Australian Domestic Season 2020/21

[Smudge49]

The school holidays thing is hugely important too. I don't understand why this is just not being considered by Smudge at all. It's not an issue for the football season because... they play on weekends and Fridays.

Good luck getting any kids at sporting games played on a Tuesday evening in the middle of the school term. This is an absurd crusade on his behalf tbh.

I get your point, but the point I'm failing to understand is relevance of a tournament that doesn't make any substantial money, doesn't create any meaningful talent pool, it is a tournament no big name Australian or foreign player wants to come and play in but still it seems to get longer, with more slots for foreign internationals with every passing season to compensate for earlier financial estimates not getting fulfilled.

 

[stephen]

It was doing very well on channel 10 but then the commentary team split up to do the tests and fox commentary. The BBL was left with the dregs of the commentary team instead of the A listers. I don't think it can be overstated how much of a difference it made to hear the younger commentators and female voices than the stuffy, tired and stale 9 commentary team.

 

[TheJediBrah]

I get your point, but the point I'm failing to understand is relevance of a tournament that doesn't make any substantial money, doesn't create any meaningful talent pool, it is a tournament no big name Australian or foreign player wants to come and play in but still it seems to get longer, with more slots for foreign internationals with every passing season to compensate for earlier financial estimates not getting fulfilled.

It doesn't? I just assumed it was the most lucrative part of the summer for CA by far

 

[Smudge49]

It doesn't? I just assumed it was the most lucrative part of the summer for CA by far

Empty coffers tell you otherwise, CA bent over backwards to have India come over this summer to an extent where they wiped off all previously planned international games.

As a result Channel 7 is in the process of suing Cricket Australia for this and Cricket Australia to revive it's financial health is now about to do the unthinkable by having a T20 squad and Test squad represent the nation at the same time simultaneously in different parts of the world, which is bonkers given the fact Aus, Ind & Eng regulate pretty much 80% of international cricket's revenue.

 

[GotSpin]

The school holidays thing is hugely important too. I don't understand why this is just not being considered by Smudge at all. It's not an issue for the football season because... they play on weekends and Fridays.

Good luck getting any kids at sporting games played on a Tuesday evening in the middle of the school term. This is an absurd crusade on his behalf tbh.

Yeah constantly repeating myself here but it's ludicrous

 

[GotSpin]

Empty coffers tell you otherwise, CA bent over backwards to have India come over this summer to an extent where they wiped off all previously planned international games.

As a result Channel 7 is in the process of suing Cricket Australia for this and Cricket Australia to revive it's financial health is now about to do the unthinkable by having a T20 squad and Test squad represent the nation at the same time simultaneously in different parts of the world, which is bonkers given the fact Aus, Ind & Eng regulate pretty much 80% of international cricket's revenue.

The coffers would have been empty if their broadcast deal was torn up...Not really sure what the point is. Theyve also done this before...its not the first time (Doesn't make it right though)

The BBL -

- Absolutely huge for kids and therefore crucial to the future of cricket in Australia
- Allows Cricket Australia to dominate the sporting landscape in summer
- Significant contributor to the bottom line
- Must be playing during the school holidays

Honestly, it sucks that the Shield is split into two but moving the BBL to any other month would basically kill the competition off entirely.

 

[Smudge49]

The coffers would have been empty if their broadcast deal was torn up...Not really sure what the point is. Theyve also done this before...its not the first time (Doesn't make it right though)

The BBL -

- Absolutely huge for kids and therefore crucial to the future of cricket in Australia
- Allows Cricket Australia to dominate the sporting landscape in summer
- Significant contributor to the bottom line
- Must be playing during the school holidays

Honestly, it sucks that the Shield is split into two but moving the BBL to any other month would basically kill the competition off entirely.

I don't know how much you are aware of this, but even pre covid Cricket Australia's finances were in a ditch, they just said this publicly only after covid put a wrench in administering future games.

For a cricket board that is the part of the big three club, it is a stinker that not only the first class season and List-A season in Aus is being split into two halves to make way for a T20 franchise based tournament which is owned and managed by the cricket board itself, practices that aren't taking place in any other major cricketing nation.

Using BBL to generate accountable revenue, that reaches the grassroots and helps spread the game are benefits that will outweigh it's harms.

 

[TheJediBrah]

Using BBL to generate accountable revenue, that reaches the grassroots and helps spread the game are benefits that will outweigh it's harms.

Isn't this the opposite of what you've been saying

 

[Spark]

CA's dire revenue "forecasts" were full of **** and mostly leaked to the media as a negotiating tactic during the standoffs with both the networks and the players, and then as a way to get government support* last year. They have not borne out at all. This last year has been particularly egregious, claiming massive revenue losses during a time when... they weren't going to make any revenue anyway, because no one plays cricket in May.

My understanding is that CA's financial situation is fine.

EDIT: They had, as of 30/7 last year, $54m in total equity. This is not the financial situation of a board in dire straits.

*And as a reason to cut a whole bunch of wages, I now recall.

 

[the big bambino]

Yeah there is that billion dollar deal isn’t there?

 

[Spark]

Yeah there is that billion dollar deal isn’t there?

They're obviously not going to get that again, but in the short term their financial situation is fine. The reason they're sending two squads out at the same time is because of FTP obligations plus rescheduling related to the pandemic. It's not actually the first time there have been overlaps between two separate tours when one involves a late-season SA tour, it happened last time too. It happens when you have obligations to fulfill and only so many slots to fulfill them. It has absolutely nothing to do with CA needing to "save its finances", that's just rubbish.

 

[Smudge49]

Isn't this the opposite of what you've been saying

Look mate, BBL in it's current form is like a baker making a cake from borrowed ingredients, what's worse he is making a shitty cake out those ingredients and putting it on window display and then at nightfall he is eating all of that cake on his own and leaving the crumbs for people from whom he borrowed the ingredients from.

That's what BBL in it's current form is, no franchise based T20 tournament is in the grasp on it's own cricket board, wealthy investors from around the world pump money into these franchises raise a model to identify talent and improve both financial and professional health of the sport, but CA doesn't want all that.

So in it's current form the less it effects the core of Australian cricket, the better it is unless it starts giving something substantial to the game.

They're obviously not going to get that again, but in the short term their financial situation is fine. The reason they're sending two squads out at the same time is because of FTP obligations plus rescheduling related to the pandemic. It's not actually the first time there have been overlaps between two separate tours when one involves a late-season SA tour, it happened last time too. It happens when you have obligations to fulfill and only so many slots to fulfill them. It has absolutely nothing to do with CA needing to "save its finances", that's just rubbish.

A thing like FTP doesn't exist anymore, Ind, Aus, Eng tore that proposal and threw it on ICC's face when the last FTP cycle ended, now boards decide between them when, where and how many games they want to play and poor ol' ICC just keeps to administration of it's ICC events.

This Aussie summer, teams like West Indies and New Zealand were supposed to tour Australia, but because Australian cricket's finances were already in the red they wiped the international summer clean and switched total focus on hosting India again [despite the fact they haven't had a return test tour to India post BGT in 18-19].

This refocus included postponing BBL to a later date, wiping West Indies, New Zealand games of the calendar, all this against the wishes of Channel 7, for which they are threatening to sue CA.

Now to cover their fluff up and to make upto the NZ cricket board they have scheduled these T20 games in NZ, while at the same time test team is playing elsewhere. Administrative disaster only Cricket Australia has managed to pull off not once but twice now.

 

[Spark]

...

These T20s were scheduled for March 2021 in the in 2018. The tour to India was scheduled to be November 2020 to January 2021 in 2018. You can literally look it up in the FTP program.



Are you saying they knew there would be a global pandemic in 2018 and thus sneakily put India Tests and away NZ T20s just to ensure their financial position remained sound? The reason there is an overlap is because the SA tour has been delayed and that is entirely down to the uncertain pandemic situation in South Africa. It has nothing to do with CA's "administrative competence", which IMO has come out actually pretty well relative to other things this summer given the extreme complexity of the pandemic situation.

You are talking complete nonsense in an attempt to push an agenda. Reposting exactly the same article twice and addressing none of what was brought up in response is evidence of that.

 

[Spark]

Like, saying that the New Zealand ODIs were "wiped clean" because of financial concerns is total bullshit when you consider the actual logistics of attempting to hold the scheduled ODIs in the middle of January given the border situation as late as September, which is when they were eventually canned. But apparently if you don't make the NZ team spend four weeks in hotel quarantine in the middle of their summer for a few ODIs you're "a financial disaster", apparently. What a load of ****.

 

[GotSpin]

Like, saying that the New Zealand ODIs were "wiped clean" because of financial concerns is total bull**** when you consider the actual logistics of attempting to hold the scheduled ODIs in the middle of January given the border situation as late as September, which is when they were eventually canned. But apparently if you don't make the NZ team spend four weeks in hotel quarantine in the middle of their summer for a few ODIs you're "a financial disaster", apparently. What a load of ****.

I’d let this go to the keeper now

CA is far far from perfect but these are all made up

I don’t think many people appreciate how important the big bash has been for making sure kids get into cricket

 

[Spark]

I’d let this go to the keeper now

CA is far far from perfect but these are all made up

I don’t think many people appreciate how important the big bash has been for making sure kids get into cricket

It's so obvious when you go to the games. Like, Tests are the pinnacle and all, but we should be pretty obvious and say that your average Test crowd in Australia is mostly old white people, and probably most have an Anglo background. BBL games though attract a far more diverse, far younger crowd.

 

[Smudge49]

...

These T20s were scheduled for March 2021 in the in 2018. The tour to India was scheduled to be November 2020 to January 2021 in 2018. You can literally look it up in the FTP program.

View attachment 27101

Are you saying they knew there would be a global pandemic in 2018 and thus sneakily put India Tests and away NZ T20s just to ensure their financial position remained sound? The reason there is an overlap is because the SA tour has been delayed and that is entirely down to the uncertain pandemic situation in South Africa. It has nothing to do with CA's "administrative competence", which IMO has come out actually pretty well relative to other things this summer given the extreme complexity of the pandemic situation.

You are talking complete nonsense in an attempt to push an agenda. Reposting exactly the same article twice and addressing none of what was brought up in response is evidence of that.

The screenshot below is from Cricket Australia's own website, and this response from Hazelwood in the middle of 2020 to CA declaring their "cash crunch" is pretty telling if you haven't already shut yourself off completely to a counter argument.

Two months into the pandemic Cricket Australia started the hue and cry of being short on money despite being a cricket board, that gets one of the biggest slices of pie from International cricket's revenue to having total control over the moolah generated through their domestic T20 tournament.

However they were quick to blame Covid for all their pre-existing financial **** ups, they were fine to send all their premium players in the middle of a pandemic half way across the world to play IPL, but just had to revamp the home summer to make India the only visiting team, at a time when all other cricket boards are/were carrying out their commitments around the world.

Again, sending two national sides to play parallel cricket around the world, they did this to New Zealand the first time as well, they are doing it to them again, because god forbid if they pull this stunt off against a bigger board, they will nail their ass to the wall.

So forgive me if I as a fan have an agenda of demanding accountability and results from the administration, at a time when people like Paine and Langer are the leaders and a first class batting average of 30 is good enough to earn you national selection.

BBL could produce world beaters 10-20 years down the line, so more power to it! However I am concerned about the current rut of Australian domestic cricket where standards are dropping with every passing season and players are having to band together to demand even their basic right to a decent pay.

P.S : If the attendance to Test Cricket is predominantly white, then maybe... just maybe... selecting deserving minority players in Australian teams would be a good start towards broader inclusiveness, wonder why CA isn't doing that or are they just waiting for BBL to fix everything in Australian cricket?!

 

[Spark]

The screenshot below is from Cricket Australia's own website, and this response from Hazelwood in the middle of 2020 to CA declaring their "cash crunch" is pretty telling if you haven't already shut yourself off completely to a counter argument.

Two months into the pandemic Cricket Australia started the hue and cry of being short on money despite being a cricket board, that gets one of the biggest slices of pie from International cricket's revenue to having total control over the moolah generated through their domestic T20 tournament.

However they were quick to blame Covid for all their pre-existing financial **** ups, they were fine to send all their premium players in the middle of a pandemic half way across the world to play IPL, but just had to revamp the home summer to make India the only visiting team, at a time when all other cricket boards are/were carrying out their commitments around the world.

What pre-existing financial ****-ups? Name them. Specifically. They had $54million positive equity in their 2019/20 financial statements, which already covers some pandemic months, these are available online if you care to look at them.

The pandemic hurt their revenue -- although I remain very sceptical of their claims from mid-2020 that were presaged on far more signifcant disruptions to the summer than took place -- because everyone's revenue got hit. You really have to be living under a rock to think that the pandemic would have not had any significant impact on revenue.

Or does CA's "financial mismanagement" also extend to the AFL: Pandemic-hit AFL axes 20% of workforce as losses mount - SportsPro Media , the NRL NRL to face savage job cuts | HRD Australia (hcamag.com) , the English Premier League Premier League clubs set for £500m collective loss due to coronavirus | Finances | The Guardian , the NFL NFL teams lost almost $4 billion in revenue due to coronavirus pandemic - CBS News , the NBA NBA revenue for 2019-20 season dropped 10% to $8.3 billion, sources say (espn.com.au) and every other professional sporting league in the world? You blame entirely vague, unspecified and frankly undocumented "financial **** ups" for CA's media claims of loss in revenue that have not actually been documented in any financial statement, and think the pandemic is just a lame excuse that explains nothing. Spare me.

However they were quick to blame Covid for all their pre-existing financial **** ups, they were fine to send all their premium players in the middle of a pandemic half way across the world to play IPL, but just had to revamp the home summer to make India the only visiting team, at a time when all other cricket boards are/were carrying out their commitments around the world.

You mean aside from the World T20, which was cancelled, the Asia Cup, which was postponed, the Women's World Cup, which was postponed, an English ODI tour of India, which was postponed, New Zealand's tour of Bangladesh, which was postponed, Pakistan and New Zealand tours of Ireland, the postponement of the England/SL series by almost a year, a New Zealand tour of SL which seems to have been canned, an Ireland vs Bangaldesh series to be held in England, a Bangladesh tour of SL, Indian and SL tours of Zimbabwe being flat out cancelled etc etc

Once again, you show an incredible willingness to just flat out ignore documented facts if they don't fit your agenda. The pandemic has thrown all sorts of scheduling curveballs this year, to ignore that difficulty is specious at best and flagrantly dishonest at worst. You throw all these cancelled tours into a single bucket as proof of entirely unspecified "financial mismanagement" without explaining (a) what the point of holding extremely complex T20 only tours logistically would be when those series are clearly meant principally as warm ups for a World T20 that is not happening and (b) what possible practical way there could be to hold the scheduled Aus/NZ ODI series in late January given that the NZ team would almost certainly have had to quarantine for two weeks upon arrival in Australia, maybe the day after the conclusion of their own Test series at most, and then quarantine for another two weeks upon return to NZ. Something that was openly and publicly explained by New Zealand in September:

New Zealand home international summer gets green light, but Australia limited-overs tour postponed (espncricinfo.com)

New Zealand's one-day series in Australia earlier this year was curtailed by the Covid-19 pandemic when the team had to fly home ahead of borders closing. The first match had been played behind closed doors at the SCG with two subsequent games called off.

"That 14-day managed isolation at both sides of the Tasman is a challenge," White said. "We've worked with Cricket Australia on that will be fulfilling our obligations the following year."

Apparently though NZ not wanting to cram an entire month gap in the middle of their cricket season where their best players are doing nothing just to play some ODIs is "financial mismanagement" by CA though.

So forgive me if I as a fan have an agenda of demanding accountability and results from the administration, at a time when people like Paine and Langer are the leaders and a first class batting average of 30 is good enough to earn you national selection.

This has absolutely nothing to do with specious claims of "financial mismanagement" and an unspecified proposal to move the BBL "somewhere" ignoring all the reasons everyone has put in this thread as to why that is impossible.

P.S : If the attendance to Test Cricket is predominantly white, then maybe... just maybe... selecting deserving minority players in Australian teams would be a good start towards broader inclusiveness, wonder why CA isn't doing that or are they just waiting for BBL to fix everything in Australian cricket?!

I've said plenty on this topic already, one that I actually care about beyond cheap gotchas.

 

[Smudge49]

What pre-existing financial ****-ups? Name them. Specifically. They had $54million positive equity in their 2019/20 financial statements, which already covers some pandemic months, these are available online if you care to look at them.

The pandemic hurt their revenue -- although I remain very sceptical of their claims from mid-2020 that were presaged on far more signifcant disruptions to the summer than took place -- because everyone's revenue got hit. You really have to be living under a rock to think that the pandemic would have not had any significant impact on revenue.

Or does CA's "financial mismanagement" also extend to the AFL: Pandemic-hit AFL axes 20% of workforce as losses mount - SportsPro Media , the NRL NRL to face savage job cuts | HRD Australia (hcamag.com) , the English Premier League Premier League clubs set for £500m collective loss due to coronavirus | Finances | The Guardian , the NFL NFL teams lost almost $4 billion in revenue due to coronavirus pandemic - CBS News , the NBA NBA revenue for 2019-20 season dropped 10% to $8.3 billion, sources say (espn.com.au) and every other professional sporting league in the world? You blame entirely vague, unspecified and frankly undocumented "financial **** ups" for CA's media claims of loss in revenue that have not actually been documented in any financial statement, and think the pandemic is just a lame excuse that explains nothing. Spare me.



You mean aside from the World T20, which was cancelled, the Asia Cup, which was postponed, the Women's World Cup, which was postponed, an English ODI tour of India, which was postponed, New Zealand's tour of Bangladesh, which was postponed, Pakistan and New Zealand tours of Ireland, the postponement of the England/SL series by almost a year, a New Zealand tour of SL which seems to have been canned, an Ireland vs Bangaldesh series to be held in England, a Bangladesh tour of SL, Indian and SL tours of Zimbabwe being flat out cancelled etc etc

Once again, you show an incredible willingness to just flat out ignore documented facts if they don't fit your agenda. The pandemic has thrown all sorts of scheduling curveballs this year, to ignore that difficulty is specious at best and flagrantly dishonest at worst. You throw all these cancelled tours into a single bucket as proof of entirely unspecified "financial mismanagement" without explaining (a) what the point of holding extremely complex T20 only tours logistically would be when those series are clearly meant principally as warm ups for a World T20 that is not happening and (b) what possible practical way there could be to hold the scheduled Aus/NZ ODI series in late January given that the NZ team would almost certainly have had to quarantine for two weeks upon arrival in Australia, maybe the day after the conclusion of their own Test series at most, and then quarantine for another two weeks upon return to NZ. Something that was openly and publicly explained by New Zealand in September:

New Zealand home international summer gets green light, but Australia limited-overs tour postponed (espncricinfo.com)



Apparently though NZ not wanting to cram an entire month gap in the middle of their cricket season where their best players are doing nothing just to play some ODIs is "financial mismanagement" by CA though.



This has absolutely nothing to do with specious claims of "financial mismanagement" and an unspecified proposal to move the BBL "somewhere" ignoring all the reasons everyone has put in this thread as to why that is impossible.



I've said plenty on this topic already, one that I actually care about beyond cheap gotchas.

Apparently your every argument basically puts up a case that, everything was going great till March of 2020 in Australian cricket and then all of a sudden Covid came and blew a hole in the whole financial structure.

Around 2017 there was a player uproar regarding fair pay and with Sutherland at helm then captain and vice-captain who were literally the face of this player movement, were wafted out of the equation like some war criminals, Sutherland soon after left office with Kevin Roberts taking his place.

Roberts too left office in a record short time of 18 months after being pummelled by broadcasters, player's association and sponsors alike.

The jist of it is, Covid hit every big or small cricketing nation everywhere but no big cricket board publicly went onto describe the depth of their financial woes quite like Cricket Australia, which was even to the surprise of both the contracted and former players.

Every other cricket board assessed their assumptive finances, in accordance to which their players too quietly took a pay cut and moved on, but in Australia head of the CEO rolled, broadcasters and state association threatened to sue the national board, but yet everything is supposedly fine.

After resumption of international travel, the cancelled tours that you mentioned were scrapped mainly to create a non-existent window in the last minute for the IPL or whereas some tours were considered not worth the trouble due to next to no financial uptick.

I have hated England' snobbish attitude towards the expansion of the game in the past, but in recent times not only have they organically embraced multiculturalism in their team but in the middle of the pandemic they were the first to restart cricket and reach out to the rest of cricketing world.

They pushed their inaugural season of franchise cricket to the next year, traveled to some of worst covid ravaged nations and they took everything in their stride despite the challenges.

Compared to this, India when they traveled to Australia for what predominantly was a tour for the TV rights and sponsor money, the players were rightly asked to abide to strict bio bubble protocols but at the same time they were surrounded by spectators creating scenarios where players were touching the same ball that went into the crowds, prompting a senior Indian player to say they were made to feel like zoo animals, all this because the management just couldn't let go off even miniscule amount of gate money in a test like the one we had in Brisbane.


If in this day and age Australian cricket board that has been one the highest revenue generating board in the last two decades, still has primitive issues ranging from player's association demanding privatisation of BBL and more influx of money for every cricket player in Australia hovering over their heads, then that hasn't happened because people at the top were doing a great job over all these years.

 

[Spark]

done with this. the relevant information is in publicly available financial statements, required to be accurate and audited by law. you can read them, and see that cricket australia's financial position - not their overall governance, not their management of the player pay deal fight, not their overall approach to grassroots cricket or selections, but the literal written fact of whether they were making money or not, was unquestionably sound before the pandemic and only at risk due to the fact that the india tour could be cancelled entirely. it was not. or you can continue roping in irrelevant nonsense to spin your conspiracy theory.

this was your claim:

I don't know how much you are aware of this, but even pre covid Cricket Australia's finances were in a ditch, they just said this publicly only after covid put a wrench in administering future games.

quite simply: this is either (a) complete and total nonsense or (b) cricket australia's board has flagrantly cooked the books of its own legally required financial statements as of 30 june 2020, and everyone involved should spend many years in jail for criminal fraud. as well as a whole bunch of accountants at PWC, who signed off on the report as accurate and proper. i'll take (a).

apparently now the fact that crowds were in, something every sporting code has done in australia for at least six months, is a sign of their utter mismanagement. i genuinely question how much you actually know about what life in australia has been like over the past year and the context in which cricket finds itself. the claim about the tours being scrapped for the ipl is also complete nonsense, as the bulk of those cancelled tours were scheduled between march and august. once again, checking these very basic, documented facts is something you should be doing before making these wild claims, not before.