J Bracewell

 

[Hurricane2]

I haven’t watched much of Will Young until now. My initial impressions are mixed

Positives
Well organised
Bats with positive intent
Bat in front of pad against spinners on forward defence against spin to negate lbw
Understands innings management and puts the team needs before his own like most down under batsman do

Negatives
A rather large negative that i fear will be his undoing. He has wide back lift that isn’t straight. His pre delivery pick up is fine but his actual back lift has a flourish towards point. This will lead to lbws, playing around his front pad, mistiming off drives, not being able to drive well on the up. He has adjusted for all of this by opening his stance to avoid lbw but that is not going to suffice long term.

That analysis based on my years as a top order bat in senior men’s cricket and coaching clinics.

 

[Gnske]

I haven’t watched much of Will Young until now. My initial impressions are mixed

Positives
Well organised
Bats with positive intent
Bat in front of pad against spinners on forward defence against spin to negate lbw
Understands innings management and puts the team needs before his own like most down under batsman do

Negatives
A rather large negative that i fear will be his undoing. He has wide back lift that isn’t straight. His pre delivery pick up is fine but his actual back lift has a flourish towards point. This will lead to lbws, playing around his front pad, mistiming off drives, not being able to drive well on the up. He has adjusted for all of this by opening his stance to avoid lbw but that is not going to suffice long term.

That analysis based on my years as a top order bat in senior men’s cricket and coaching clinics.

Would you stand and applaud if Young scores a century though?

 

[Hurricane2]

Would you stand and applaud if Young scores a century though?

Depends if Doug Bracewell clean bowls him fairly and squarely during his inning or not on the way to his century only for the umpire to incorrectly call it a no ball.

 

[honestbharani]

Do teams get to choose the roller they want before start of play each day? Or is it only during the innings break?